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 Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful

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limpfisch



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PostSubject: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:58 am

I've seen a few discussions on here regarding whether releasing the basement tapes would have a negative impact, or no impact at all.

I think it would have a positive impact.

Ironically, I believe the material that already has been released is the most harmful. The CCTV footage is captivating, the library 911 call is frightening, the Eric in Columbine video is eerie, The journals are, at times, poignant, The play-acting videos are endearing. Condense this all into one and we have the foundations of a good movie, good entertainment, the characters being Eric and Dylan. And there is the problem, they are characters to us, not human beings. They are characters that fascinate us, intrigue us, and since we don't know them as people, they can be anything we want them to be. This is why Columbine is the most infamous.

The biggest mistake was releasing footage that served a purpose of entertainment, rather than information. What do we gain out of the CCTV footage? What do we gain out of the library call? Nothing but entertainment. This is widely the problem with media, it's entertainment disguised as meaningful information.
None of these should ever have been released.

The basement tapes however, are different. We would get to see them as human beings. We would no longer fill in the blanks with our imagination. We would get to see that they are immature, self-entitled, narcissistic kids having a whinge about life. Now that is not so appealing as the characters we have created, and thus Columbine would not have been what it is today, not because we would understand their psychology, but because they would now be annoying kids, not whatever our mind made them out to be.
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 8:59 am

I very much agree with what you have said and it is a great way to view this. It is very true. I am sure a lot of the fangirls out there that love Eric and Dylan and worship them have garnered that love from things like Radioactive clothing where you see them laughing having fun and making a scifi movie.

I don't know about anyone else really and this is tough to explain in words but sometimes I almost feel as if Eric and Dylan were older than they really were. It may not make a lot of sense but from what we have on them it really didn't seem like they were teens, but that they were a bit older.

The BT would really go to show them as young BOYS. Dylan was 17 for cripes sake! Spilling soda on the carpet and worrying about cleaning it up.... and the ever loved word "posturing". We could see them for what they truly were.

I mean we can watch a guy go around a Macy's and see him actually shoot people dead, but we can't watch two teenagers on film using the F word and talking about guns? I just don't get it.
You want copy cats you already have them. Google provides everything anyone would need. Except of course these darned tapes!

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shades
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 12:34 pm

I agree with you 10000000000000000000000%

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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 12:37 pm

The basement tapes is no different to me than the videos online on youtube and tumblr available of the sudden influx of russian teens that have been killing homeless people and taping it or shooting at people on snapchat and stuff. I can find and watch a video of an ACTUAL execution. How bad is it to see Eric and Dylan, the veterans of teen killers, making their home videos and just being dorks?

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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 12:45 pm

This has always been the most absurd to me. Why guard them so staunchly and secretly destroy them? As @shades has said, there are infinitely worse videos available all day long that show actual murders. There's absolutely no rhyme or reason, to me at least, that a stupid video of them talking and posturing would be treated as if it were a state secret or something.
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BlackandWhite

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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:11 pm

Does anyone know for sure if the tapes were actually destroyed? I've read different things but it would be nice knowing that there's still at least a chance they'll be released someday.
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:17 pm

WE HAVE DYLAN ROOF HOME VIDEOS PRACTISING SHOOTING AT HIS BACKYARD.

RELEASED TWO YEARS OR WHATEVER AFTER HIS SHOOTING

The Basement Tapes should have been released longggggg ago.

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Love
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:34 pm

I think that the original tapes had actually been destroyed. But there is a high probability that the copies were made, including digital. And these copies may be stored in the archives of the police or the FBI.

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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:37 pm

Yes, didn't Jeffco actually release a statement that they had been destroyed in 2011, I think? You can probably google it.
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spinvault

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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:42 pm

I think the basement tapes should have been released years ago. I do hope that one day they will be released as there are so many more graphic things available today, and it would show us how they interacted with each other. I especially would like to see the part where Dylan lets slip he is part Jewish and Eric's reaction, the tape where Dylan's prom tuxedo is hanging in the background, and the final goodbye minutes before going to Columbine on April 20. I think that would be very informative of their mindset and their interaction with each other. Maybe one day the basement tapes will be released as I think there were copies made.
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:45 pm

I think it's possible, maybe even probable, copies exist. But there's no official record of such copies. So unless someone gets disgruntled, a mega court order comes down or they're leaked (which I think would have happened if someone had a copy), they will gather dust.

Which, when you really think about it and put it in perspective, is ABSURD! There is no valid excuse, certainly not 18 years later. There can't be anything much more inflammatory on those stupid things than an adept 7 year old couldn't access easily online. I imagine we'd all shake our head and be disappointed if we could see them, simply because the intrigue and mystery that has been perpetrated for so long would be a huge let down. I'd still want to see them though Very Happy
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Love
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 1:54 pm

All videos carry important information about the motives, etc., which can be used to train psychologists, police officers and other professionals. This allows you to better understand the problem and to prevent such tragedies in the future. It would be very stupid to completely destroy the information on so resonant event. So I'm pretty sure copies have been made. Most likely, restricted access (confidential content). alien Only for secret agents. Cool

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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 2:25 pm

@Love, I agree wholeheartedly about the importance of the tapes. I think even parents, caregivers, teachers, etc. could benefit from the knowledge as well, to perhaps spot similarities and red flags in people in their lives. Imagine if they had been transparent and released everything....wow. I wonder if we would even congregate here today to discuss it. I suppose so, because of the many other cases we discuss, but I wonder if the intensity would be there.
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:19 pm

I read an article a while back where the author had viewed the tapes and thought they should be given to all new parents to educate them of what their children can become... Or something along those lines. I've need trying to find it without success so far.
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thedude11



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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Thu Jan 05, 2017 9:10 pm

To be honest, even though it's stupid and absurd, I can, to some extent, understand why they thought these tapes would inspire other kids into doing the same thing. Just think about how much these teens are impressionable and how easy it is to influence someone. The tapes are around 4 hours long and Eric and Dylan went into detail about what they were going to do, most importantly rationalizing the whole thing with every single excuse they could find. It can definitely be the tipping point for some depressed kid seeing the tapes and saying 'holy fuck, they're actually right!'.

But yes I do believe we should be allowed to see the tapes and keeping them locked up is ridiculous, as you all said we have hundreds of videos of these shooters shooting up malls, Dylann Roof videos and even those Russian kids who broadcasted their whole shootout with the police, live.

Or maybe... Nobody really cares, the authorities I mean, to release them since it's been so long ago... I'm certain they don't have those fears they had in '99 about copy-cats, they just don't care to release them.
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AestheticDeath



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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Sat Jan 14, 2017 1:43 am

People have raised the point that there might be something embarrassing to JeffCo on there such as something showing how they could have been caught. Even the "mission" descriptions from the website show that routine police patrols weren't noticing their illegal activity around town.

Or I think maybe a lot of it is just too much encouraging and inciting others to follow them.
Not that I think people would get the idea for the first time just from watching, but that Eric and Dylan in the video are instructing and telling people to copy them. I believe its known that at least some of that is definitely in there, right? Perhaps there's quite a bit of it.
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Scarletmoon
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:12 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
People have raised the point that there might be something embarrassing to JeffCo on there such as something showing how they could have been caught.  Even the "mission" descriptions from the website show that routine police patrols weren't noticing their illegal activity around town.

Or I think maybe a lot of it is just too much encouraging and inciting others to follow them.  
Not that I think people would get the idea for the first time just from watching, but that Eric and Dylan in the video are instructing and telling people to copy them.  I believe its known that at least some of that is definitely in there, right?  Perhaps there's quite a bit of it.

I'm sure there's a lot of that in the videos but it's not like they would release the tapes without edits, like everything else they released. They could mute the sound when they are instructing others to follow them, bleep out names and even pixelate things they didn't want the watcher to see. I believe, like many of you do, watching these tapes would take away the mystery and make everyone realized these were just two KIDS with mental health issues, who were at their wits end with life, felt like shit about themselves and wanted to be remembered after death since they felt invisible in life.

Seeing the tapes would make them less intriguing, we could all move on from this case because there would at that point be nothing left to see. I bet if these tapes were released with everything else, these kids wouldn't have this much attention 17 years later.
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Gonz

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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Sat Jan 21, 2017 3:28 pm

I agree, I don't really see what was the big deal with the basement tapes in order to keep them from the public, specially when the Fire Department video, the cafeteria surveillance tapes and all the school projects plus the Rampart video were already available for everybody to see. I mean, we are talking about videos of them using real guns, footage from the shooting itself and a tour around the bloody library, how could the basement tapes be worse than that?

I've always pictured them to be somewhat like the end segment in the Hitmen for Hire video, when they are screaming at the camera, and what they say had already been published by Time magazine and other media… and the decision to release the journals and all those drawings instead was even weirder, since you even can feel some kind of sympathy reading them…

I think Ted Mink decided not to release the basement tapes just because Eric and Dylan really wanted those videos to be seen by everyone, since he talked about not wanting them to get to YouTube at any cost and so and didn't think of anything else. Brian Rohrbough explained it well after the Virgnia Tech shooting.

Quote :
The father of one of the victims of the Columbine tragedy said he isn't surprised that the Virginia Tech gunman refers to the shooters responsible for his son's death as "martyrs."

"Because Jefferson County lied so much about what happened in Columbine, they raised the interest in these guys," Brian Rohrbough said Wednesday. He lost his son Daniel Rohrbough at Columbine. "When (officials) refused to release the basement videos, they created a cult following for these two guys."

Rohrbough has long sought the release of videos - the so-called basement tapes - and other documents created by Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris long before they went on their rampage at Columbine.

"If the videos were released, then parents, schools, law enforcement and counselors would have a benchmark to look for potential murderers, and the odds of stopping this before it happens would increase dramatically," Rohrbough said.

"The basement tapes and the documents give a very clear picture on how to identify these guys. There is so much information that would help identify these serious threats."

Rohrbough said he wasn't surprised that Virginia Tech gunman Cho Seung-Hui left behind video and documents explaining why he went on his rampage.

"That's one of the common traits (of a school murderer)," he said.

He said that until the truth about Columbine is told, school shootings will continue to occur.

"When you withhold the truth and you create mystery, imaginations and conspiracy theories run wild," he said.
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Tue Mar 07, 2017 2:24 am

I was just talking about this on another topic so I'll just copy and paste this here:
I completely understand where they're coming from with the want of not releasing the tapes. I just wish they'd release a redacted or edited version of them. There's already home video released that takes a small dip into Eric and Dylan's worlds that's edited, so why can't they do this to the tapes? Just cut out names, blur easily recognizable faces, and cut out the parts with any detailed bomb making bits.
As for "creating more violence and possible copycats", it's not like there isn't already literature, music, and movies with just as much fuel for people who take it seriously. Just take for example Eric/Dylan and NBK or crimes committed after the release of A Clockwork Orange. Banning it for years never stopped the inspired crimes. Book or movie wise.
I know they say the tapes are all destroyed, but I bet there's still transcripts at least from them or a copy floating around somewhere in the evidence locker of some court house or sitting in a box from someone the tape was passed along to during all the trials and court cases that happened afterwards.
Plus in the U.S., it feels as if shooter and invader drill/procedures change and update almost weekly. Any possible "tips and tricks" that might be on the tapes of how they did it is probably so outdated and useless with today's advances since 4/20. Which then brings up another point of mine. The tapes are educational! It can be used to help in schools for how possible school shooters are thinking and what they look and watch for. As well as some of the behaviors that allude to possible planned events from students. Yes, behaviorist and psychologists can write about it, but that's all text book stuff. When you get to see it happen in real life (or on tape as I mean here), you know exactly what you're dealing with.

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ColumbineIsInterestingAF
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PostSubject: Re: Not releasing the Basement Tapes was harmful   Wed Mar 08, 2017 12:40 am

It really is fucking bullshit that they won't release it. All it has done has made water on the mouths for them. Honestly, fuck JeffCo for that.
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