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 If E & D didn't die

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Screamingophelia
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PostSubject: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:56 pm

If they were captured before they killed themselves and there was a trial, I wonder what evidence would be open to the public? More crime scene photos? Basement Tapes? Would the trial be covered like OJ Simpsons was? I assume we'd hear more from the Harris's.

I think the boys would try to act like perfect gentlemen in court to be honest, I doubt there'd be shenanigans like I think TJ Lane?
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 3:00 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
If they were captured before they killed themselves and there was a trial, I wonder what evidence would be open to the public? More crime scene photos? Basement Tapes? Would the trial be covered like OJ Simpsons was? I assume we'd hear more from the Harris's.

I think the boys would try to  act like perfect gentlemen in court to be honest, I doubt there'd be shenanigans like I think TJ Lane?

I think Eric would have gotten a kick out of his trail possibly getting more media coverage then OJ's, since he seemed to hate that being in the news all the time.

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Screamingophelia
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 3:09 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
If they were captured before they killed themselves and there was a trial, I wonder what evidence would be open to the public? More crime scene photos? Basement Tapes? Would the trial be covered like OJ Simpsons was? I assume we'd hear more from the Harris's.

I think the boys would try to  act like perfect gentlemen in court to be honest, I doubt there'd be shenanigans like I think TJ Lane?

I think Eric would have gotten a kick out of his trail possibly getting more media coverage then OJ's, since he seemed to hate that being in the news all the time.

Me too.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:03 pm

One things for sure...TBT would have been released or leaked. They would have been played in court
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:06 pm

If they'd have been dressed up in orange and dragged out by police and booed by everybody, then they'd realize their dream of topping Timothy McVeigh after all. Or at least equalling him.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:07 pm

I often wonder if they had lived what the "fandom" would be like and how different it might be. I honestly think them dying added to the mystery of it and gives them more fan girls today.
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PostSubject: huh   Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:14 pm

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I often wonder if they had lived what the "fandom" would be like and how different it might be. I honestly think them dying added to the mystery of it and gives them more fan girls today.

Certainly it does. Somebody dies, they're "lost forever," and some girl's wish to have "saved" them can never come true.

Think how badly people want Nick Drake live footage to turn up, because it never happened during his lifetime that they know of. And if they did have it it probably wouldn't really be anything special.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:17 pm

It's really sad that some girls obsess over trying to "save" them. It shows you how lost some adolescents truly are.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:37 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
I often wonder if they had lived what the "fandom" would be like and how different it might be. I honestly think them dying added to the mystery of it and gives them more fan girls today.

I wonder that as well! I think there's a mystique with them since they committed suicide.

There would probably be girls writing them but who knows if E and D would answer?

I doubt a soft spoken red faced Dylan in an orange jump suit would resonate as much as the smirking kid in a black trench coat who writes love notes in his journal.




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Screamingophelia
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:45 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
It's really sad that some girls obsess over trying to "save" them. It shows you how lost some adolescents truly are.


Also Eric and Dylan DID have people who cared about them. What do these girls think they could do to save them?? Dylan had more people than Eric yes, but you can't love someone better.

Have fun dealing with Dylan's issues... I'm not unsympathetic towards Dylan either, I admit junior year Dylan was pretty close to handsome but he'd be an awful boyfriend until he grew up and got help.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:48 pm

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[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
It's really sad that some girls obsess over trying to "save" them. It shows you how lost some adolescents truly are.


Also Eric and Dylan DID have people who cared about them. What do these girls think they could do to save them?? Dylan had more people than Eric yes, but you can't love someone better.

Have fun dealing with Dylan's issues... I'm not unsympathetic towards Dylan either, I admit junior year Dylan was pretty close to handsome but he'd be an awful boyfriend until he grew up and got help.

Exactly. They idealize them and think they could have helped. But think about it- if you had been in school with them you wouldn't have the luxury of reading their journals and knowing their true feelings. You would be guessing as much as anyone else.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:52 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
It's really sad that some girls obsess over trying to "save" them. It shows you how lost some adolescents truly are.


Also Eric and Dylan DID have people who cared about them. What do these girls think they could do to save them?? Dylan had more people than Eric yes, but you can't love someone better.

Have fun dealing with Dylan's issues... I'm not unsympathetic towards Dylan either, I admit junior year Dylan was pretty close to handsome but he'd be an awful boyfriend until he grew up and got help.

Exactly. They idealize them and think they could have helped. But think about it- if you had been in school with them you wouldn't have the luxury of reading their journals and knowing their true feelings. You would be guessing as much as anyone else.

You'd see what everyone else saw and even if you were friends with them and maybe even "liked" them you'd still have to get them to talk etc.. and they'd never let you in. Dylan was a great listener because he didn't want to talk. It's easier to be goofy, good listener, buddy Dylan.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:55 pm

Exactly. Dylan didn't tell people how he felt.

If he were still alive today, I really don't know if he would have shared his feelings.

Almost sadder to me would be if both E&D survived but were never allowed to communicate again. (Call me weird or whatever but I find that idea sad)
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:41 pm

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Almost sadder to me would be if both E&D survived but were never allowed to communicate again. (Call me weird or whatever but I find that idea sad)

I agree with you and have had the exact same thought, but if the van incident is anything to go by I kinda suspect that one or both would eventually turn on the other in court, which kinda ruins the often 'romanticized' "I'm going to die with you if you kill with me"-thing for me Razz
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:53 pm

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Exactly. Dylan didn't tell people how he felt.

If he were still alive today, I really don't know if he would have shared his feelings.

Almost sadder to me would be if both E&D survived but were never allowed to communicate again. (Call me weird or whatever but I find that idea sad)

It's not weird at all. When I had the realization that the right before Eric killed himself was the last time they would talk to each other or see each other alive made me sad. I would have wanted to hear what they had to say. I think Eric would have stayed alive longer (he may be in prison to this day) but Dylan would have found a way to kill himself.

To be fair, it will forever get me when I read that Lauren put her arm around Val when the shooting started and told her it was going to be okay.

I think there's a reason the person who made the memorial crosses made ones for Eric and Dylan.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 6:56 pm

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Almost sadder to me would be if both E&D survived but were never allowed to communicate again. (Call me weird or whatever but I find that idea sad)

I agree with you and have had the exact same thought, but if the van incident is anything to go by I kinda suspect that one or both would eventually turn on the other in court, which kinda ruins the often 'romanticized' "I'm going to die with you if you kill with me"-thing for me Razz

I do not disagree with you. Eric was quick to say the van break in was Dylan's idea. I feel like there is some weird cosmic payback now since we know Dylan wasn't the innocent follower .. so sure blame Dylan for the break in, you're going to be blamed for the whole massacre.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Tue Jan 02, 2018 9:29 pm

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I think Eric would have gotten a kick out of his trail possibly getting more media coverage then OJ's, since he seemed to hate that being in the news all the time.

I feel that this was in part motivated by jealousy. Eric wanted the upcoming massacre to be the most infamous crime in American history and yet here was OJ getting loads upon loads of media attention for only two murders. He might've feared OJ would end up overshadowing NBK.

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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:02 am

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Almost sadder to me would be if both E&D survived but were never allowed to communicate again. (Call me weird or whatever but I find that idea sad)

I agree with you and have had the exact same thought, but if the van incident is anything to go by I kinda suspect that one or both would eventually turn on the other in court, which kinda ruins the often 'romanticized' "I'm going to die with you if you kill with me"-thing for me Razz


I think they likely would have turned on each other as well. Hell Eric was fast to say that the van break in was ALL Dylan's idea. While Dylan said it was both their idea, that they thought about it at the same time.

So its not a stretch to think Eric might have been singing like a Canary trying to save his own ass.

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Life asked Death, "Why do people love me, but hate you?"  Death responded, "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am a painful truth."

                                                                                                                                                                                      -Unknown

My heart has been so badly broken and mended again. Stronger than ever because of its dreadful wounds that I thought it could never break again. But at the sight of his face, at the knowledge that he was taking his leave forever, beyond death, it shattered.
                                                                                                                                                                                -Jeanne Kalogridis

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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:11 am

I wonder if one of them trying to pin it on the other may have backfired or been seen as manipulative.

Guess it would depend on what kind of legal representation they had. If both boys had lived, I imagine there would be some contention between the Harris and Klebold families.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:09 am

I wonder if they would have had the same lawyer?

I imagine they'd get life in prison and the trial would just be to see if they would be the death penalty?
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:45 am

I think they would have had the lawyers that their parents called on 4/20. They were anticipating they would have to represent them if they had lived through the shooting.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:47 am

Wonder if either of them would have tried to plead insanity? Dylan was technically a minor but I think it has been speculated on the forum that he would have been tried as an adult.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:52 am

They may have played up Dylan being depressed and under Eric's influence and that Eric's medicine made him not realize the extent of his actions
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:55 am

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Wonder if either of them would have tried to plead insanity? Dylan was technically a minor but I think it has been speculated on the forum that he would have been tried as an adult.

I think the insanity issue wouldn't have been given much thought even if they had tried. Eric and Dylan were known to be smart, and somewhat manipulative.

I agree with Screaming. Dylan would have given them a slight pause with his sometimes off the wall writings, but ultimately I just don't see a judge/jury actually buying into that for very long if they looked at the whole picture.

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Life asked Death, "Why do people love me, but hate you?"  Death responded, "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am a painful truth."

                                                                                                                                                                                      -Unknown

My heart has been so badly broken and mended again. Stronger than ever because of its dreadful wounds that I thought it could never break again. But at the sight of his face, at the knowledge that he was taking his leave forever, beyond death, it shattered.
                                                                                                                                                                                -Jeanne Kalogridis

I have love in me the likes of which you can scarcely imagine and rage the likes of which you would not believe. If I cannot satisfy the one, I will indulge the other.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:14 am

I don't think they would have had much sympathy at all. I think they would have gotten life in prison though, not the death penalty.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:23 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Wonder if either of them would have tried to plead insanity? Dylan was technically a minor but I think it has been speculated on the forum that he would have been tried as an adult.

I think the insanity issue wouldn't have been given much thought even if they had tried. Eric and Dylan were known to be smart, and somewhat manipulative.

I agree with Screaming. Dylan would have given them a slight pause with his sometimes off the wall writings, but ultimately I just don't see a judge/jury actually buying into that for very long if they looked at the whole picture.

I also don't see the insanity defense working when you planned it for over a year.

I don't really see either of the boys lasting in prison.

Maybe if Eric bulked up....
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:12 am

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I don't really see either of the boys lasting in prison. 

Protective Custody. That's what they placed James Holmes and Dylann Roof in.

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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:39 pm

Eric may learn as well that his friendship with Dylan wasn't as strong as he thought? That would probably make him pretty sad and angry. I listened to Sue's to ted talk again today and she called Eric controlling and now im hindsight seems to see the issues with their friendship.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:58 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Eric may learn as well that his friendship with Dylan wasn't as strong as he thought? That would probably make him pretty sad and angry. I listened to Sue's to ted talk again today and she called Eric controlling and now im hindsight seems to see the issues with their friendship.

I'm kind of torn about what Sue says sometimes.
On one hand she's Dylan's Mom, so she does know more than every single one of us. On the other hand I can't help but take anything she says about Eric with a grain of salt precisely because Dylan is her son and I feel like she's still holding onto the Eric the evil mastermind manipulator extraordinaire, Dylan the depressed follower narrative despite her saying she's not.
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PostSubject: Re: If E & D didn't die    Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:01 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
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Eric may learn as well that his friendship with Dylan wasn't as strong as he thought? That would probably make him pretty sad and angry. I listened to Sue's to ted talk again today and she called Eric controlling and now im hindsight seems to see the issues with their friendship.

I'm kind of torn about what Sue says sometimes.
On one hand she's Dylan's Mom, so she does know more than any single one of us. On the other hand I can't help but take anything she says about Eric with a grain of salt precisely because Dylan is her son and I feel like she's still holding onto the Eric the evil mastermind manipulator extraordinaire, Dylan the depressed follower narrative despite her saying she's not.


I can agree with this. Also I am sure that Sue herself is sometimes torn and confused about the way she feels when faced with certain facts of the case and Dylan's obvious involvement.

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Life asked Death, "Why do people love me, but hate you?"  Death responded, "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am a painful truth."

                                                                                                                                                                                      -Unknown

My heart has been so badly broken and mended again. Stronger than ever because of its dreadful wounds that I thought it could never break again. But at the sight of his face, at the knowledge that he was taking his leave forever, beyond death, it shattered.
                                                                                                                                                                                -Jeanne Kalogridis

I have love in me the likes of which you can scarcely imagine and rage the likes of which you would not believe. If I cannot satisfy the one, I will indulge the other.
           -Mary Shelley's Frankenstein
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