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 Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...

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ColumbineIsInterestingAF
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PostSubject: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Sun May 07, 2017 2:23 am

There have been eyewitness statements that right before eric and dylan killed themselves the two shouted out "one, two three!" right before killing themselves. But this is contradictory since it is believed that dylan klebold most likely killed himself after eric, that after eric died he threw a molotov cocktail on a table and than killed himself, this is believed because the molotov cocktail was found on top of brain matter on the table.

So does that mean that they had agreed to kill themselves together on three but dylan ended up not doing it on 3 and just eric did? It's almost as if he realized last second he wanted to wait around for just a little bit longer to do something (throw the molotov cocktail)
if thats the case, its kinda fucked up for him to have done that, they agreed to do it on 3 and he doesn't do it and eric does.

This also leads me to the possibility that maybe the brain matter on the table was in fact not erics but someone elses. it was most likely his though since the table was very close to there bodies, but could it have been patrick irelands since he was laying wounded nearby and he had been shot in the head? Are there any columbine victims in the library that were shot in the head? if so, that would lead to the possibility that it could have been theres, if they were close enough to the table. it may not be possible for it to have been patricks though because even though he got shot in the head and had brain damage im not sure if brain matter actually exited his skull.

This leads me to believe there is only one of two possible conclusions: 1) Eric and Dylan agreed to kill themselves on 3 and than dylan ended up not doing it on 3 and eric did, he walked away and threw a molotov and than came back and killed himself. OR. 2) The brain matter on the table was not erics and eric and dylan killed themselves together on 3.

So basically, if the brain matter on the table is definetely erics than dylan did back out on 3 and he watched his friend commit suicide.

Also, on another note, why do you think dylan threw the molotov cocktail before he commited suicide? Did he do it because he wanted it to burn there bodies after death or maybe he wanted it to burn down the whole library? No one will ever know for sure but what is your opinion on that?
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Sun May 07, 2017 5:41 am

I think that the evidence definitely leads us to the conclusion that Eric was dead before Dylan.

Eric's method of suicide, and proximity to the table means the brain matter can be considered his. Patrick Ireland who was close by but his head injury was not enough to leave brain matter behind.

The 1,2,3 myth. I fairly sure I'm correct in saying that this was a myth started by a Denver reporter in the days after the massacre. It was printed in the paper claiming a witness from the library as a source. For details police determined this was Patti Neilson. As she hadnt mentioned this when interviewed, police re-interviewed her. She stated she never heard this. Police then approached the reporter who admitted having embellished the facts somewhat
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Sun May 07, 2017 5:46 am

As far as I know, the one two three shoot thing was never confirmed.
The only person who said that was Patty Nielson, who later retracted her statement.
The countdown never happened.
It is kinda messed up to think that Dylan bluffed Eric into commiting suicide before him.
I think the molotov was meant to burn down the school after they were dead, since the bombs failed.

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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Sun May 07, 2017 7:09 am

I think eric did it first and dylan was hesitant in his final seconds.
I also feel the Molotov was too try burn his and Eric's body's after death.
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Sun May 07, 2017 7:52 am

They never counted to 3. No one heard them do that and the stories going around that they did are just rumors. Pattie Neilson has said herself that she never heard them count to 3. And besides, she wasn't under the desk in the Library anymore when they came back to kill themselves. She had moved to another nearby room and was hiding there. With the fire alarms blaring and her not even being in the same room anymore, I doubt she would have heard them even if they did count to 3 and besides, Eric had a shotgun in his mouth. I doubt he was counting.

The blood and brain matter on the table was definitely Eric's. Of course they tested it to find out whose DNA it was. They didn't just assume it was Eric's.

And yes, there's no question about it, Eric shot himself and was dead before Dylan shot himself. I don't know how long Dylan waited but he did not shot himself in unison with Eric. The suicide picture proves Eric was dead first. And also the fact that Eric's brain matter was underneath of the Molotov.

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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Sun May 07, 2017 11:21 am

I just wonder how the blood of Dylan and his baseball cap were on Eric's pants? It looks like he fell face down on Eric's leg, and then turned over on his back.

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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Sun May 07, 2017 11:44 am

Love wrote:
I just wonder how the blood of Dylan and his baseball cap were on Eric's pants? It looks like he fell face down on Eric's leg, and then turned over on his back.

He did. Dylan was kneeling in front of Eric. He shot himself in the left temple. He fell face forward onto Eric's left leg. The gun dropped in between his legs. When the police found him, they rolled him over onto his back to check him for explosives and weapons. The blood line across Dylan's chin proves he was face down with his head tilted slightly to the left. The gun that fell between his legs was now underneath of him and his right hand kind of landed on the gun when he was rolled onto his back and made it appear as if it were in his right hand. The position of Dylan's legs also confirm he was face down. His knees were bent and his feet crossed. He ended up in that position from being rolled over.

The proof that Eric was dead first is the shotgun he killed himself with was underneath of his leg. His leg did not fall down on top of the shotgun until after Eric shot himself and the gun flew under his leg and then his leg dropped onto the gun. Afterwards, Dylan shot himself and landed on Eric's leg that had dropped onto his shotgun after he was already dead. Therefore, the only conclusion is that Eric killed himself first and once he was dead, Dylan killed himself. The photos prove it.

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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Sun May 07, 2017 12:50 pm

What if Dylan himself turned over on his back? In his lungs was blood, which suggests that he was alive some time after the shot. And the stain of blood just around his head. Besides rigor mortis (in my opinion) would not allow his hands to be like on the photo, because the body frozen in a death pose. His body looks like it froze in this position initially. Hands Eric still bent, because he died instantly. On the face of Dylan also does not see any posthumous blemishes, which would be if he was lying face down. Of course I could be wrong... But what if they shot at the same time, but Dylan just died a little bit later Eric?

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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Mon May 08, 2017 11:39 am

Love wrote:
What if Dylan himself turned over on his back? In his lungs was blood, which suggests that he was alive some time after the shot. And the stain of blood just around his head. Besides rigor mortis (in my opinion) would not allow his hands to be like on the photo, because the body frozen in a death pose. His body looks like it froze in this position initially. Hands Eric still bent, because he died instantly. On the face of Dylan also does not see any posthumous blemishes, which would be if he was lying face down. Of course I could be wrong... But what if they shot at the same time, but Dylan just died a little bit later Eric?
The way that Eric's body was positioned before and after he died and the fact that Dylan landed on Eric's leg, it is impossible for them to have shot themselves in unison. There is no question about it, Eric was dead first. The one and only way Dylan could have landed face first on top of Eric's left leg was if Dylan fell down onto him after Eric was already dead because before he died, Eric's legs were bent up towards his chest. If they shot themselves in unison, Dylan would have landed on the floor, not on Eric. It took several seconds for Eric's legs to drop down onto the gun that flew out of his mouth and landed underneath his leg.

And Dylan's autopsy does prove that Dylan did not die immediately. He didn't actually die from the gunshot wound, he died from aspirating on his own blood. Basically he drown in his own blood. It would have hurt and it would have been burning while he was gasping for air and only breathing in blood and slowly dying of suffocation.

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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Mon May 08, 2017 3:59 pm

Jenn wrote:
It would have hurt and it would have been burning while he was gasping for air and only breathing in blood and slowly dying of suffocation.

How do you know that Dylan was conscious as Dylan suffocated?
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Tue May 09, 2017 4:33 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] he was still alive, yes, but most likely unconscious while he drowned in his own blood. I don't think it's likely to still be conscious right after you just shot yourself in the head and part of your brain exited your skull.
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Tue May 09, 2017 4:37 am

Why do you think Eric killed himself first and dylan second. I mean surely Eric must of known, when he got on the ground and was about to pull the trigger he must of saw dylan didn't have the gun to his head yet. I wonder if they said anything before and if dylan straight up watched Eric blow his head off. Wonder if Eric knew dylan was going to die after him and if dylan intentionally did it after him on purpose.
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Thu May 11, 2017 9:58 am

Jenn wrote:
It took several seconds for Eric's legs to drop down onto the gun that flew out of his mouth and landed underneath his leg.

One thing I would say about this--I don't think it took several seconds. This was a tremendous amount of force being applied very suddenly. Eric did not slide into his final position--the force of the blast drove the gun into the floor and flung Eric's body backward and his legs out simultaneously.

Dylan could have pulled his trigger a split second after Eric and still landed on top of him.
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Thu May 11, 2017 11:47 am

lasttrain wrote:
Jenn wrote:
It took several seconds for Eric's legs to drop down onto the gun that flew out of his mouth and landed underneath his leg.

One thing I would say about this--I don't think it took several seconds. This was a tremendous amount of force being applied very suddenly. Eric did not slide into his final position--the force of the blast drove the gun into the floor and flung Eric's body backward and his legs out simultaneously.

Dylan could have pulled his trigger a split second after Eric and still landed on top of him.

Fair point but Dylan threw a Molotov after Eric shot himself
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Thu May 11, 2017 12:12 pm

Smiggles94 wrote:
lasttrain wrote:
Jenn wrote:
It took several seconds for Eric's legs to drop down onto the gun that flew out of his mouth and landed underneath his leg.

One thing I would say about this--I don't think it took several seconds. This was a tremendous amount of force being applied very suddenly. Eric did not slide into his final position--the force of the blast drove the gun into the floor and flung Eric's body backward and his legs out simultaneously.

Dylan could have pulled his trigger a split second after Eric and still landed on top of him.

Fair point but Dylan threw a Molotov after Eric shot himself

No, the Molotov was placed on a table. Dylan placed it on a table and lit it, given them time to commit suicide as it burned down.

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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Thu May 11, 2017 2:18 pm

lasttrain wrote:
Smiggles94 wrote:
lasttrain wrote:
Jenn wrote:
It took several seconds for Eric's legs to drop down onto the gun that flew out of his mouth and landed underneath his leg.

One thing I would say about this--I don't think it took several seconds. This was a tremendous amount of force being applied very suddenly. Eric did not slide into his final position--the force of the blast drove the gun into the floor and flung Eric's body backward and his legs out simultaneously.

Dylan could have pulled his trigger a split second after Eric and still landed on top of him.

Fair point but Dylan threw a Molotov after Eric shot himself

No, the Molotov was placed on a table. Dylan placed it on a table and lit it, given them time to commit suicide as it burned down.

I don't think it would burn down it needs too smash doesn't it ? Also I heard that Eric's brain matter was on a table and the Molotov was smashed ontop of he's brain matter that would mean dylan would of had too have thrown it after Eric's death
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Thu May 11, 2017 5:31 pm

Smiggles94 wrote:
lasttrain wrote:
Smiggles94 wrote:
lasttrain wrote:
Jenn wrote:
It took several seconds for Eric's legs to drop down onto the gun that flew out of his mouth and landed underneath his leg.

One thing I would say about this--I don't think it took several seconds. This was a tremendous amount of force being applied very suddenly. Eric did not slide into his final position--the force of the blast drove the gun into the floor and flung Eric's body backward and his legs out simultaneously.

Dylan could have pulled his trigger a split second after Eric and still landed on top of him.

Fair point but Dylan threw a Molotov after Eric shot himself

No, the Molotov was placed on a table. Dylan placed it on a table and lit it, given them time to commit suicide as it burned down.

I don't think it would burn down it needs too smash doesn't it ? Also I heard that Eric's brain matter was on a table and the Molotov was smashed ontop of he's brain matter that would mean dylan would of had too have thrown it after Eric's death

No it's just some type of container full of oil with a wick in it. You light the wick and it burns down.

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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Thu May 11, 2017 5:48 pm

Smiggles94 wrote:
lasttrain wrote:
Smiggles94 wrote:
lasttrain wrote:
Jenn wrote:
It took several seconds for Eric's legs to drop down onto the gun that flew out of his mouth and landed underneath his leg.

One thing I would say about this--I don't think it took several seconds. This was a tremendous amount of force being applied very suddenly. Eric did not slide into his final position--the force of the blast drove the gun into the floor and flung Eric's body backward and his legs out simultaneously.

Dylan could have pulled his trigger a split second after Eric and still landed on top of him.

Fair point but Dylan threw a Molotov after Eric shot himself

No, the Molotov was placed on a table. Dylan placed it on a table and lit it, given them time to commit suicide as it burned down.

I don't think it would burn down it needs too smash doesn't it ? Also I heard that Eric's brain matter was on a table and the Molotov was smashed ontop of he's brain matter that would mean dylan would of had too have thrown it after Eric's death
Lasttrain is right about the Molotov. According to the investigators on the case, they believe that Dylan sat the Molotov on the table in an upright position and that it didn't actually cause a major fire or explosion and that the reason it was burning is just because Dylan did light it on fire but he never threw it. The contents inside of the glass bottle spilled all over the table after Eric was already dead because his brain and blood matter was underneath of the spilled liquid.

And Eric's brain matter had already started to harden, so we have no idea how long it took that liquid to spill over.

Eric was still dead first though. Eric died as soon as he shot himself. Dylan didn't. He drown on his blood which means he was still breathing after he shot himself. Or he was attempting to breathe anyways. All he was breathing in was blood.

I don't know exactly how long after Eric that Dylan shot himself. No one knows, but the suicide photos prove that Eric was dead first. Regardless of how long it took Eric to drop his legs onto the floor, Dylan could have never landed on top of him unless Eric was dead first. And Eric was dead first. Dylan was still breathing in his blood after Eric was dead.

Whether Dylan saw Eric dead, I don't know. I personally think that he did. Dylan was the one who used this entire massacre as a way to finally commit suicide because he couldn't bring himself to just go through with his own suicide alone. There's no doubt in my mind that Dylan waited to make sure Eric did it first. That's just the kind of mindset I believe Dylan had because if not, he would have just ended it on his own years ago.

And for the others in the thread asking me how I knew Dylan was conscious, I don't know that he was nor do I think that he was. I was just trying to describe what it would feel like to slowly drown. Because that is what happened to Dylan. He drown. He drown on blood. His own blood suffocated him to death and that is just a horrible way to die. Especially when you're not even under water. There was plenty of oxygen around him yet all his lungs were doing was breathing in blood. I cringe at just the thought of it. But I do think that Dylan was most likely unconscious but you never know. I've seen videos of men who put a shotgun in the mouth, survived and were awake the whole time. And apparently there was a witness that heard someone coughing and choking around that time. I guess it could have been Dylan. I guess each person has to decide for themselves whether they think he was awake for all of it or not. Personally, I'd like to think that he wasn't.

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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Thu May 11, 2017 7:22 pm

ColumbineIsInterestingAF wrote:
Why do you think Eric killed himself first and dylan second. I mean surely Eric must of known, when he got on the ground and was about to pull the trigger he must of saw dylan didn't have the gun to his head yet. I wonder if they said anything before and if dylan straight up watched Eric blow his head off. Wonder if Eric knew dylan was going to die after him and if dylan intentionally did it after him on purpose.

I think Eric had already resigned + his nose was probably hurting like hell so he didn't act like a bitch and just did it.

Dylan may have had second thoughts about killing himself but ultimately realized he had went to far to go back now.
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Thu May 11, 2017 10:44 pm

W.A.R. wrote:
ColumbineIsInterestingAF wrote:
Why do you think Eric killed himself first and dylan second. I mean surely Eric must of known, when he got on the ground and was about to pull the trigger he must of saw dylan didn't have the gun to his head yet. I wonder if they said anything before and if dylan straight up watched Eric blow his head off. Wonder if Eric knew dylan was going to die after him and if dylan intentionally did it after him on purpose.

I think Eric had already resigned + his nose was probably hurting like hell so he didn't act like a bitch and just did it.

Dylan may have had second thoughts about killing himself but ultimately realized he had went to far to go back now.

That makes a lot of sense, @W.A.R. I would imagine Eric was in quite a lot of pain after the adrenaline wore off and just wanted to get it over with. I heard a broken nose is one of the worst pains you can experience next to shattering your knee cap. It is your face, after all. Dylan choked on his blood but I bet all Eric could taste and smell BEFORE he died was his own blood.

Isn't that the most insane irony ever? They shed the blood of others but "drowned" in a sense, on their own. That is strangely satisfying to me.

Their final moments really drive me crazy because I wonder if they experienced absolute clarity in view of death - if the gravity of what they did finally crashed onto their shoulders. Did either of them think, "Wow, we really went through with it. I threw my entire life away for this. It could have been different, I could have given things a chance. What was I even angry about? I'll never see my parents or anyone I love ever again because I did this. This isn't what I wanted..."

Some part of me seriously doubts it, the other wonders endlessly.
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PostSubject: Re: Eric and Dylan shouted out one, two, three! in unison yet...   Sat May 13, 2017 2:30 pm

I always thought that the myth of ''1,2,3''was created after zero day
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