Why aren't you convinced?

jada887 wrote:

Yup, psychopathy is a spectrum, as you stated. However, I got Eric scored around 27 (using Dr. Hare's checklist), and Dylan, 18.
2.

For those curious, here's how I graded Eric (2=applies, 1=somewhat, 0=not at all):

1. Do you have "excess glibness" or superficial charm?

My Score: 2. (Eric displayed superficial charm to his parents and girls he wanted to attract in school. However, most of Eric's friends and girlfriends stated that he wasn't very charming and could be unpleasant when crossed or rejected, so it appears he could turn the charm on to accomplish his goals and off when his "charm" didn't work.)

2. Do you have a grandiose sense of self-worth?

My Score: 1. (Eric's wanted others to admire his genius and felt hurt or upset when his peers didn't reciprocate. He's a vulnerable narcissist, not a grandiose one.)

3. Do you have an excessive need for stimulation or proneness to boredom?

My Score: 2 Eric played hours of video games, participated in minor acts of vandalism and a van break-in, had an active social life, etc. Also, he looked very bored when he was talking with his friends, proof that he wasn't one for small talk. He needed constant stimulation.

4. Are you a pathological liar?

My Score: 2 Eric had no problem lying and had no need for the truth.

5. Are you conning or manipulative?

My Score: 2 Eric frequently conned his parents and friends into doing his bidding (e.g., lying about not making any more weapons, going on missions).

6. Do you display a lack of remorse or guilt?

My Score: 1 Eric had the ability to feel remorse and guilt, however those emotions weren't stable. It seems he could feel remorse one moment, and nothing the next.

7. Do you have "shallow affect"?

My Score: 0 No proof of this.

8. Are you callous, or do you lack empathy?

My Score: 1 My answer is identical to No. 6 on this list.

9. Do you have a "parasitic lifestyle"?

My Score: 0 There's no proof of that here. Eric worked until his death on April 20 and payed for all his expenses. He didn't live off others. Because Brooks didn't expect Eric to pay for gas when he carpooled with him in his sophomore year, that fact doesn't count.

10. Do you have poor behavioral controls?

My Score: 2 Eric could not keep his anger in check; and he found that he couldn't hold out until April.

11. Do you have a history of promiscuous sexual behavior?

My Score: 0 There's no proof that Eric had a history of one-night stands, although he had some platonic relationships with girls.

12. Do you have a history of early behavioral problems?

My Score: 0Once again, there's no proof of this.

13. Do you lack realistic long-term goals?/b]

My Score: 2 NBK is an unrealistic, crazy scheme.

14. Are you overly impulsive?

My Score: 1 Eric could be impulsive, as well as highly motivated.

15. Do you have a high level of irresponsibility?

My Score: 1 There's some proof that Eric could be responsible, as well as irresponsible (e.g., skipping out on homework, starting fires, vandalism, etc).

16. Do you fail to accept responsibility for your own actions?

My Score: 2 Definitely applies.

17. Have you had many short-term "marital" relationships?

My Score: 1 Eric often broke up with others, and there is no proof he cheated on those he dated.

18. Do you have a history of juvenile delinquency?

My Score: 2 Eric had a criminal record before Columbine.

19. Have you ever experienced a "revocation of conditional release"?

My Score: 2 Eric never broke the terms of his probation, however, he planned and executed the NBK plan, which is a violation of conditional release.

20. Do you display "criminal versatility"?

My Score: 2 Yes, if Eric survived the attack, he would be arrested for first-degree murder, another felony in addition to the van break-in, which was another felony.

Score: 27

jada887 wrote:

Yup, psychopathy is a spectrum, as you stated. However, I got Eric scored around 25 (using Dr. Hare's checklist), and Dylan, 18.

Here's Dylan on the checklist (so that I can save typing all the same questions, I will just copy and paste the checklist with my answers:)

1.) Do you have "excess glibness" or superficial charm?

Answer: 0

2.)  Do you have a grandiose sense of self-worth?

Answer: 0

3.) Do you have an excess need for stimulation or proneness to boredom?

Answer: 2

4. Are you a pathological liar?

Answer: 1

5. Are you conning or manipulative?

Answer: 2

6. Do you display a lack of remorse or guilt?

Answer: 1

7. Do you have "shallow affect"?

Answer: 0

8. Are you callous, or do you lack empathy?

Answer: 1

9. Do you have a "parasitic lifestyle"?

Answer: 0

10. Do you have poor behavioral controls?

Answer: 2

11. Do you have a history of promiscuous sexual behavior?

Answer: 0

12. Do you have a history of early behavioral problems?

Answer: 0

13. Do you lack realistic long-term goals?

Answer: 0

14. Are you overly impulsive?

Answer: 2

15. Do you have a high level of irresponsibility?

Answer: 2

16. Do you fail to accept responsibility for your own actions?

Answer: 0 (Dylan did not exonerate himself when he confessed to the van break-in. although he failed to internal his punishment or see the immorality of what he'd done: not the same thing as lying about his involvement or removing himself from allresponsibility, as Eric had done.)

17. Have you had many short-term "marital" relationships?

Answer: 0

18. Do you have a history of juvenile delinquency?

Answer: 2

19. Have you ever experienced a "revocation of conditional release"?

Answer: 2

20. Do you display "criminal versatility"?

Answer: 2

Score: 19

With this topic bumped, a lot for me to pick from.

I think Patti and Brian were shot at first, before even Rachel and Richard. The usual story says they were shot after Dylan went down and back up the stairs, shortly before they enter the school.

I don't think they ever were going to shoot from the parking lot. I think starting up on the stairs was by design. As for Eric shooting at police and not Dylan; I think that was his job outside and why he stayed up on the stairs. Dylan descended to shoot at students; Eric stayed up to cover his back.  Perhaps this influenced the gun choices: the Tec-9 for the initial shooting of students fleeing outside, the carbine for cops, and the shotguns for entering the school. But without the bombs Dylan still had the TEC-9 ammo. 

I don't think both bombs failed at 11:17.  I think both bombs were set for different times, they started shooting shortly before the first one went off, and the second one was supposed to go off while they were in the library.  I think they were shooting people in there to draw cops in to die from the bomb as well.

I don't think cops stayed outside because of outdated hostage protocol; I think it was fear of bombs.

Im convinced I wont fully understand how they ended up there.

Im also slightly convinced that people that have written about Columbine, oftentimes likes their version of truth. Somehow.

Im not entirely convinced what to believe regarding the bullying, allthough Im slightly some of it must have happened. Just, not in the sense we have been taught. And not in the way Brooks Brown potrays it.

Allthough Im aware that some experts have argued otherwise- I E, that they werent bullied