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 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81

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ShadowedGoddess
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:08 am

You can imagine his hurt and shock when he found out they had basically used him.

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''I have been astonished that men could die martyrs for religion—I have shuddered at it. I shudder no more—I could be martyred for my religion—Love is my religion—I could die for that.''                                                                                                                                      
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“Love never dies a natural death. It dies because we don't know how to replenish its source. It dies of blindness and errors and betrayals. It dies of illness and wounds; it dies of weariness, of witherings, of tarnishings.”

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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:10 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
You can imagine his hurt and shock when he found out they had basically used him.

Oh yea, devestating Sad

It probably contributed to him making threats the next year.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:44 am

Np [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]!

I agree I think Eric V. wanted to be part of their "inner circle". People said they just used him as someone to film them for their projects :/
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:55 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
It seemed likely that Erik V. had a man crush on Eric. Not in a romantic way, but he looked up to him, somewhat idolized him. This is why I think Erik was so devastated after Columbine. He thought he was their friend, so in a way he felt betrayed that he hadn't been asked to participate. Which is likely why he got into trouble for saying he was going to finish what they had started some months later.  

He must've felt rather insulted to know that they went to Chris Morris to recruit for a third shooter and never even considered him. 

Of course by the time they started looking for a third man it was only a month until the massacre. So really it would just create more problems for them if they kept trying to find a third guy.

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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:56 am

Wait is there concrete evidence that they went to Chris M. to see if he wanted to join them?!
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 12:41 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Wait is there concrete evidence that they went to Chris M. to see if he wanted to join them?!

I heard that they asked Chris if he knew how to make napalm and he said no.

I'm Cullen's book I think they talk about a party with Zach Heckler but who knows? That book has a few flaws.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 12:48 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
That book has a few flaws.


That's putting in mildly! Haha

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''I have been astonished that men could die martyrs for religion—I have shuddered at it. I shudder no more—I could be martyred for my religion—Love is my religion—I could die for that.''                                                                                                                                      
                                                        -John Keats (1795-1821)

“Love never dies a natural death. It dies because we don't know how to replenish its source. It dies of blindness and errors and betrayals. It dies of illness and wounds; it dies of weariness, of witherings, of tarnishings.”

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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 1:15 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
That book has a few flaws.


That's putting in mildly! Haha

lol!

And the ocean is a little wet....
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 1:21 pm

TBH the fact that Chris got kicked out and was used to try to bait Philip Duran into confessing makes me think he knew a lot more. I do think Robyn should've been punished, but those guys knew that Eric and Dylan were in high school and they sold them a gun anyway and they even said when they were shooting the boys were making them uneasy. That pisses me off.

Then again Nate pretty much get kicked out of his house and him and his father had to hightail it out of town because his mother went a little nuts, from my understanding. I do genuinely believe Nate had no idea what was going on.

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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Sun Jan 07, 2018 1:33 pm

Adding on, I'd like to mention Chris Morris's ABC interview from 2000. He mentions that Dylan had made a comment about sitting on the soccer field and shooting at the school. Whether or not this was some kind of proposal, to see if Chris would take the bait, I don't know. It's possible.

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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:35 am

Eric constantly wrote and talked about in the final tapes that there would be so much dramatic irony and double meanings. He predicted that people would find stuff like this.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:52 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Eric constantly wrote and talked about in the final tapes that there would be so much dramatic irony and double meanings. He predicted that people would find stuff like this.

Dylan said they'd have "followers" too.

They weren't wrong.

People are still trying to get into their heads.

Though Brooks once commented that they're getting into ours...
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:54 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:


Though Brooks once commented that they're getting into ours...


Which is EXACTLY what they wanted and hoped for.

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''I have been astonished that men could die martyrs for religion—I have shuddered at it. I shudder no more—I could be martyred for my religion—Love is my religion—I could die for that.''                                                                                                                                      
                                                        -John Keats (1795-1821)

“Love never dies a natural death. It dies because we don't know how to replenish its source. It dies of blindness and errors and betrayals. It dies of illness and wounds; it dies of weariness, of witherings, of tarnishings.”

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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Mon Jan 08, 2018 10:58 am

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[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:


Though Brooks once commented that they're getting into ours...


Which is EXACTLY what they wanted and hoped for.

They got what they wanted.

So did Rachel though in a way. She wanted to start a chain reaction too, but of kindness.

Awful movie aside, a lot of people do use Rachel's message for good now. Because if one remembers Rachel was a regular girl not a martyr you could see how people would look up to her.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:08 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Eric constantly wrote and talked about in the final tapes that there would be so much dramatic irony and double meanings. He predicted that people would find stuff like this.

Hell, he even criticized Shakespeare on his apparent lack of "double meanings" in King Lear.

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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:10 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Eric constantly wrote and talked about in the final tapes that there would be so much dramatic irony and double meanings. He predicted that people would find stuff like this.

Hell, he even criticized Shakespeare on his apparent lack of "double meanings" in King Lear.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

I have to tell you I would've thoroughly enjoyed Eric in class. Nobody ever wanted to have any discussions in English class it was such a bore.

Got a massive kick out of adios being released on 420.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:12 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Eric constantly wrote and talked about in the final tapes that there would be so much dramatic irony and double meanings. He predicted that people would find stuff like this.

Hell, he even criticized Shakespeare on his apparent lack of "double meanings" in King Lear.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

I have to tell you I would've thoroughly enjoyed Eric in class. Nobody ever wanted to have any discussions in English class it was such a bore.

Got a massive kick out of adios being released on 420.

That, to me, is my favorite coincidence...I know that might sound weird to say.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Mon Jan 08, 2018 4:07 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Wait is there concrete evidence that they went to Chris M. to see if he wanted to join them?!
There's no evidence that they asked him directly as far as I know but Chris told the police that about two weeks before the attack, during the bowling class, Eric said, "Wouldn't it be fun to kill all the jocks?" Chris didn't think he was serious but Eric made other comments about blowing up the school, like saying that they should put bombs on the school's generators and that should blow it up. Chris wasn't interested and he just started talking to someone else. (10841)
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:08 am

With time SO close to NBK I just don't think they were shopping for a 3rd shooter. scratch The plan was pretty much set and they were watching the days tick by.

BUT I do think Eric got a kick out of talking about what was coming in a way. He liked to foreshadow any aspect of NBK.

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''I have been astonished that men could die martyrs for religion—I have shuddered at it. I shudder no more—I could be martyred for my religion—Love is my religion—I could die for that.''                                                                                                                                      
                                                        -John Keats (1795-1821)

“Love never dies a natural death. It dies because we don't know how to replenish its source. It dies of blindness and errors and betrayals. It dies of illness and wounds; it dies of weariness, of witherings, of tarnishings.”

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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:20 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
With time SO close to NBK I just don't think they were shopping for a 3rd shooter. scratch  The plan was pretty much set and they were watching the days tick by.

BUT I do think Eric got a kick out of talking about what was coming in a way. He liked to foreshadow any aspect of NBK.

According to a lot of their friends it did seem like it was Eric and Dylan against the world the last couple of months before. If I had to venture a guess, after the van incident they probably were not actively looking for a third.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:36 am

I think it's clear that they both thought they were the only ones with "awareness". I don't see them mentioning anyone else in journal entries saying that they were above the zombies. I think especially towards the end they knew it could only be the two of them.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:40 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
I think it's clear that they both thought they were the only ones with "awareness". I don't see them mentioning anyone else in journal entries saying that they were above the zombies. I think especially towards the end they knew it could only be the two of them.

Yea especially with their whole "to all of you coolios out there alive, sorry we hurt you or your friends" they were so far gone.

I can't imagine the hurt people like Robyn, Nate, Zach and Devon felt... they knew people they cared about could have died but they didn't care...
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:18 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
I think it's clear that they both thought they were the only ones with "awareness". I don't see them mentioning anyone else in journal entries saying that they were above the zombies. I think especially towards the end they knew it could only be the two of them.

Yea especially with their whole "to all of you coolios out there alive, sorry we hurt you or your friends" they were so far gone.

I can't imagine the hurt people like Robyn, Nate, Zach and Devon felt... they knew people they cared about could have died but they didn't care...

That would fuck with my trust issues for life.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:24 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
I think it's clear that they both thought they were the only ones with "awareness". I don't see them mentioning anyone else in journal entries saying that they were above the zombies. I think especially towards the end they knew it could only be the two of them.

Yea especially with their whole "to all of you coolios out there alive, sorry we hurt you or your friends" they were so far gone.

I can't imagine the hurt people like Robyn, Nate, Zach and Devon felt... they knew people they cared about could have died but they didn't care...

That would fuck with my trust issues for life.


To true! It would make you question everything about a person. Every single action, every single word. You would constantly have it in the back of your mind.

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''I have been astonished that men could die martyrs for religion—I have shuddered at it. I shudder no more—I could be martyred for my religion—Love is my religion—I could die for that.''                                                                                                                                      
                                                        -John Keats (1795-1821)

“Love never dies a natural death. It dies because we don't know how to replenish its source. It dies of blindness and errors and betrayals. It dies of illness and wounds; it dies of weariness, of witherings, of tarnishings.”

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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:45 pm

Not to mention Devon again LOL, but if I remember correctly, the spoken word piece I shared via youtube here on the board, she talks about that. How it has screwed with her intimacy issues.

Nate, Brooks and Robyn are parents, I wonder when they get older if they are going to feel over protective or REALLY monitor who their kids are friends with.


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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:15 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Not to mention Devon again LOL, but if I remember correctly, the spoken word piece I shared via youtube here on the board, she talks about that. How it has screwed with her intimacy issues.

Nate, Brooks and Robyn are parents, I wonder when they get older if they are going to feel over protective or REALLY monitor who their kids are friends with.


Off topic but since you mentioned they're now parents, I saw pictures of Byrons kids the other day and it broke. my. heart. They will never meet their uncle. They will one day have to learn about what he did. How devastating.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:23 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Not to mention Devon again LOL, but if I remember correctly, the spoken word piece I shared via youtube here on the board, she talks about that. How it has screwed with her intimacy issues.

Nate, Brooks and Robyn are parents, I wonder when they get older if they are going to feel over protective or REALLY monitor who their kids are friends with.


Off topic but since you mentioned they're now parents, I saw pictures of Byrons kids the other day and it broke. my. heart. They will never meet their uncle. They will one day have to learn about what he did. How devastating.

The family has so many good memories of Dylan and he's remembered for an hour of his life?

I wonder how they will broach the topic, I don't know if they have Byron's last name or his wife's but when they get older surely they will learn about Columbine...
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:26 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Not to mention Devon again LOL, but if I remember correctly, the spoken word piece I shared via youtube here on the board, she talks about that. How it has screwed with her intimacy issues.

Nate, Brooks and Robyn are parents, I wonder when they get older if they are going to feel over protective or REALLY monitor who their kids are friends with.


Off topic but since you mentioned they're now parents, I saw pictures of Byrons kids the other day and it broke. my. heart. They will never meet their uncle. They will one day have to learn about what he did. How devastating.

The family has so many good memories of Dylan and he's remembered for an hour of his life?

I wonder how they will broach the topic, I don't know if they have Byron's last name or his wife's but when they get older surely they will learn about Columbine...

No way can they keep it from them. The last name is so unique, even if they make their last names hyphenated or give them the wife's last name, they will find out. It's inevitable. I'm sure when the time comes they will have mulled it over for a long time, so they will know what they feel is the best way to bring it up.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:33 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Not to mention Devon again LOL, but if I remember correctly, the spoken word piece I shared via youtube here on the board, she talks about that. How it has screwed with her intimacy issues.

Nate, Brooks and Robyn are parents, I wonder when they get older if they are going to feel over protective or REALLY monitor who their kids are friends with.


Off topic but since you mentioned they're now parents, I saw pictures of Byrons kids the other day and it broke. my. heart. They will never meet their uncle. They will one day have to learn about what he did. How devastating.

The family has so many good memories of Dylan and he's remembered for an hour of his life?

I wonder how they will broach the topic, I don't know if they have Byron's last name or his wife's but when they get older surely they will learn about Columbine...

No way can they keep it from them. The last name is so unique, even if they make their last names hyphenated or give them the wife's last name, they will find out. It's inevitable. I'm sure when the time comes they will have mulled it over for a long time, so they will know what they feel is the best way to bring it up.

I agree. Kevin has it easier, Harris is pretty generic and I have a feeling they don't really talk about Eric.
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PostSubject: Re: 9/11 and mr. 9/11/81   Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:36 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Not to mention Devon again LOL, but if I remember correctly, the spoken word piece I shared via youtube here on the board, she talks about that. How it has screwed with her intimacy issues.

Nate, Brooks and Robyn are parents, I wonder when they get older if they are going to feel over protective or REALLY monitor who their kids are friends with.


Off topic but since you mentioned they're now parents, I saw pictures of Byrons kids the other day and it broke. my. heart. They will never meet their uncle. They will one day have to learn about what he did. How devastating.

The family has so many good memories of Dylan and he's remembered for an hour of his life?

I wonder how they will broach the topic, I don't know if they have Byron's last name or his wife's but when they get older surely they will learn about Columbine...

No way can they keep it from them. The last name is so unique, even if they make their last names hyphenated or give them the wife's last name, they will find out. It's inevitable. I'm sure when the time comes they will have mulled it over for a long time, so they will know what they feel is the best way to bring it up.

I agree. Kevin has it easier, Harris is pretty generic and I have a feeling they don't really talk about Eric.

Speaking of families, in the "13 Families" doc one of the younger sisters of one of the victims (I can't remember off the top of my head which one) says the ONE question she dreads when meeting someone is "how many brothers do you have?" She says she either says two older brothers as if her brother is still alive and hopes they don't ask more questions, or she just says she has one. Sad
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9/11 and mr. 9/11/81
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