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afrrs

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PostSubject: Hesitation   Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:15 pm

i wonder if they hesitate and gave second thoughts to what they were planning to do.

they said they were planning this for at least 2 years .

do you think they had a serious talk about not doing nbk during those 2 years ?

hmmmm , in my opinion , they didnt hesitate , they wanted revenge and glory so much that there were no choices left for them .

i mean for e and d ( 18 and 17 yrs old ) to do what they did , they were really pissed off .


Last edited by afrrs on Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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myshame



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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:17 pm

Planning for two years? I was under the impression that it was just one year at most.
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:18 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Planning for two years? I was under the impression that it was just one year at most.

nah it was more , im sure of it .
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:27 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
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Planning for two years? I was under the impression that it was just one year at most.

nah it was more , im sure of it .

According to people who've seen the basement tapes, both killers agree that it's been at least 8 months of planning before the massacre.

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So I'm guessing it was under a year, after they got arrested for stealing electronics.
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:40 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Planning for two years? I was under the impression that it was just one year at most.

nah it was more , im sure of it .

According to people who've seen the basement tapes, both killers agree that it's been at least 8 months of planning before the massacre.

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So I'm guessing it was under a year, after they got arrested for stealing electronics.

this was already on their minds long time ago . I no mean planning per se , but thinking about doing it .

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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Mon Apr 03, 2017 6:15 pm

nope if anything their commitment only grew stronger as time went on and things started to line up such as them getting guns.

hell one of their favorite bands released an album titled Adios on the day of...how perfect was that?

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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:28 am

I don't think a serious talk about not doing it would have happened early in the planning stages because it probably didn't seem as real yet.

And I tend to think it probably didn't happen later either because one might no longer have confidence in the other if doubt was expressed.
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Tue Apr 04, 2017 2:49 am

They began to plan it just after the arrest. And how would they not deny it, but the example was the other school shootings. I don't think they had any remorse, which would force them to reconsider. If they really regretted it, they would not have to do it. Hey, these guys wanted to use broken glass and nails in their bombs to hurt the kids in school (very humane, isn't it). Most likely they just weren't sure until the very end to get them to carry out their plans. But when they got the weapons (and they were fascinated how easy it is to do), their imaginary plan became more real. So I think that their doubts were associated more with technical matters than with morality.

    Of course positive changes in their lives could get them to look at life more positively, more meaningfully, but this was supposed to be a really big changes. The irony is that they were "on the path of correction" after the theft, but it was all a sham. It makes me think that correction is required not only punishment, but also some positive changes in life. Of course, all individually...

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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Tue Apr 04, 2017 7:05 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
i wonder if they hesitate and gave second thoughts to what they were planning to do.

Both E&D had feelings and were very sensitive about human relationships. Eric cried remembering his childhood, Dylan was so deeply in love with a woman he liked that he wrote about her persistenly in his journals. I think that they put up a very strong façade to find the strength needed to do what they did; it was partly fueled by the hate and sadness they experienced, but it was also a bit about desperation and the inability to make the world a better place. A dangerous mixture of emotions where the good and the bad fought for a long time under the cover of a brutal killing spree. So yes, they were ready for their martyrdom but in my opinion they had a lot of second thoughts about it.
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Tue Apr 04, 2017 7:51 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
i wonder if they hesitate and gave second thoughts to what they were planning to do.

Both E&D had feelings and were very sensitive about human relationships. Eric cried remembering his childhood, Dylan was so deeply in love with a woman he liked that he wrote about her persistenly in his journals. I think that they put up a very strong façade to find the strength needed to do what they did; it was partly fueled by the hate and sadness they experienced, but it was also a bit about desperation and the inability to make the world a better place. A dangerous mixture of emotions where the good and the bad fought for a long time under the cover of a brutal killing spree. So yes, they were ready for their martyrdom but in my opinion they had a lot of second thoughts about it.

i agree , i think they didnt talk about it to each other , that way was like betraying each other , they wanna go together , dylan more than eric , i think eric would go alone for it even if dylan didnt want nbk .
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Tue Apr 04, 2017 8:51 am

I think it is not only possible but likely that sometime during the planning both boys had second thoughts about what they were doing. I think it was one thing to be drawing out blueprints or talking about it and then another thing entirely when they actually had gones in their hands. Eric said it himself once they got the guns it was real. They both though had seemed to have second plan thoughts. Dylan signed up for college and Eric was trying to get into the marines. One could argue that they both were just trying to seem normal and perhaps they were but I do think that they both were also trying to have a backup plan. In case something happened with NBK they would have something to move on to.

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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:05 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
I think it is not only possible but likely that sometime during the planning both boys had second thoughts about what they were doing.  I think it was one thing to be drawing out blueprints or talking about it and then another thing entirely when they actually had gones in their hands.  Eric said it himself once they got the guns it was real.  They both though had seemed to have second plan thoughts.  Dylan signed up for college and Eric was trying to get into the marines.  One could argue that they both were just trying to seem normal and perhaps they were but I do think that they both were also trying to have a backup plan.  In case something happened with NBK they would have something to move on to.

yeah , when they got their weapons it was a point of no return .
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Tue Apr 04, 2017 2:05 pm

They may have been planning for a long time and may have had second thoughts.

The last 6 months before 4/20 is when they really prepared.

Oct 22 1998 = 4 pipe bombs + 10 crickets

Oct 23 1998 = 6 pipe bombs

Oct 31 1998 = 3 pipe bombs

Nov 22 1998 = Gun Show: 2 shotguns, 1 Carbine, Ammunition, etc.

Dec 18 1998 = Order for 9 Magazines for Carbine

Dec 18 1998 = 4 crickets

Jan 3 1999 = 3 crickets

Jan 23 1999 = Manes sells TEC to Klebold (pp 008239-008249)

Feb 8 1999 = 9 crickets

Feb 17 1999 = 13 crickets

Mar 19 1999 = 5 pipe bombs

Mar 31 1999 = 7 pipe bombs

Apr 14 1999 = 14 super crickets

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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Tue Apr 04, 2017 6:10 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
They may have been planning for a long time and may have had second thoughts.

The last 6 months before 4/20 is when they really prepared.

Oct 22 1998 = 4 pipe bombs + 10 crickets

Oct 23 1998 = 6 pipe bombs

Oct 31 1998 = 3 pipe bombs

Nov 22 1998 = Gun Show: 2 shotguns, 1 Carbine, Ammunition, etc.

Dec 18 1998 = Order for 9 Magazines for Carbine

Dec 18 1998 = 4 crickets

Jan 3 1999 = 3 crickets

Jan 23 1999 = Manes sells TEC to Klebold (pp 008239-008249)

Feb 8 1999 = 9 crickets

Feb 17 1999 = 13 crickets

Mar 19 1999 = 5 pipe bombs

Mar 31 1999 = 7 pipe bombs

Apr 14 1999 = 14 super crickets

yeah , like eric said , he was not a pscyho , he felt remorse by doing nbk , so , thats somewhat a sign of hesitation .

furthermore , the guy cried , while saying good bye to his friends in the dashboard car camera video , which we dont have acess .

why they hidden that video ? it has nothing to do with planning or bombs or whatever , it was a just a good bye statement .
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Tue Apr 04, 2017 6:33 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
They may have been planning for a long time and may have had second thoughts.

The last 6 months before 4/20 is when they really prepared.

Oct 22 1998 = 4 pipe bombs + 10 crickets

Oct 23 1998 = 6 pipe bombs

Oct 31 1998 = 3 pipe bombs

Nov 22 1998 = Gun Show: 2 shotguns, 1 Carbine, Ammunition, etc.

Dec 18 1998 = Order for 9 Magazines for Carbine

Dec 18 1998 = 4 crickets

Jan 3 1999 = 3 crickets

Jan 23 1999 = Manes sells TEC to Klebold (pp 008239-008249)

Feb 8 1999 = 9 crickets

Feb 17 1999 = 13 crickets

Mar 19 1999 = 5 pipe bombs

Mar 31 1999 = 7 pipe bombs

Apr 14 1999 = 14 super crickets

yeah , like eric said , he was not a pscyho , he felt remorse by doing nbk , so , thats somewhat a sign of hesitation .

furthermore , the guy cried , while saying good bye to his friends in the dashboard car camera video , which we dont have acess .

why they hidden that video ? it has nothing to do with planning or bombs or whatever , it was a just a good bye statement .



I completely agree, I don't understand why they wouldn't at least release parts of the tapes that don't have anything to do with creating bombs and/or planning. Maybe JeffCo figured that it would make people sympathize too much with the killers?

That's all I can come up with on why the nonviolent parts of the tapes haven't come out.

Or maybe it's because the third shooter is present in the tapes and JeffCo is hiding it LOL LOL jk people haha
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Wed Apr 05, 2017 5:29 pm

I always wonder what conversations were had at their steak house meal, right before the shooting, that sue mentions in the book.  Did they talk about not related topics? did they for even a second talk about the possibility of calling it all off? did they joke further about how many they'd kill?

So many questions.
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Wed Apr 05, 2017 6:43 pm

As far as Sue not wanting the tapes released goes, I get the feeling they probably show Dylan in a different light than how she portrays him. Maybe the tapes show enough of Dylan being just as willing to participate in the shooting as Eric, instead of him just going along with everything. Maybe she doesn't want the public to hear him complaining about his parents, or his indifference to how his actions will affect them in contrast to Eric, painted as the remorseless one, acknowledging and addressing how devastated his parents will be and apologizing for it.
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myshame



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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Wed Apr 05, 2017 7:31 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
As far as Sue not wanting the tapes released goes, I get the feeling they probably show Dylan in a different light than how she portrays him. Maybe the tapes show enough of Dylan being just as willing to participate in the shooting as Eric, instead of him just going along with everything. Maybe she doesn't want the public to hear him complaining about his parents, or his indifference to how his actions will affect them in contrast to Eric, painted as the remorseless one, acknowledging and addressing how devastated his parents will be and apologizing for it.  

She pretty much says so in her book.
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:26 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:

She pretty much says so in her book.

Which part does she say in her book? I haven't read it in its entirety. Does she acknowledge that the tapes show that Dylan is equally as willing to carry out the shooting as Eric? B/c everything I've read says otherwise; she seems to hint that Dylan was strung along by Eric, that Eric brought this side out of him and Dylan was just performing for him.

I figured a big reason why she doesn't want the tapes to be released is b/c they prove that Dylan wasn't a follower but an equal. Not to mention it probably looked bad that "mastermind" Eric was the one showed semi-remorse by apologizing to his parents and crying over his long lost friends, and Dylan didn't.
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Wed Apr 05, 2017 10:37 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
They may have been planning for a long time and may have had second thoughts.

The last 6 months before 4/20 is when they really prepared.

Oct 22 1998 = 4 pipe bombs + 10 crickets

Oct 23 1998 = 6 pipe bombs

Oct 31 1998 = 3 pipe bombs

Nov 22 1998 = Gun Show: 2 shotguns, 1 Carbine, Ammunition, etc.

Dec 18 1998 = Order for 9 Magazines for Carbine

Dec 18 1998 = 4 crickets

Jan 3 1999 = 3 crickets

Jan 23 1999 = Manes sells TEC to Klebold (pp 008239-008249)

Feb 8 1999 = 9 crickets

Feb 17 1999 = 13 crickets

Mar 19 1999 = 5 pipe bombs

Mar 31 1999 = 7 pipe bombs

Apr 14 1999 = 14 super crickets

yeah , like eric said , he was not a pscyho , he felt remorse by doing nbk , so , thats somewhat a sign of hesitation .

furthermore , the guy cried , while saying good bye to his friends in the dashboard car camera video , which we dont have acess .

why they hidden that video ? it has nothing to do with planning or bombs or whatever , it was a just a good bye statement .

I believe that anyone that is about to make a life alternating decision is going to have some doubts.
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:26 am

All this s**t we see on the media , guys being blown up , shot at point blank range in cold blood and such , and they dont release the tapes , the tapes werent destroyed , they just said so so the denver police and the families could be left alone .

The tapes are inside a vault in some bank .

One day they will release them .

The tapes are a treasure , when hollywood wanna make a movie about it they will show the tapes to them for movie research and to study their emotions so the actors can do a better job portraying them .

I just wonder how much money will hollywood pay for the tapes .
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Thu Apr 06, 2017 8:45 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:

She pretty much says so in her book.

Which part does she say in her book? I haven't read it in its entirety. Does she acknowledge that the tapes show that Dylan is equally as willing to carry out the shooting as Eric? B/c everything I've read says otherwise; she seems to hint that Dylan was strung along by Eric, that Eric brought this side out of him and Dylan was just performing for him.

I figured a big reason why she doesn't want the tapes to be released is b/c they prove that Dylan wasn't a follower but an equal. Not to mention it probably looked bad that "mastermind" Eric was the one showed semi-remorse by apologizing to his parents and crying over his long lost friends, and Dylan didn't.

Taken from page 103-104 in her book:
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Thu Apr 06, 2017 1:31 pm

We know Eric did not have second thoughts because he opened fire as soon as the bombs fizzled.

Dylan may have had second thoughts, because he was hesitant at the start of the massacre and one witness heard one of the boys challenge the other, "We're still doing this right?"

Since Eric had fired off huge amounts of ammunition at this time and committed multiple homicides, that was most likely Eric confronting Dylan about evident second thoughts.
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PostSubject: Re: Hesitation   Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:15 pm

No going back from the first shot.

It was on
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