Nikolas Cruz's school shooting case goes to grand jury next week

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Video included as well...

Florida school shooter Nikolas Cruz hired a lawyer to try to get his hands on a reported $800,000 inheritance two months before his alleged killing spree

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Could he still get the death penalty if he pleads guilty?

Ziamber II wrote:

Could he still get the death penalty if he pleads guilty?

I find it likely. He did kill 17 people after all.

More than likely he will plea deal where if he pleads guilty the death penalty will be removed.

sororityalpha wrote:

plea deal

What's in it for the prosecution?

STK wrote:

sororityalpha wrote:

plea deal

What's in it for the prosecution?

The state wouldn't have to cover the costs of a trial so that might be an incentive. I'm not sure if witnesses would be required to testify since they have forensic evidence and they even have video of Cruz in the school but it would still probably be a relief for the families to have this over with as quickly as possible. There's also the fact that they might not want to give the media any excuses to continue covering Nikolas and his life story, hoping to deter any fame-seeking copycats. You've probably seen the coverage of Breivik and Holmes on trial and it definitely gives them more time in the spotlight.

It's funny because when Holmes went to court with a shaved head, looking out of his mind, it apparently turned off some of the Tumblr Holmies from their obsession. I read this article a little while ago.
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Quote :

At Holmes’ next public hearing, one Holmie headed to the courthouse to see him with her own eyes, and returned with a verdict: “He is not attractive at all,” she wrote. “I did see him do that wide-eyed look a few times. It’s not as cute in person, though … That was not the same person we’ve been swooning over in his cute little science presentation and how sad and pitiful he looked in his first courtroom appearance.”

Nope. It was definitely the same person!

Yea the “bad assery” goes away pretty quickly when reality hits.

I think if Eric was alive fangirls would be very disappointed in who Eric actually was.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Yea the “bad assery” goes away pretty quickly when reality hits.

I think if Eric was alive  fangirls would be very disappointed in who Eric actually was.

I think this would be true of most fan-girls in general. When faced with the actual person their little made up fantasies would crumble.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Yea the “bad assery” goes away pretty quickly when reality hits.

I think if Eric was alive  fangirls would be very disappointed in who Eric actually was.

I think this would be true of most fan-girls in general. When faced with the actual person their little made up fantasies would crumble.

Not in the case of Richard Ramirez. People can be rather strange.

QuestionMark wrote:

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Yea the “bad assery” goes away pretty quickly when reality hits.

I think if Eric was alive  fangirls would be very disappointed in who Eric actually was.

I think this would be true of most fan-girls in general. When faced with the actual person their little made up fantasies would crumble.

Not in the case of Richard Ramirez. People can be rather strange.

Richard Ramirez and Ted Bundy female fans intrigue and horrify me... they raped and tortured women. I am reading a Stranger Beside Me and it is fascinating. Richard Ramirez seems like he didn't hide his scariness but Ted Bundy did. My aunt claims she encountered Ted Bundy in Florida. She did have long brown hair parted down the middle back then...

Yet there's me who tries to explain why Eric and Dylan are TOTALLY different from someone like Adam Lanza and they can just shut their mouths... so maybe I'm weird too?

QuestionMark wrote:

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Yea the “bad assery” goes away pretty quickly when reality hits.

I think if Eric was alive  fangirls would be very disappointed in who Eric actually was.

I think this would be true of most fan-girls in general. When faced with the actual person their little made up fantasies would crumble.

Not in the case of Richard Ramirez. People can be rather strange.

Indeed very strange. One only has to go on Tumblr to see just how strange some can be.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Indeed very strange. One only has to go on Tumblr to see just how strange some can be.

The horrible part is that the murderer fandoms aren't even the worst Tumblr has to offer.

QuestionMark wrote:

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Indeed very strange. One only has to go on Tumblr to see just how strange some can be.

The horrible part is that the murderer fandoms aren't even the worst Tumblr has to offer.

STOP IT! You will trigger my nightmares! But I agree. There are some truly sick, twisted people on there.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Indeed very strange. One only has to go on Tumblr to see just how strange some can be.

The horrible part is that the murderer fandoms aren't even the worst Tumblr has to offer.

STOP IT! You will trigger my nightmares! But I agree. There are some truly sick, twisted people on there.

There’s a whole YouTube channel that has videos about the different sections of that site!

Screamingophelia wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Yea the “bad assery” goes away pretty quickly when reality hits.

I think if Eric was alive  fangirls would be very disappointed in who Eric actually was.

I think this would be true of most fan-girls in general. When faced with the actual person their little made up fantasies would crumble.

Not in the case of Richard Ramirez. People can be rather strange.

Richard Ramirez and Ted Bundy female fans intrigue and horrify me... they raped and tortured women. I am reading a Stranger Beside Me and it is fascinating. Richard Ramirez seems like he didn't hide his scariness but Ted Bundy did. My aunt claims she encountered Ted Bundy in Florida. She did have long brown hair parted down the middle back then...

Yet there's me who tries to explain why Eric and Dylan are TOTALLY different from someone like Adam Lanza and they can just shut their mouths... so maybe I'm weird too?

They're making a new Ted Bundy movie, starring Zac Efron:
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Nikolas Cruz indicted on 34 counts, including premeditated murder

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Prosecutors will seek death penalty in Parkland school massacre

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sororityalpha wrote:

Prosecutors will seek death penalty in Parkland school massacre

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I actually thought they would let him plead guilty and go for life in prison.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

sororityalpha wrote:

Prosecutors will seek death penalty in Parkland school massacre

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I actually thought they would let him plead guilty and go for life in prison.  

I didn't. They got no reason to go for the plea deal and 17 reasons to sentence him to death.

QuestionMark wrote:

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

sororityalpha wrote:

Prosecutors will seek death penalty in Parkland school massacre

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I actually thought they would let him plead guilty and go for life in prison.  

I didn't. They got no reason to go for the plea deal and 17 reasons to sentence him to death.

Very true.

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Nikolas Cruz is expected to appear in court Wednesday, where he will be formally arraigned on first-degree murder and attempted murder charges.

"Death by injection would be too easy in my eyes," Andrew Pollack told Local 10 News. "I'd rather him rot in prison the rest of his life."

Pollack is the father of Meadow Pollack, who was among the 14 students killed in the school massacre.

"If I was able to dictate the method of death, then I would be for the death penalty," Andrew Pollack said.

Cruz's defense attorneys previously said their client would plead guilty if prosecutors did not seek the death penalty. The action by prosecutors Tuesday does not necessarily mean a plea deal will not be reached.

The only other penalty option for Cruz is life in prison without the possibility of parole.

Cruz now "stands mute" to the charges against him.





I still think this will end in a plea deal for life in prison.

Rot in the prison? Oh please! I always find this funny when someone says that prison is worst than a death. People can adapt to any situation.
For example, Kip Kinkel looks pretty okay:
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A couple of pics of Cruz from his court appearance today. This was mainly discussing his finances, if/when he would have access to any money, etc. As they are trying to determine if he should pay for his own defense.  Although nothing major was decided. Another court date was set for sometime in April.

Jea wrote:

Rot in the prison? Oh please! I always find this funny when someone says that prison is worst than a death. People can adapt to any situation.
For example, Kip Kinkel looks pretty okay:

Not everyone can adapt well or even at all. The notoriety surrounding Cruz's case means that if he goes to prison he's either going to be put in solitary confinement most of his life or be released into the general population where he's going to get beaten, possibly to death.

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The former student charged with killing 17 people at a Florida high school last month refused to announce a plea on Wednesday so a judge entered a not guilty plea on his behalf.

Assistant Public Defender Melisa McNeill repeated that Nikolas Cruz would plead guilty if prosecutors waived the death penalty, which they refused to do.

Circuit Judge Elizabeth Scherer entered the not guilty pleas on Cruz's behalf after he remained silent.

"A plea of not guilty shall be entered on the defendant's behalf on all 34 counts of the indictment," Scherer said.

Shackled and wearing red jail clothes, Cruz sat in the jury box with his head bowed and said nothing. At least 20 Broward Sheriff's Office deputies ringed the courtroom in a heavy show of security.

Much of the hearing concerned whether Cruz has enough assets to pay a private lawyer rather than be represented at taxpayer expense by the public defender. McNeill told Scherer that Cruz may have as much as $37,000 combined in a bank account and life insurance proceeds from his mother's death last November. Cruz also has 24 shares of Microsoft stock and some other assets, McNeill said.

"What this information means in terms of his net worth, I don't know," McNeill said. ""The court can make a determination once we do a more thorough review."

But she added: "I don't think there's a private attorney in Florida that would take a 17-count first degree murder case" for $37,000.

Scherer set an April 11 hearing on the assets issue.

QuestionMark wrote:

Jea wrote:

Rot in the prison? Oh please! I always find this funny when someone says that prison is worst than a death. People can adapt to any situation.
For example, Kip Kinkel looks pretty okay:

Not everyone can adapt well or even at all. The notoriety surrounding Cruz's case means that if he goes to prison he's either going to be put in solitary confinement most of his life or be released into the general population where he's going to get beaten, possibly to death.

Well, I'm still think the life is better than DEATH. People can live in very horrible conditions and still adapt. I've researched about it a lot. And yeah, execution is more cheaper )

Has anyone stumbled across the victims autopsy reports or know if they have even been released?

Jea wrote:

Well, I'm still think the life is better than DEATH.

I guess it depends on the life you live.

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Highlights from article-

If prosecutors are considering the death penalty, state law requires them to say so within 45 days of a defendant’s arraignment. And as Satz said a week after the shooting: “This certainly is the type of case the death penalty was designed for.

On that, you will get no argument from Finkelstein, whose office is representing Cruz, at least until a court determines whether his inherited assets disqualify him from being represented by a taxpayer-supported lawyer.

Finkelstein pulls no punches on Cruz. He says his client is guilty of “the worst criminal act that has ever occurred in Broward County. What 9/11 was to America, this will be to Broward. Nothing comes close.”

Within days of the massacre, Finkelstein surprised the nation by announcing his client would plead guilty in return for taking the death penalty off the table.

“You’re never going to hear us say he’s not guilty,” Finkelstein told us. “But we can’t walk in and say “guilty,” because the next thing you know, he’s executed. It would be malpractice to plead guilty. But we’re not going to insult people’s intelligence and say he’s not guilty.”

It likely would take three years to get to trial, the first step in a journey that would cost many millions of dollars. Satz’s office has requested an extra $5 million to prosecute the case, Finkelstein says. His office has requested a couple of million dollars.

Finkelstein fears the trial would tear our community apart. Rather than working together to ensure this never happens again, he expects finger-pointing to heighten between the Broward Sheriff’s Office, Broward County Public Schools, Henderson Behavioral Health and the state and federal governments.

After months of emotional testimony and horrific images, he says the jury would find Cruz guilty. But the defense team would have planted seeds in the jurors’ minds that although their client is responsible for his acts, the state lacks clean hands to kill him, having ignored every opportunity to help him.

“When it comes time, human beings take very seriously the question of life and death,” Finkelstein says. “And in this case, it’s going to be a very difficult situation because while this is as horrible a crime as you could possibly commit, on the other side, why did nobody do anything?”

Even if the jury unanimously votes for death, Finkelstein says the appeals process could last 15 or more years. “This case will not be put to bed until someone who’s not born yet graduates from Stoneman Douglas High School.”

“What I’ve seen in 40 years, when families do walk this path, they become hollow bodies, hollow eyes, shuffling in and out of court, linked to the very person who destroyed their lives. When they walk this path, it has not been my experience that closure is at the end of it.

“Whether that’s better for the victims’ families, or the other path, to put him away for ever and ever, and let them begin to pick up the pieces and build some kind of future. It’s a decision that’s very heavy, that only the victims’ families can answer.”






This was a super long article, but it was filled with a lot of useful info on what would likely happen IF this went to trail. The case would take several years and drag on forever.

Judge entered a not guilty plea so this should be going to trial.

Cruz can change his plea anytime up to the trial date as well.

sororityalpha wrote:

Judge entered a not guilty plea so this should be going to trial.

Cruz can change his plea anytime up to the trial date as well.

To my understanding the judge entered the not guilty plea because Cruz stood "Mute" before the court.

Last time Cruz appeared on his trial he looked... I cant find appropriate word...indifferent
Before he looked like he have some sort of remorse, dunno if he pretended or not. But now he looks bored.

Jea wrote:

Last time Cruz appeared on his trial he looked... I cant find appropriate word...indifferent
Before he looked like he have some sort of remorse, dunno if he pretended or not. But now he looks bored.

I think he is scared, also kind of like he is lost in his own little world.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Jea wrote:

Last time Cruz appeared on his trial he looked... I cant find appropriate word...indifferent
Before he looked like he have some sort of remorse, dunno if he pretended or not. But now he looks bored.

I think he is scared, also kind of like he is lost in his own little world.

He lost some weight as i see. Mby he is on the stage of understanding what have his done.

Jea wrote:

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Jea wrote:

Last time Cruz appeared on his trial he looked... I cant find appropriate word...indifferent
Before he looked like he have some sort of remorse, dunno if he pretended or not. But now he looks bored.

I think he is scared, also kind of like he is lost in his own little world.

He lost some weight as i see. Mby he is on the stage of understanding what have his done.

He seemed to have aged by a few years as well.

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Officials were so concerned about the mental stability of the student accused of last month’s Florida school massacre that they decided he should be forcibly committed.

But the recommendation was never acted upon.

A commitment under the law would have made it more difficult if not impossible for Nikolas Cruz to obtain a gun legally.

But more than a year earlier, documents in the criminal case against Nikolas Cruz and obtained by The Associated Press show school officials and a sheriff’s deputy recommended in September 2016 that Cruz be involuntarily committed for a mental evaluation.

The documents, which are part of Cruz’s criminal case in the shooting, show that he had written the word “kill” in a notebook, told a classmate that he wanted to buy a gun and use it, and had cut his arm supposedly in anger because he had broken up with a girlfriend. He also told another student he had drunk gasoline and was throwing up. Calls had even been made to the FBI about the possibility of Cruz using a gun at school.

The documents were provided by a psychological assessment service initiated by Cruz’s mother called Henderson Behavioral Health. The documents show a high school resource officer who was also a sheriff’s deputy and two school counselors recommended in September 2016 that Cruz be committed for mental evaluation under Florida’s Baker Act. That law allows for involuntary commitment for mental health examination for at least three days.

Such an involuntary commitment would also have been a high obstacle if not a complete barrier to legally obtaining a firearm, such as the AR-15 rifle used in the Stoneman Douglas massacre on Feb. 14, authorities say.

There is no evidence Cruz was ever committed. Coincidentally, the school resource officer who recommended that Cruz be “Baker Acted” was Scot Peterson — the same Broward Sheriff’s Office deputy who resigned amid accusations he failed to respond to the shooting by staying outside the building where the killings occurred.

David S. Weinstein, a former federal prosecutor, said that an involuntary commitment would have been a huge red flag had Cruz attempted to buy a firearm legally.

“If he had lied, hopefully the verification of the form would have pulled up the commitment paperwork,” Weinstein said.

The documents do not say why Cruz was not committed under the Baker Act or whether he may not have qualified for other reasons. The law allows a law enforcement officer such as Peterson to initiate commitment under the Baker Act.

The documents show that Cruz was very much on the radar screen of mental health professionals and the Broward County school system, yet very little appears to have been done other than these evaluations.

Other red flags have also surfaced, including calls to the FBI about Cruz’s potential to become a school shooter and numerous visits by county law enforcement officials to his home – both before his mother died in November and after, when he lived briefly with a family friend in Palm Beach County.

Again, very little was done.







After the attack Nik's little brother Zachary was committed under the Baker Act and held for a few days.  I get sick thinking about all the times this kid could have been stopped but wasn't.

SRO/Deputy Scot Peterson recommended the involuntary commitment as well as others Sep. 2016.

Wasn't Cruz pulled out of the Marjory Stoneman High School shortly after that?

Cruz apparently bought the AR-15 in Feb. 2017.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

he had written the word “kill” in a notebook, told a classmate that he wanted to buy a gun and use it, and had cut his arm supposedly in anger because he had broken up with a girlfriend. He also told another student he had drunk gasoline and was throwing up.

Holy hell, it seems like every time I hear about Nick there's a new major red flag that's revealed.