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 Nineteen years of Columbine

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evelynssye
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 21, 2018 12:28 pm

Screamingophelia wrote:
ShadowedGoddess wrote:
Draw_It_White wrote:
ShadowedGoddess wrote:
Screamingophelia wrote:
ShadowedGoddess wrote:
Draw_It_White wrote:
ShadowedGoddess wrote:
I can't help by wonder what the victims families are doing right now. 19 years is a very long time, but one doesn't really completely heal from losing a loved one in such a horrific way.  

I also have to wonder how Eric's and Dylan's family is facing this today.  I actually think they have it just a little rougher then the other families. As their kids were the ones to cause such pain and devastation to so many.

It would be hard to feel guilty about mourning your own child because they killed 13 innocent people. Sad

A lot of the families were visiting the memorial, school and cemetery. Steve Curnow’s father was at his monument when I was at the memorial and Matt Kechter’s parents looked to be at the cemetery along with John Tomlin’s. There were probably countless others too who I wasn’t even aware of.


[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]  ScreamingO and myself had many back and forth pm's yesterday. I pretty much got a play by play of her activities. So in a roundabout way yours as well. Smile    

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Thanks for being my eyes girl! I love you Very Happy

You're welcome! I enjoyed meeting DIW too, very kind and just cool in general.

It's snowing this morning, it may not stick but it's super pretty.


[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]  I'm glad you didn't have to throat punch him! Haha Roll

I’d heard about that!


[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]   Sorry Embarassed

But that was my sage advice to ScreamingO if anyone got out of hand, or if she felt threatened in anyway. Twisted Evil  Glad you were a nice guy, and didn't get hurt! Because I have also advised her once before that the best follow up to the throat punch is a hard kick to the groin. Haha

I thought a friendly warning was good LOL. He's super nice. We had an interesting day.

LOL
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 21, 2018 1:40 pm

The Hidden Legacy of Columbine: Ignorance About School Violence

Oh the irony of the title.
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Screamingophelia
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 21, 2018 3:09 pm

I think the first of the funerals were on the 24th.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 21, 2018 6:17 pm

I know we all look at 4/20 and think minute by minute what was happening at that moment in or around the Columbine community “x” number of years ago....but I also tend to think about the victims families on 4/21.  Danny R’s dad getting the news papers, Cassie Bernall’s parents long night of looking out the window where their daughters body laid and they can’t get to her or do anything about it, or the parents of the many other victims who got confirmation of the news they had been dreading but mostly knew to be true by then.  To me this day is just as hard on the families of the victims as 4/20 was...finding out for certain that their loved ones were not ever going to walk through the door of their houses again.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 21, 2018 6:28 pm

W.A.R. wrote:
The Hidden Legacy of Columbine: Ignorance About School Violence

Oh the irony of the title.
I stopped reading after saw it mentioned Cullen.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 21, 2018 6:30 pm

Tommy QTR wrote:
W.A.R. wrote:
The Hidden Legacy of Columbine: Ignorance About School Violence

Oh the irony of the title.
I stopped reading after saw it mentioned Cullen.
It really is a shame just how ignorant he remains on Columbine (especially with his perceptions of Eric and Dylan, we all know where that goes with him) and continues to brainwash people and feed them false information and he thinks he's so right.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 21, 2018 6:49 pm

Does anyone feel a bit hungover or sad today?
I stayed up binge watching Columbine related videos last night.
Just felt very involved and aware on the anniversary yesterday.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 21, 2018 9:52 pm

Oldmare wrote:
Does anyone feel a bit hungover or sad today?
I stayed up binge watching Columbine related videos last night.
Just felt very involved and aware on the anniversary yesterday.

Sent from Topic'it App

Overwhelmed for sure Sad heavy hearted
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 21, 2018 10:38 pm

The whole thing was unfortunate. I wish they could have just seen past high school. Hell, only two weeks from graduation once they did this. But they were already so fucked up and hellbent on destruction at that point, there was no saving them in my opinion.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 12:26 am

I think Eric saw past high school - he wrote his thoughts about how he saw no point in getting a job and going to college and working for the rest of your life so you can retire and then die a few years later... he saw through that.

He was right, that system is pointless, and it's something many teenagers see through.

Perhaps he didn't know there were other options, or if he did, he didn't care. But I think he saw through the system of society pretty far, and that was part of what fueled his hopelessness for the future... there really was nothing in life for him to live for. He wasn't interested in playing that part in society.

I can relate to that, too. I never wanted to follow that path in life and that was always a driving force in my suicidal thoughts/desires. Nobody told me self-employment was a possibility. Took me 35 years to realize I really could do whatever I wanted and not follow the "rules..." they just don't teach you that in high school. So you end up with kids who see through the bullshit but aren't given another option.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 12:46 am

EthanEmerson wrote:
I think Eric saw past high school - he wrote his thoughts about how he saw no point in getting a job and going to college and working for the rest of your life so you can retire and then die a few years later... he saw through that.

He was right, that system is pointless, and it's something many teenagers see through.

Perhaps he didn't know there were other options, or if he did, he didn't care. But I think he saw through the system of society pretty far, and that was part of what fueled his hopelessness for the future... there really was nothing in life for him to live for. He wasn't interested in playing that part in society. 

I agree completely; I've come to this conclusion for quite a while now.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 12:53 am

QuestionMark wrote:
EthanEmerson wrote:
I think Eric saw past high school - he wrote his thoughts about how he saw no point in getting a job and going to college and working for the rest of your life so you can retire and then die a few years later... he saw through that.

He was right, that system is pointless, and it's something many teenagers see through.

Perhaps he didn't know there were other options, or if he did, he didn't care. But I think he saw through the system of society pretty far, and that was part of what fueled his hopelessness for the future... there really was nothing in life for him to live for. He wasn't interested in playing that part in society. 

I agree completely; I've come to this conclusion for quite a while now.

Eric was a huge pessimist obviously and yeah, of course, everyone knows that. You go to school, work, retire, and then die. But it's what happens in between all that, that is great. Life is full of great things. But doing what he did wasn't a solution. It just made people who wanted to live life and enjoy it, not be able to do that just because some kid saw life as pointless.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:01 am

EthanEmerson wrote:
I think Eric saw past high school - he wrote his thoughts about how he saw no point in getting a job and going to college and working for the rest of your life so you can retire and then die a few years later... he saw through that.

He was right, that system is pointless, and it's something many teenagers see through.

Perhaps he didn't know there were other options, or if he did, he didn't care. But I think he saw through the system of society pretty far, and that was part of what fueled his hopelessness for the future... there really was nothing in life for him to live for. He wasn't interested in playing that part in society.

I can relate to that, too. I never wanted to follow that path in life and that was always a driving force in my suicidal thoughts/desires. Nobody told me self-employment was a possibility. Took me 35 years to realize I really could do whatever I wanted and not follow the "rules..." they just don't teach you that in high school. So you end up with kids who see through the bullshit but aren't given another option.

Besides, Eric was charming and a smart kid. I'm sure he could have found a purpose and a point in life. He had a strong love for the military. He got rejected by the Marines 5 days before the massacre, which probably even fueled his thoughts on how life is pointless. But he still had a strong love for technology and video games and could have possibly pursued a career in one of those fields and been happy.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:22 am

I'm not convinced Eric's unofficial implied rejection from the Marines made a difference. Nobody even told him he was rejected. The officer left a message for him to call back, and that's all. He told people at school he had been rejected, and I don't think he cared at all. That was just another act.

Here's why.

On April 12th, 8 days before the shooting, Eric recorded on one of the "Basement Tapes" the following:

"For the past few weeks, my parents have hounded me about the things I've neglected: my application to the Marines; my car insurance; my checking account. But they don't know that none of that matters to me."

At the time he recorded that his Marines application didn't matter to him, the recruiter had not yet visited Eric's home. His medication (Luvox) had not come into question . Eric did not care about joining the Marines long before there was even a possibility he may not be eligible. He was playing everyone like a piano.

So, when Staff Sergeant Gonzales visited his home three days later on the 15th, Eric was just going through the motions. He didn't really care.

It's easy to think that his implied rejection added to his rage, but the evidence doesn't support that.

He didn't have a strong love for the military, either - he had a strong love for improvised explosives and weapons and killing. I don't think he would have lasted a week in the actual military. His contempt for authority would have gotten him kicked out.

It's hard to understand Eric when you look at him and analyze his actions through the lens of your own logic, worldview, and reasoning... you have to get out of your world and into his world to understand. He was manipulating everyone to maintain appearances. He had to, if he wanted to go undetected.

He really didn't care about the Marines at all, and his taped statement prior to the home visit proves it.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:29 am

EthanEmerson wrote:
I'm not convinced Eric's unofficial implied rejection from the Marines made a difference. Nobody even told him he was rejected. The officer left a message for him to call back, and that's all. He told people at school he had been rejected, and I don't think he cared at all. That was just another act.

Here's why.

On April 12th, 8 days before the shooting, Eric recorded on one of the "Basement Tapes" the following:

"For the past few weeks, my parents have hounded me about the things I've neglected: my application to the Marines; my car insurance; my checking account. But they don't know that none of that matters to me."

At the time he recorded that his Marines application didn't matter to him, the recruiter had not yet visited Eric's home. His medication (Luvox) had not come into question . Eric did not care about joining the Marines long before there was even a possibility he may not be eligible. He was playing everyone like a piano.

So, when Staff Sergeant Gonzales visited his home three days later on the 15th, Eric was just going through the motions. He didn't really care.

It's easy to think that his implied rejection added to his rage, but the evidence doesn't support that.

He didn't have a strong love for the military, either - he had a strong love for improvised explosives and weapons and killing. I don't think he would have lasted a week in the actual military. His contempt for authority would have gotten him kicked out.

It's hard to understand Eric when you look at him and analyze his actions through the lens of your own logic, worldview, and reasoning... you have to get out of your world and into his world to understand. He was manipulating everyone to maintain appearances. He had to, if he wanted to go undetected.

He really didn't care about the Marines at all, and his taped statement prior to the home visit proves it.

Huh, did not know that. Thanks for the info.
Also adds to my point of him being charming, very manipulative. And yeah, he had to be. If he showed how he really was on the inside, he would have been stopped long before he even got the chance to even start planning it.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:30 am

Not only was Eric never actually rejected (he never even turned in a completed application so he could not have been rejected) but... here's the kicker.

Psychotropic medication is not an automatic disqualification for service. The military prescribes much of those same medications to soldiers. Prior to the Iraq war in 1993, soldiers could not go into combat on psychiatric drugs. However, after 1993 that changed and many psychiatrists won't even approve deployment UNLESS their patients/soldiers are taking psychiatric drugs. That's scary, right?

Also, today, one out of every six soldiers takes prescription drugs including anti-depressants like Zoloft, anti-psychotics, narcotics, sedatives, anti-anxiety drugs, and amphetamines. And like I said, that has been in effect since 1993.6 years prior to Eric's unofficial 'application.'

So, not only was Eric never told he was disqualified, but the fact that he was taking medication was not an automatic disqualifier in the first place.

Most people don't know this though...
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:31 am

Yep! Totally charming and manipulative!

Hell bent on destruction and willing to do anything to keep it under wraps...
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:32 am

EthanEmerson wrote:
Yep! Totally charming and manipulative!

Hell bent on destruction and willing to do anything to keep it under wraps...

You seem like a cool guy lol, but it sounds like you kind of, commend what Eric and Dylan did. I really hope not.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:34 am

The one thing that confuses me most is that he wrote about how his medication was helping him feel calm, and so he stopped taking it so he could build on the rage. I wonder if he really did stop taking it or if he just took it intermittently, because there was a small amount in his system when they did the autopsy...

It's one thing to stop medication, and another to take it inconsistently... I always wonder if he took it in front of his parents just so they wouldn't catch on... or if he purposely took it sporadically to push himself further over the edge...
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:34 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] just stating the truth of what I see!
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:35 am

EthanEmerson wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] just stating the truth of what I see!

Yeah, so am I. I'm saying Eric was charming and manipulative, which he was. But not saying that in a way as a compliment, since he was charming for all the wrong reasons. lol
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:38 am

Yup. Exactly. He just knew how to get his way with people. He had everyone fooled. It's a great skill to have when you're trying to plan a surprise birthday party... not so great when you're planning destruction...
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:41 am

EthanEmerson wrote:
Yup. Exactly. He just knew how to get his way with people. He had everyone fooled. It's a great skill to have when you're trying to plan a surprise birthday party... not so great when you're planning destruction...

Tbh, if I knew Dylan, I would have been his friend. He had plenty friends and was a very cool and genuine kid. But Eric had few friends for a reason, I believe he just wasn't a fun person to be around, kind of a dick. So idk if I'd have gotten a long with Eric.

Crazy to think if they never did this, they'd be nearly 40 years old today and just be people no one knew about. But everyone knows who Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold are. Very infamous.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:46 am

It does seem that way, yeah... like it would be harder to get along with Eric. For sure. I don't think I would have gotten along with him at all in high school. I wasn't easy to get along with, either. lol
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 1:51 am

EthanEmerson wrote:
It does seem that way, yeah... like it would be harder to get along with Eric. For sure. I don't think I would have gotten along with him at all in high school. I wasn't easy to get along with, either. lol

It still boggles me what did Dylan see in Eric? Why did he like Eric so much? I think it was because they fed off each other’s anger and despair and both had the dream of NBK.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 22, 2018 8:33 am

I think Dylan was pretty loyal to people. Eric didn’t have anyone to connect with and Dylan was this shy and super smart kid who never wanted to let anyone down. As Dylan kept feeling abandoned by his friends, Eric was there.

I’ve read that Eric later in HS would tell Dylan that no one else really liked him. Dylan was probably able to be really angry around Eric and Eric may have been able to be vulnerable around Dylan.

They didn’t seem to have a ton of common interests later in their friendship. They were pretty different.


Just my 2 cents...

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 12:11 am

Tomorrow will be a cold and snowy day.

Rachel and Dylan’s funerals were 19 years ago tomorrow. Both covered by the news. Both drastically different. Rachel had thousands. Dylan had about 12. Some reports say Zach attended, that was never confirmed. His, Nate’s and Brooks”s patents did.

First of 14 funerals. The only one we don’t have info on is Eric’s

Which is sadly prophetic given how unloved and alone Eric felt.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 12:18 am

Screamingophelia wrote:
Tomorrow will be a cold and snowy day.

Rachel and Dylan’s funerals were 19 years ago tomorrow. Both covered by the news. Both drastically different. Rachel had thousands. Dylan had about 12. Some reports say Zach attended, that was never confirmed. His, Nate’s and Brooks”s patents  did.

First of 14 funerals. The only one we don’t have info on is Eric’s

Which is sadly prophetic given how unloved and alone Eric felt.

And how much more he's demonized compared to his partner in crime.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 1:13 am

QuestionMark wrote:
Screamingophelia wrote:
Tomorrow will be a cold and snowy day.

Rachel and Dylan’s funerals were 19 years ago tomorrow. Both covered by the news. Both drastically different. Rachel had thousands. Dylan had about 12. Some reports say Zach attended, that was never confirmed. His, Nate’s and Brooks”s patents  did.

First of 14 funerals. The only one we don’t have info on is Eric’s

Which is sadly prophetic given how unloved and alone Eric felt.

And how much more he's demonized compared to his partner in crime.

Yes, I mentioned in another thread I never quite noticed that Sue calls the massacre "Eric's plan" a couple of times, that makes me feel foolish but while she says she understands Dylan's cruelty and behavior she does seem to place most of the blame on Eric.

People who think Eric was a charming psychopath have never watched the full Eric in Columbine video, at the very least.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 7:25 am

QuestionMark wrote:
Screamingophelia wrote:
Tomorrow will be a cold and snowy day.

Rachel and Dylan’s funerals were 19 years ago tomorrow. Both covered by the news. Both drastically different. Rachel had thousands. Dylan had about 12. Some reports say Zach attended, that was never confirmed. His, Nate’s and Brooks”s patents  did.

First of 14 funerals. The only one we don’t have info on is Eric’s

Which is sadly prophetic given how unloved and alone Eric felt.

And how much more he's demonized compared to his partner in crime.


To true.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 10:30 am

QuestionMark wrote:
Tomorrow will be a cold and snowy day.

Rachel and Dylan’s funerals were 19 years ago tomorrow. Both covered by the news. Both drastically different. Rachel had thousands. Dylan had about 12. Some reports say Zach attended, that was never confirmed. His, Nate’s and Brooks”s patents  did.

First of 14 funerals. The only one we don’t have info on is Eric’s

Which is sadly prophetic given how unloved and alone Eric felt.

And how much more he's demonized compared to his partner in crime.
100%. Honestly wish people would see past that whole Dylan was a victim to Eric too bull, and realize he is equally to blame.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 1:24 pm

[quote="Heyheyhey"]
QuestionMark wrote:
Tomorrow will be a cold and snowy day.

Rachel and Dylan’s funerals were 19 years ago tomorrow. Both covered by the news. Both drastically different. Rachel had thousands. Dylan had about 12. Some reports say Zach attended, that was never confirmed. His, Nate’s and Brooks”s patents  did.

First of 14 funerals. The only one we don’t have info on is Eric’s

Which is sadly prophetic given how unloved and alone Eric felt.

And how much more he's demonized compared to his partner in crime.


It's funny how she calls it "Eric's plan." But Dylan was the first one to introduce NBK to Eric in the first place. It was a fantasy of Dylan's for over a year before Eric even started writing about it.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 8:40 pm

Just because Dylan was the first to write about it doesn't mean he thought of it first...

We don't have any idea what they discussed together.

It's a possibility but it's also an assumption...

A lack of evidence is not, itself, evidence...
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 9:09 pm

EthanEmerson wrote:
Just because Dylan was the first to write about it doesn't mean he thought of it first...

We don't have any idea what they discussed together.

It's a possibility but it's also an assumption...

A lack of evidence is not, itself, evidence...

I do agree with you, I've always thought that. We don't know what they talked about privately. Dylan did want it to be with a woman at first but who knows if Eric didn't bring it up, then Dylan thought about it as being with a woman then realized Eric was the "best" choice?

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 10:04 pm

Screamingophelia wrote:
I do agree with you, I've always thought that. We don't know what they talked about privately. Dylan did want it to be with a woman at first but who knows if Eric didn't bring it up, then Dylan thought about it as being with a woman then realized Eric was the "best" choice?

That seems like an awkward way for it to come about. Is it possible Eric had a similar idea and brought it up to Dylan? and Dylan having already thought about doing something crazy readily bought into it? I guess (I maintain it was Dylan's idea but this is for pure argument's sake) Either way that journal entry disproves the notion that Dylan was manipulated.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 10:17 pm

W.A.R. wrote:
Screamingophelia wrote:
I do agree with you, I've always thought that. We don't know what they talked about privately. Dylan did want it to be with a woman at first but who knows if Eric didn't bring it up, then Dylan thought about it as being with a woman then realized Eric was the "best" choice?

That seems like an awkward way for it to come about. Is it possible Eric had a similar idea and brought it up to Dylan? and Dylan having already thought about doing something crazy readily bought into it? I guess (I maintain it was Dylan's idea but this is for pure argument's sake) Either way that journal entry disproves the notion that Dylan was manipulated.

That could very well be. It always amazes me how people overlook Dylan's anger and also Eric's depression. I mean Dylan wrote a good 7 pages in Eric's yearbook of just pure anger... some of it was regular friend stuff "We went to the water park and got BURNT! Our shoes are better that everyone elses"

then "the holy morning of NBK will be godlike" etc:...
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Apr 24, 2018 11:28 pm

EthanEmerson wrote:
Just because Dylan was the first to write about it doesn't mean he thought of it first...

This is a point that i’ve always thought but not many people will have it. One of many questions we’ll never know. Personally, i’ve always thought Eric was the one who came up with the plan - again though, no evidence to back that up.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 25, 2018 12:41 am

W.A.R. wrote:
Is it possible Eric had a similar idea and brought it up to Dylan? and Dylan having already thought about doing something crazy readily bought into it?

Imagine the odds - two teenagers each come up with a plan to commit mass murder independently of one another, then after being friends for a while, they decide to combine their plans. 

I'm not trying to take a dig at you mind, I just think that if that was how it really went down (and it very well may have), then it really was a perfect storm of events, so to speak.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeWed Apr 25, 2018 5:11 pm

Screamingophelia wrote:
Tomorrow will be a cold and snowy day.

Rachel and Dylan’s funerals were 19 years ago tomorrow. Both covered by the news. Both drastically different. Rachel had thousands. Dylan had about 12. Some reports say Zach attended, that was never confirmed. His, Nate’s and Brooks”s patents did.

First of 14 funerals. The only one we don’t have info on is Eric’s

Which is sadly prophetic given how unloved and alone Eric felt.
Wow, I did not know that Dylans funeral was a public thing

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu Apr 26, 2018 9:19 pm

I wonder what they would think of all the school shootings that occurred after their time. Especially given that the Florida one was pretty much viewed live via students using social media to update relatives, friends and various media outlets. I wonder what they would think of Cruz considering he committed such a horrible act and then left as though nothing had happened. And still as far as I am aware there's been no hint at what motivated him (in the UK all coverage of Florida on the news has finished - as far as I am aware).

Who knows where they could have been today, happily married with kids and a wife, a steady job at a company hey hated but they continue to work there in order to provide for their families. This could be said for every single victim also. I wonder (I'm not religious in the slightest but there are certain elements that I like such as seeing your loved ones who died once you pass away purely because its something nice to think about and doesn't make death seem so final) if every victim went to heaven, even Eric and Dylan, are they getting to live out the lives they didn't have on earth in heaven - so is Rachel enjoying acting etc. I know it sounds weird, but it's a thing to ponder over I think.

I also wonder what would have happened if they didn't go through with the full shooting and they only injured people, say outside and then they came to their senses. What would have happened x amount of years down the line say at a school reunion would the victim's who'd been injured speak to them or give them a wide berth? And what would the police charge them with if they only shot and injured people as opposed to killing them?
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu Apr 26, 2018 10:08 pm

Screamingophelia wrote:
QuestionMark wrote:
Screamingophelia wrote:
Tomorrow will be a cold and snowy day.

Rachel and Dylan’s funerals were 19 years ago tomorrow. Both covered by the news. Both drastically different. Rachel had thousands. Dylan had about 12. Some reports say Zach attended, that was never confirmed. His, Nate’s and Brooks”s patents  did.

First of 14 funerals. The only one we don’t have info on is Eric’s

Which is sadly prophetic given how unloved and alone Eric felt.

And how much more he's demonized compared to his partner in crime.

Yes, I mentioned in another thread I never quite noticed that Sue calls the massacre "Eric's plan" a couple of times, that makes me feel foolish but while she says she understands Dylan's cruelty and behavior she does seem to place most of the blame on Eric.

People who think Eric was a charming psychopath have never watched the full Eric in Columbine video, at the very least.

Yes. Watching Eric for a while on a normal day, he is not cracking jokes left and right and handing out compliments. He's the total opposite. He's observant and serves the occasional somewhat witty comment. I hate how every one labels him right off the bat as a psychopath cause that's all they've heard/read.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeThu Apr 26, 2018 11:14 pm

katherinex wrote:
I wonder what they would think of Cruz considering he committed such a horrible act and then left as though nothing had happened. And still as far as I am aware there's been no hint at what motivated him

Well if you take a closer look into his life you see that he was mentally unstable for a long time, and had to deal with the death of his mother, the loss of his girlfriend, and his expulsion all in a short amount of time, so really the motive is pretty plain to see.

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeFri Apr 27, 2018 7:19 am

QuestionMark wrote:
katherinex wrote:
I wonder what they would think of Cruz considering he committed such a horrible act and then left as though nothing had happened. And still as far as I am aware there's been no hint at what motivated him

Well if you take a closer look into his life you see that he was mentally unstable for a long time, and had to deal with the death of his mother, the loss of his girlfriend, and his expulsion all in a short amount of time, so really the motive is pretty plain to see.



Agreed. Cruz had been struggling for a number of years. He was basically a ticking time bomb just looking for a place to explode.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeFri Apr 27, 2018 10:06 am

evelynssye wrote:
Screamingophelia wrote:
QuestionMark wrote:
Screamingophelia wrote:
Tomorrow will be a cold and snowy day.

Rachel and Dylan’s funerals were 19 years ago tomorrow. Both covered by the news. Both drastically different. Rachel had thousands. Dylan had about 12. Some reports say Zach attended, that was never confirmed. His, Nate’s and Brooks”s patents  did.

First of 14 funerals. The only one we don’t have info on is Eric’s

Which is sadly prophetic given how unloved and alone Eric felt.

And how much more he's demonized compared to his partner in crime.

Yes, I mentioned in another thread I never quite noticed that Sue calls the massacre "Eric's plan" a couple of times, that makes me feel foolish but while she says she understands Dylan's cruelty and behavior she does seem to place most of the blame on Eric.

People who think Eric was a charming psychopath have never watched the full Eric in Columbine video, at the very least.

Yes. Watching Eric for a while on a normal day, he is not cracking jokes left and right and handing out compliments. He's the total opposite. He's observant and serves the occasional somewhat witty comment. I hate how every one labels him right off the bat as a psychopath cause that's all they've heard/read.

Exactly, they look at one aspect and think they have him pegged. They see hate when he clearly states that he hates himself the most. I think it surprises people that Dylan wanted to be friends with Eric but seeing how awkward he is, it makes sense. They were really opposite sides of the same coin.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeMon Apr 30, 2018 11:20 pm

EthanEmerson wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] oh wow it was an interview supposedly given in 2012. See, memory sucks haha

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I’m the one that interviewed him for that
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 19, 2018 2:56 pm

LPorter101 wrote:
You know, as I get older, I come to realize just how little I knew about anything - myself or the world around me - when I was 17. The basic elements of who I am now were already there, but they were like the steel frame of a concrete building. So much had yet to be filled in. My mind, my body, and even my soul were still very much under construction.

Being roughly the same age as you are, I feel quite the opposite. Of course I learned new things and got new experiences (especially in terms of the economy, jobs etc) since I was 16. But I remain amazed how much "me" was already there when I was 16. My general outlook on life change little since and almost didn't change any since I was 20.

Maybe I'm just immature.

LPorter101 wrote:
Hopefully, we reach a stable equilibrium somewhere along the way
On one hand, I can't say "a stable equilibrium" is what describes my life best. But its still surprising how little really changes despite sudden and great changes in jobs, income etc.


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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 19, 2018 3:08 pm

ShadowedGoddess wrote:
1891 wrote:
NBK was actually originally planned for Monday, April 19 as late as April 11, 1999.


Basement tapes transcripts from a tape recorded April 11, 1999. Eric talking:

He says this is total “KMFDM” and that “there are 7 and 1/3 days left.” He gets an odd look on his face, then says, “Fucking bitches.” He then lists five names and says that he’s going to be “one tired motherfucker come Monday, then BOOM! I’ll get shot and die.”


I wonder what made them change from the 19th to the 20th.

There is a lot of speculation on this. The most widely believed is that they had to push the date back because Mark Manes kept forgetting to get the last of the ammo they needed.

He finally came through on the 4/19. So NBK was the following day on the 20th.

That and the fact that E&D were working on explosives right up till the attack. I'm not sure if they were all finished with that on Sunday 18th. But ammo was probably the decisive factor.

I've been thinking why they chose 4/20 (which I'm sure they knew is both "smoke pot day" and "skip school day") as that day there would be less people in school than on the 21st.

The only real thing that came to my mind is that April 21st was both "Yom Ha'atzmaut" (was Dylan's Mother planning to celebrate it in some way that would hinder Dylan) and "Administrative Professionals Day" (did Teachers in the USA 1990s celebrate it in any way that could hinder their plans?).

Or were just Eric and Dylan uneasy with sitting on the ready made bombs and ammo supplies? Maybe they just thought taht each passing day increases the chances they get caught?

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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 19, 2018 5:53 pm

They had to of picked out that date on purpose. With their bad sense of humor, it just had to have been a date they chose on purpose.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 19, 2018 6:03 pm

Sane One wrote:
They had to of picked out that date on purpose. With their bad sense of humor, it just had to have been a date they chose on purpose.
It was supposed to be on the 19th but the ammunition for Eric's guns arrived a day late.
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PostSubject: Re: Nineteen years of Columbine   Nineteen years of Columbine - Page 5 Icon_minitimeTue Jun 19, 2018 6:48 pm

Sane One wrote:
They had to of picked out that date on purpose. With their bad sense of humor, it just had to have been a date they chose on purpose.

well from what i understand they wanted to do it on 4/19 because that's the anniversary of the oklahoma city bombing but 4/20 worked too because it was hitler's 110th birthday.
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