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 I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric

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runreilly

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Thu Jan 26, 2017 11:48 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] I don't think it's suspicious that the Harris' have kept silent. In the immediate aftermath they feared for their lives and financial stability. They are probably following the recommendation of their attorneys, even now.

Eric Harris was a master liar who fooled everyone, even his military father. It's clear from Wayne's journal that he took parenting very seriously.

I just think it's highly possible they found something. But I agree with you, the public was out for blood. They would have wanted them burnt at the stake if they even admitted to finding a swiss army knife in Eric's bedroom. It was impossible for them to be forthcoming.
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sat Jan 28, 2017 6:13 am

I still find it hard to believe that all of that time would pass without finding something on accident, or at least something small. I mean did Eric really have his room under tight security? I wouldn't really think so; he was just clever with hiding spots. I would be willing to bet my life that something beyond general recognition was seen by his parents. It still blows my mind that they prepped for over a year and didn't slip up or have their rooms to get searched (minus the "your clips are in" close call).
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sat Jan 28, 2017 3:56 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
I still find it hard to believe that all of that time would pass without finding something on accident, or at least something small. I mean did Eric really have his room under tight security? I wouldn't really think so; he was just clever with hiding spots. I would be willing to bet my life that something beyond general recognition was seen by his parents. It still blows my mind that they prepped for over a year and didn't slip up or have their rooms to get searched (minus the "your clips are in" close call).
I think Eric's parents were searching his room after the van incident. I remember reading that Wayne found a pipe bomb in Eric's room and that he either disposed of or detonated an explosive device but I can't remember the details. There is also this short writing assignment where Eric mentioned that his parents took away all of his weapons. This was written before they bought any guns but it suggests that he's talking about some of his explosive experiments because he says he "spent a lot of time making them." I don't know if his parents ever returned those items. I think Wayne considered Eric's interest in explosives and weapons to be somewhat normal.
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sat Jan 28, 2017 7:43 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:

10:59 - Eric drops bomb off
11:00 - Dylan drops bomb off
11:00 - 11:10 - They drive to Clemente Park to gear up and put their trench coats on
11:10 - 4th period finishes and Brooks makes his way outside
11:12 (give or take a few minutes) - Eric pulls into the parking lot and Brooks sees him
11:12 - 11:15 (give or take a few minutes) - Brooks confronts Eric about missing class, Eric tells him to go home.
11:17 - Bombs fail to detonate
11:19 - The boys start shooting


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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Jan 29, 2017 2:00 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
I still find it hard to believe that all of that time would pass without finding something on accident, or at least something small. I mean did Eric really have his room under tight security? I wouldn't really think so; he was just clever with hiding spots. I would be willing to bet my life that something beyond general recognition was seen by his parents. It still blows my mind that they prepped for over a year and didn't slip up or have their rooms to get searched (minus the "your clips are in" close call).
I think Eric's parents were searching his room after the van incident. I remember reading that Wayne found a pipe bomb in Eric's room and that he either disposed of or detonated an explosive device but I can't remember the details. There is also this short writing assignment where Eric mentioned that his parents took away all of his weapons. This was written before they bought any guns but it suggests that he's talking about some of his explosive experiments because he says he "spent a lot of time making them." I don't know if his parents ever returned those items. I think Wayne considered Eric's interest in explosives and weapons to be somewhat normal.
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Oh yeah, I remember hearing somewhere Wayne physically made him detonate one of his pipe bombs in a field or something. That's right..
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Thu Feb 02, 2017 2:57 pm

The one question I've always had about Brooks Brown is whether he looked back as he was walking away from Eric's car toward Pierce Street.

If someone directed me away from the school under such bizarre conditions I would've looked back.
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Wed Mar 01, 2017 12:26 am

At least one witness confirmed Brooks talking with Eric minutes prior to the massacre:

11k-report
p1201-1300
page 55

Stephanie stated that she was out at the "smoking pit" at 11:15-11:20 AM and that she had started to walk to the cafeteria when she heard an explosion, but didn't think anything of it because she thought it was a senior prank. Stephanie then stated that she saw Eric Harris at the top of the stairs talking to Brooks Brown. I asked Stephanie what Eric was wearing and she stated that he was in his black trench coat and black pants. I asked Stephanie what happened next and she replied Brooks went down the stairs and Eric pulled out a "BIG" gun and started shooting into the main hall doors. I asked Stephanie if she was sure that she had seen Brooks Brown and not someone else and she stated that she was sure. I asked Stephanie what happened next and she stated that she was very scared and started running toward Clement Park, then once she got there she went home.
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Wed Mar 01, 2017 5:21 am

Brooks Brown was full of shit.
He made up he cussed him out and that Eric spared him
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Wed Mar 01, 2017 5:32 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
At least one witness confirmed Brooks talking with Eric minutes prior to the massacre:

11k-report
p1201-1300
page 55

Stephanie stated that she was out at the "smoking pit" at 11:15-11:20 AM and that she had started to walk to the cafeteria when she heard an explosion, but didn't think anything of it because she thought it was a senior prank.  Stephanie then stated that she saw Eric Harris at the top of the stairs talking to Brooks Brown.  I asked Stephanie what Eric was wearing and she stated that he was in his black trench coat and black pants.  I asked Stephanie what happened next and she replied Brooks went down the stairs and Eric pulled out a "BIG" gun and started shooting into the main hall doors.  I asked Stephanie if she was sure that she had seen Brooks Brown and not someone else and she stated that she was sure.  I asked Stephanie what happened next and she stated that she was very scared and started running toward Clement Park, then once she got there she went home.
Doesn't this contradict Brooks' statement that he spoke to Eric by his car in the senior parking lot?

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Wed Mar 01, 2017 11:15 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
At least one witness confirmed Brooks talking with Eric minutes prior to the massacre:

11k-report
p1201-1300
page 55

Stephanie stated that she was out at the "smoking pit" at 11:15-11:20 AM and that she had started to walk to the cafeteria when she heard an explosion, but didn't think anything of it because she thought it was a senior prank.  Stephanie then stated that she saw Eric Harris at the top of the stairs talking to Brooks Brown.  I asked Stephanie what Eric was wearing and she stated that he was in his black trench coat and black pants.  I asked Stephanie what happened next and she replied Brooks went down the stairs and Eric pulled out a "BIG" gun and started shooting into the main hall doors.  I asked Stephanie if she was sure that she had seen Brooks Brown and not someone else and she stated that she was sure.  I asked Stephanie what happened next and she stated that she was very scared and started running toward Clement Park, then once she got there she went home.

Doesn't this contradict Brooks' statement that he spoke to Eric by his car in the senior parking lot?

Was considering that as well, but "Stephanie's" comments aren't clear as to which "main hall" and "stairs" she's referencing. Could be either side of the school and more likely the senior side but fairly unclear.

It's more likely that an IO screwed up on a few details rather than "Stephanie" making up a story to cover for Brooks. Add in the confusion factor, she certainly wouldn't have heard an explosion then witnessed Brooks talking with Eric.

Then again these are kids that were traumatized, possibly wanting to be "involved" and taking rumor and projecting it into their eye witness accounts. I'll lean towards Brooks having encountered Eric, but we'll never really know for certain.
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sororityalpha
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Wed Mar 01, 2017 3:46 pm


More information here about Brooks:

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sat Mar 11, 2017 3:52 pm

I've always wanted to know Brooks reasoning for why the gun hand signals in the class photo. I mean 4 of them pulled the same hand gesture so they must have discussed it. I know during class photos when I was school the non serious photo was only taken minutes after the serious photo. Has he ever mentioned the background about that class photo? Sorry if it's been posted it asked before I'm new here and I'm a phone so hard to search. Personally I think brooks exaggerated the conversation with Eric if there was one or he knew a lot more then he's ever let on. I mean if that was me and a old friend who I wasn't really friends with said that (which again makes no sense seeing as they are posing together pulling gun gestures in a class photo which you wouldn't do with someone you weren't really friends with) to me I'd be a bit more curious as to what he's on about. Sigh hope that all makes sense.
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sat Mar 11, 2017 5:22 pm

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It's very uncanny, and it definitely does not look good for Brooks. He took a ton of heat in the community after the massacre and I'd bet this photo raised more than a few eyebrows. The problem with Brooks is that it's possible he knew a lot, but also also possible he didn't. He's innocent until proven guilty and there's virtually no evidence against his claims.

Eric and Dylan were counting down the days (approx. six weeks) until the massacre and I wouldn't be surprised if they pushed the idea to hold up fake guns in the minute or so before the "silly" class photo. Friends sitting nearby probably had very little time to think and just went along with it. E&D must have had a good laugh and been proud of this photo knowing what they had in the works.

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^ Some interesting findings in the class photo. This is all I could find.
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sat Mar 11, 2017 6:43 pm

Has brooks brown ever spoken about that photo or been asked? Otherwise it's just pure assumption either way, be interested to hear what he has to say about it and why they did that. I actually think he's unreliable with a tendancy to embellish fact after everything ive read and seen about him though.
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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:27 pm

I have questions about Brook's last exchange with Eric as well.

Brooks said that the last time he saw Eric, he(Brooks) gave Eric a hard time about missing a Chinese Philosophy test that morning. Eric then said a few things to Brooks, ultimately telling him to go home. Brooks did as he was told.

My question is, if Brooks had really been ragging on Eric for missing a class, why would he himself then go home and skip classes? It seems hypocritical to me. It makes me wonder if Brooks, noting Eric's absence on a test day and having heard rumors about 4/20, was actually questioning Eric's intentions towards the school that day. I guess I feel like Brooks did have an encounter with Eric when and where he said he did, but I question the actual content of the exchange. I hope that makes sense.

Also, where was the smoker's pit? Was it on campus, or just off? Was it that little alcove in the hillside created by the stairs that was on campus, but not really visible from the school?

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:32 pm

The smoker's pit was north of the school by the tennis courts.

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:48 pm

If the smoker's pit was north of the school, then why would Brooks have exited near the parking lot where Eric had parked? Sorry, I'm just trying to get my bearings. I know the library and commons faced West, and that was the location of Senior parking. It was my understanding that Eric parked in the Senior lot?

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:50 pm

Eric parked in the Junior Parking Lot, maybe this will help:

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:54 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Eric parked in the Junior Parking Lot, maybe this will help:

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Also, if I remember correctly, Brooks was already walking down Pierce Street when he saw Eric pulling into the junior lot so he walked back toward the school to speak to him.

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:54 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
If the smoker's pit was north of the school, then why would Brooks have exited near the parking lot where Eric had parked? Sorry, I'm just trying to get my bearings. I know the library and commons faced West, and that was the location of Senior parking. It was my understanding that Eric parked in the Senior lot?
Brooks wasn't going to the smoker's pit. He finished his class and was walking home for lunch. He was on his lunch break. Whether or not he intended to come back for the rest of his classes, I don't know. It seems that a lot of the kids at Columbine skipped classes. Brooks was getting on Eric's case because Eric skipped a class where they were taking a big test that was going to be a pretty big part of their grade for the class.

So it's a bit different to once in awhile ditch gym class, study hall or drama class than skipping a class where the test is going to really effect your grade.

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:05 pm

Okay. I had Eric and Dylan's car's locations switched, and the reason why Brooks was leaving, in my mind, was incorrect. Thanks for the help and for the correction.

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:08 pm

Just a few references about the smoker's pit to get an idea of the location...

Anthony 'Tony' Doty, Page 000777:

He stated he was on the north side of the building, near the smoking pit which is located near the tennis courts.

Page 001529:

From there, Garrett said that he walked to the "smoker's pit" near the tennis courts.

Page 001744:

They then passed the tennis courts area and hopped a fence going to an area known as the smoking pit.

Page 001899:

He said that from there he ran out the north doors by the smokers pit He said that he climbed the fence and ran to Clement park.

Page 002645:

She said that they then ran to an area referred to as the "smoker's pit" which is in Clement Park near
the tennis courts and batting cage.

Page 003249:

He and others ran to the smoker's pit, over the fence and into Clement Park.

Page 003582:

We ran down the hall, past the main office, down the counselor's hall and out the door to the smoker's pit. The smoker's pit has 3 fences. On the left is a baseball field, on the right there is a tennis court. In the center is a fence about 4 to 4 1/2 feet tail. Sarah was starting to get hysterical saying 'they're cornering us in, they're cornering us in." We jumped the fence and ran towards Clemet Park.

Page 003744:

He then turned north into the hall by the counseling offices and out the north side of the
building. He ran through the smoking pit, jumped the fence and ran north into Clement Park.

Page 005464:

Upon exiting the school. Christopher said that he ran northward to the fence line near the
"smoker's pit." From there, Christopher said that staff members told he and others to climb over the fence and continue running north into Clement Park, which he then did.

Page 005632:

He then exited the building through the art department; coming out of the building near the area called the smokers' pit. which he explained is a fenced area with trash cans near the tennis and basketball courts.


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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:25 pm

Not sure how to use the quote feature for just the parts I want, but, this part from SA was pretty helpful in pinpointing the area, with the help of some aerial photos.

"Page 003582:

We ran down the hall, past the main office, down the counselor's hall and out the door to the smoker's pit. The smoker's pit has 3 fences. On the left is a baseball field, on the right there is a tennis court. In the center is a fence about 4 to 4 1/2 feet tail."

Thanks SSCC for the info about Brooks walking down Pierce when he saw Eric. That helps a lot. Thanks to Jenn for a great discussion area. So many question I google about Columbine lead me to this board and its excellent discussions.

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:38 pm

Brooks Brown encountered Ryan Shwayder, Deanna Shaffer (Ryan Shwayder's girlfriend), and Matthew Houck on 4/20.

Page 007161:

BROWN told them he was going to "the smokers pit", when he saw HARRIS.

Page 006634:

Houck saw Brooks walking down Pierce Street when they first departed from the Columbine Parking lot @ about 11:12am. Encountered Brooks again by Walker Avenue some minutes later.

Page 007130:

Returning from McDonald's saw Brooks standing in the middle of Hoover Street. BROWN told them that he thought he heard shots after he left the school, and that he thought HARRIS was involved. BROWN described that he was outside, and HARRIS walked by him and told him to leave. Then BROWN said, "Oh, man. I think he had a duffel bag with him".

Page 007134:

11:48 Call was made to Matt HOUCK's father at his workplace.
11:51 Attempt by BROWN to call JCSD
11:52 Operator Assisted Call, Call by BROWN to ACSD
11:56 Operator Assisted Call, Call by BROWN to ACSD
12:10 Call by SHWAYDER to his residence
12:10 Call by Deanna SHAFFER to her residence
12:28 Call by Deanna SHAFFER to her residence
12:38 Call by SHWAYDER to his mother on another cell phone



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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:44 pm

From Brooks Brown's statements:

Page 010661:

Brown advised that after 4th hour class (approximately 1110 hrs) Brown went outside to have a cigarette. Brown was at the main entrance near the cafeteria. Harris drove up in Harris's vehicle and exited the car, Harris was alone and was carrying a light blue gym bag. Harris said to Brown. "Brooks I like you get out of here.".

Page 010670:

At approximately 11:10 a.m. BROWN left the school walking out the door just to the south of the main
entrance smoking a cigarette and walked down to Pierce Street. As he reached Pierce Street he observed, HARRIS pulling into the student parking lot and park his car in the lot. As soon as HARRIS parks his vehicle, BROWN meets him at the vehicle. [After talking with Eric] BROWN walked from HARRIS'S vehicle to Pierce Street, thinking about what HARRIS said. At that point he hears a loud bang and an explosion. BROWN runs down West Fair Drive knocking on doors for assistance.

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:58 pm

What would Brooks define as the "main entrance to the cafeteria". Also, where was the official main entrance of the school?

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 8:02 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
What would Brooks define as the "main entrance to the cafeteria". Also, where was the official main entrance of the school?
The main entrance to the school was at the top of the staircase. They called it the "west entrance".

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 8:21 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
What would Brooks define as the "main entrance to the cafeteria". Also, where was the official main entrance of the school?

The main entrance to the cafeteria would be the Southwest Entrance.

The East Entrance was by the Administration Offices, which would probably be the official Main Entrance.

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 8:38 pm

I sense some disagreement as to entrances.

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PostSubject: Re: I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric    Sun Mar 12, 2017 8:48 pm

You have all been so nice to me, and have answered my very specific questions. Please don't ban me for asking this question. Just moderate it and don't post it if you think it goes to far.

You guys have never answered my real question: Did Brooks Brown know more than he admits to? Were his actions really consistent with his story? Did his story change at all? I'm just asking. The reason I ask is because one of the killers asked the other in the library if they were still going through with the plan. I just wonder at the extent of the original plan.

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