Thoughts on the Klebolds' family dynamic?

After having recently read and watched a few interviews pertaining to narcissism—and having experienced the effects of narcissism firsthand—I started thinking about the Klebolds' family dynamics and it really got me thinking about how this could've potentially led to Dylan's own narc traits?

Don't get me wrong, I'm merely theorising here. I'm sure the Klebolds were genuinely blindsided by the massacre and my heart goes out to them, but I was just wondering if anyone had any thoughts on this, and whether they'd be able to share? I have quite a few thoughts myself concerning it, but unfortunately I don't have the confidence to post, given that 1) I'm new to these forums, and 2) I'm not exactly a great "researcher".

But this is something I'd really like to know peoples' thoughts on.

EDIT: Writing this to say that I am aware of the comments prompting elaboration, and I'll be more than happy to do so when I get around to it. I'm not particularly busy but my attention has been abhorrent and in the midst of a lengthy depressive episode, this just seems to be one of the things on the lower end of my priorities. Thanks to those who've decided to interact and prompt. It's greatly appreciated!

Perhaps you should share some of these articles and videos to help us understand where you're coming from. I'm not saying you're right or wrong, I just think a little more context would be useful here.

I can see where you’re coming from. Some of these topics have been touched on!


I’ll write more later

QuestionMark wrote:

Perhaps you should share some of these articles and videos to help us understand where you're coming from. I'm not saying you're right or wrong, I just think a little more context would be useful here.

I agree.

Share some articles or elaborate on what your thoughts are. I am interested to know what you think about the family dynamic that the Klebolds had, but we really need some more context. It's okay to share your opinion even if you are new here. Many people do it.

made_not_born wrote:

After having recently read and watched a few interviews pertaining to narcissism—and having experienced the effects of narcissism firsthand—I started thinking about the Klebolds' family dynamics and it really got me thinking about how this could've potentially led to Dylan's own narc traits?

I'd never really thought about Dylan having narcissistic traits, but a recent book detailed them and I can see now that he did seem to have some. An excerpt:

Quote :

In addition to labeling Eric a psychopath, he has also been deemed a narcissist. In the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM), people with Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) are assigned particular behavioral traits. In the past, diagnosis required that an individual possess at least five of the traits from that list. In 2011, the American Psychiatric Association slightly revised the criteria for NPD in the fifth edition of the DSM, however, Harris’s “diagnosis” was made utilizing the traits outlined in DSM-IV. These criteria include:
A grandiose sense of self-importance
A preoccupation with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
Belief that he or she is special and unique and can only be understood by other special people
A requirement for excessive admiration
A strong sense of entitlement
Taking advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
Lacking empathy
Often envious of others or believes others are envious of him/her
Arrogant affect

For the author, if one is to adhere to this list for diagnosis, then it appears to describe both Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold. As mentioned, it is unclear why no one has ever pointed out that Dylan possessed the same narcissistic tendencies. Both boys, through their writings and in the “Basement Tapes,” appeared to possess a grandiose sense of self-importance and a strong sense of entitlement. Both believed that only other equally special people (those with self-awareness, other “gods”) could truly understand them. In fact, the latter trait was likely the basis for the bond the two boys forged with one another. Klebold, and Harris to a lesser extent, often expressed envy over the lives, relationships, and possessions of peers. While Eric appeared to be preoccupied with fantasies of power over others, Dylan seemed consumed with the notion of attaining a pure and perfect love. Both Harris and Klebold, at least in the last year of their lives during the preparation for the attack on Columbine, took advantage of others in order to achieve their ultimate goal. Of the two, Eric was the one who seemed to most desire admiration from his peers, writing in his journal and in notes to a friend that he was not receiving the respect he deserved. Harris certainly appears to fit the majority of criteria for a diagnosis with Narcissistic Personality Disorder, but it should be acknowledged that Klebold’s behavior seems equally consistent with the condition. However, there is enough evidence to suggest that neither boy should be classified as such. True narcissists suffer from poor self-esteem, as Dylan and Eric surely did. The true narcissist will do whatever it takes to avoid having to face their weaknesses. They are quite practiced at twisting every situation so that their fragile ego is protected and they are not made to take stock of their failings. Harris and Klebold appear to have lied to themselves and to one another about their superiority, but there is every indication that they did not truly believe in it. It was more likely a method to cope with a world and with people they could not control or make accept them. Both boys in moments of private candor indicated as such, and recognized this poor self-image as a significant factor in their unhappiness and behaviors.

As others have mentioned, I would also be interested in your opinions on how the Klebold family dynamic may have contributed to these traits in Dylan.

Guest wrote:

After having recently read and watched a few interviews pertaining to narcissism—and having experienced the effects of narcissism firsthand—I started thinking about the Klebolds' family dynamics and it really got me thinking about how this could've potentially led to Dylan's own narc traits?

I'm not entirely convinced Dylan had narcissistic traits or Narcissism Personality Disorder (NPD). Granted, Dylan could be egocentric and self-centered, however narcissism is very different from egoism and egocentrism, which is a strong tendency to act in one's own self-interest and regard the self as all-important. Narcissism, or NPD, on the other hand, exhibits seven symptoms that Wikipedia erroneously calls "the seven deadly sins" (albeit quoted from two psychologists). Those are shamelessness, arrogance (e.g., debasing someone's self-worth to inflate your own), envy, entitlement, exploitation, lack of personal boundaries, and distorted sense of self (e.g., a person's belief that they are perfect). In order to meet the criteria for diagnoses, you would have to exhibit five of the traits listed. Based on my observations, Dylan exhibits one of the seven, and that is the penultimate, lack of personal boundaries.