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 Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric

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Lizpuff
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:06 pm

liquorvamp wrote:
Have there been any reports or stories of either one sleeping over at one another's house? Or drinking and passing out there? IDK why it's kinda cute and endearing to me.

You mean about Eric and Dylan? Yes. Eric in fact "slept" over at Dylan's on April 16 99. They made the bt from Dylan's house that night.

But there are several people including family members stating that they both slept over at each other's houses.
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:14 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Oh okay interesting, thank you. That's one info I actually didn't know yet, the bt was made at Dyl's house.

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 1:20 pm

liquorvamp wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Oh okay interesting, thank you. That's one info I actually didn't know yet, the bt was made at Dyl's house.

Only one of the clips was made at Dylan's house. The rest were at Eric's house or in the car.

You could see Dylan's tux for prom in his room while they are practicing gearing up.
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:18 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
liquorvamp wrote:
Have there been any reports or stories of either one sleeping over at one another's house? Or drinking and passing out there? IDK why it's kinda cute and endearing to me.

You mean about Eric and Dylan?  Yes.  Eric in fact "slept" over at Dylan's on April 16 99.  They made the bt from Dylan's house that night.  

But there are several people including family members stating that they both slept over at each other's houses.  
I think he planned to sleep over but eventually he had left home. Sue described in her book that the bed in the guest room Eric was supposed to sleep in that night wasn't even touched when she woke up the next morning. Apparently Eric ended up not staying at Dylan's, I wonder why.
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:23 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
liquorvamp wrote:
Have there been any reports or stories of either one sleeping over at one another's house? Or drinking and passing out there? IDK why it's kinda cute and endearing to me.

You mean about Eric and Dylan?  Yes.  Eric in fact "slept" over at Dylan's on April 16 99.  They made the bt from Dylan's house that night.  

But there are several people including family members stating that they both slept over at each other's houses.  
I think he planned to sleep over but eventually he had left home. Sue described in her book that the bed in the guest room Eric was supposed to sleep in that night wasn't even touched when she woke up the next morning. Apparently Eric ended up not staying at Dylan's, I wonder why.

Dylan's dad stated that Eric left the next morning without the duffle bag he had arrived with. IMO, Eric DID stay overnight. They just didn't sleep. I think they stayed up the entire night practicing gearing up and other preparations.
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:32 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
liquorvamp wrote:
Have there been any reports or stories of either one sleeping over at one another's house? Or drinking and passing out there? IDK why it's kinda cute and endearing to me.

You mean about Eric and Dylan?  Yes.  Eric in fact "slept" over at Dylan's on April 16 99.  They made the bt from Dylan's house that night.  

But there are several people including family members stating that they both slept over at each other's houses.  
I think he planned to sleep over but eventually he had left home. Sue described in her book that the bed in the guest room Eric was supposed to sleep in that night wasn't even touched when she woke up the next morning. Apparently Eric ended up not staying at Dylan's, I wonder why.

Dylan's dad stated that Eric left the next morning without the duffle bag he had arrived with.  IMO, Eric DID stay overnight.  They just didn't sleep.  I think they stayed up the entire night practicing gearing up and other preparations.
Where did he say that? He must've left super early then, Sue says he was gone when she woke up. You're right - if he really stayed, they most likely didn't sleep at all. Sometimes I wonder how much tension they must've felt as the day got closer.
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:34 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
liquorvamp wrote:
Have there been any reports or stories of either one sleeping over at one another's house? Or drinking and passing out there? IDK why it's kinda cute and endearing to me.

You mean about Eric and Dylan?  Yes.  Eric in fact "slept" over at Dylan's on April 16 99.  They made the bt from Dylan's house that night.  

But there are several people including family members stating that they both slept over at each other's houses.  
I think he planned to sleep over but eventually he had left home. Sue described in her book that the bed in the guest room Eric was supposed to sleep in that night wasn't even touched when she woke up the next morning. Apparently Eric ended up not staying at Dylan's, I wonder why.

Dylan's dad stated that Eric left the next morning without the duffle bag he had arrived with.  IMO, Eric DID stay overnight.  They just didn't sleep.  I think they stayed up the entire night practicing gearing up and other preparations.
Where did he say that? He must've left super early then, Sue says he was gone when she woke up. You're right - if he really stayed, they most likely didn't sleep at all. Sometimes I wonder how much tension they must've felt as the day got closer.

It was in the 11k. I will try to find the exact page
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:38 pm

Ok here it is: This is on pg 10513 in the 11k:[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:51 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Thank You!
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Fri Jun 03, 2016 5:16 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Thank you guys.

I don't think they slept at all when together.

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 5:54 am

I think that Dylan looked to Eric as a brother and saw a lot of himself in Eric. Not only that Dylan didn't want to disappoint Eric.
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:13 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] that's interesting...I see that as possible, how about vice versa? How does Eric see Dylan and what if he disappointed him?

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 6:29 am

I think when you have a friendship that deep that you feel that comfortable with someone ... if Dylan would have told Eric No! I really don't think Eric would have involved the school..,and i don't think he would have pushed Dylan... but i don't believe Eric Would be here today either way ... it sounds to me  both had there minds made up in what they were doing.
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 8:09 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] such an interesting dynamic where two people kept their promise to commit the worse till the end. Hence why Columbine is extremely interesting, even Eric and Dylan as individuals.

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 9:54 am

Do you believe there was anything or anyone that could have come in between Eric and Dylan? I'm sure Nate could have come between the two if he had known. Even till this day Nate still visits Sue whenever he's in town.

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 10:50 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
Do you believe there was anything or anyone that could have come in between Eric and Dylan? I'm sure Nate could have come between the two if he had known. Even till this day Nate still visits Sue whenever he's in town.
good question.
I.....mmmh, I think it would depend on when the person came between them. If it were way too far into their planning I doubt it would work, the two were set and ready to kill and die. Haven't really thought this through. I think it would depend on who aswell.
Maybe eric and dylan had the most fated connection ever and nothing could slice it apart.

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 5:08 pm

I do not believe that anything could have come between them... except a parent, but other than that NO...
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 7:14 pm

Maybe a girlfriend? If either of them ever had one.

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 7:17 pm

True...
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 9:28 pm

I think they both established that a murder-suicide was their only way out. They basically raised their white flags up to people and the world, they must've been extremely determined no turning back. Love, sex, a parent, it would have to be a whole 360 to get through to them and snap them out of it. Nevertheless going back to 1999, nobody did.

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Sun Jun 05, 2016 9:31 pm

I know this dosent really have anything to do with this but .... With eric's broken nose ... Forgive me if im wrong but if his nasal bone had gotten pushed up far enough it probably would have snapped him back into reality it would have hit his frontal lobe which controls emotion feeling pretty much our identities and Who We Are
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Mon Jun 06, 2016 8:54 am

Well it didn't really snap him back in a good way but more like made him woozy and disoriented, so they stopped at the library and went back down to try the bombs again. In a way thankfully perhaps it halted him from shooting more.

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Tue Jun 07, 2016 8:34 am

I don't think anyone could have stepped between the 2 once they had guns. Their friends all said it was basically the 2 of them all the time. They did associate with others and have other friends but I don't think they spent a lot of time with anyone else.

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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Thu Jul 07, 2016 4:30 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:
I think Dylan suffered from Avoidant Personality (this theory is backed be some doctors) and people with this disorder have a very difficult time with "healthy" confrontation and saying "no" to other people. I don't think Dylan was necessarily intimidated by Eric and I don't think he was afraid of Eric.  He just simply couldn't say no to Eric. Maybe he felt some slight pity for Eric too, because it seems that Eric didn't have quite as many friends as Dylan.

The dynamics of their friendship fascinate me because they were so loyal to each other, and it's hard to imagine a teenage boy being that loyal to anyone.

Quite an interesting theory.
It is true that Dylan seems to had shown many avoidant tendencies, but many doctors choose to not give a diagnose of any personality disorder at such a young age. (They say that through adolescence, one's personality might change a lot. For example, something that is considered as - let us say - histrionic personality disorder for an adult, might be a temporary, but normal behaviour for a teen.) The tendencies must be very intensive to give such a diagnose to someone under 18 years.

I would rather say that in general, Dylan had clear Cluster C characteristics: yes, he had many attitudes that we consider as AvPD traits; but I think that he had some Dependent PD tendencies too. Relying on others and not being able to say no are typical among dependents too.
These two come very often in comorbidity.
An avoidant is practically the parody of the "stereotypical introvert" behaviour: distant, self-conscious, awkwardly focused on not being critized or not giving others reason to critize him/her; usually has only very few - but really close - friends; polite but distant towards others. In such extremities, dependent tendencies might occur: these very few people become extremely important and so the patient becomes dependent of them.

Yes, Eric did not have so many friends - this might strengthened their relying on each other. I do not believe that Dylan was afraid of Eric either.
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PostSubject: Re: Between the two: Why Dylan Couldn't Say No to Eric   Thu Jul 07, 2016 10:12 pm

I agree with you [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

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