The Basement Tapes?

So, what are your thoughts on them? Are they ever going to be released? Probably not in my lifetime and if they do, I'll probably be really old. Aren't they locked away for at least 50 years? Sad thing is, didn't the idiot sheriff have the option to release them and he said no? Damn him!

There is still a chance if this sheriff is replaced eventually, his replacement has the choice to release them anyway.

I doubt they will be released. If they are released and some kid shoots up his high school afterwards, there going to blame the tapes and who ever released them. So, I don't think anyone wants to be responsible for that.

I do wonder if there is a way to request to see the tapes or maybe through a law suit? After all, it is our tax dollars that the sheriff department is using to keep the tapes locked up.

I kind of don't care about the basement tapes anymore. Seeing those two awful kids rant about everything under the sun doesn't sound that appealing. Nothing they have to say is intelligent or compelling.

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I saw someone say once that they filed a report for them to be released. This was what they got back: “1) They were sealed in local court, and are immune to any further viewing/investigation for a long time. 2) They are being held for privacy reasons , as well as security ( copycats etc).” They said the only way to get them to be released now would be to go to Federal Court. The only other date I’ve heard they may be released is in 2026/2027. Maybe they will release screenshots and/or just parts of the tapes.

A few years ago, the new JeffCo sheriff was granted the final call by the courts on whether or not to release the tapes as he (the Sheriff) saw fit; at that time, he determined he would not release them, and may never release the tapes during his tenure for fear of “copy-cats”. (Though I honestly don’t see how releasing the tapes is going to provoke anyone to pull off a “copycat shooting” anymore than any other information that is alreafy released about Columbine)

I am hopeful that some of the people who knew Eric and Dylan might break their silence. I expect to see a few more books released before all is said and done.

What I really wonder is, why the really are hidden away. Rampart Rampage actually showed E/D using the guns they used in the massacre, not to mention the writing in their journals seems like basically the same thing.

It’s so weird to know that those tapes exist somewhere in this world. So many.. possible answers.. right there.
But I question.. what about that 29 second leaked clip of them talking? (Though I have heard that the Basement Tapes were originally shown on the news, and that may just be a short clip that was recorded at the time). You never know, there could be more things just waiting to be leaked out there.

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I hope they are released soon. Using taxpayers money to supress information should be illegal.

I don't think they're ever going to be released.

I still don't think they're going to be released, either. I mean, you never know, and the "copycat" excuse is older than the hills, and so many have occurred since then, anyway. It seems that they feel that these tapes will be more fuel potential shooters will use to commit such acts. I don't necessarily agree with that, but I do think that is one of the reasons they have for keeping them locked up.

In this video from 2006, right before they released the documents/portions of their journals, the sherriff makes it clear (to me, at least) that releasing them would play right into their desires to be worshiped. When you look at the way some people already act, particularly on certain sites, it is hard to argue with him on that point, no matter how corrupt the whole law force there may be.

I have no idea how these things work, but Eric and Dylan's families and their attorneys may have also done something to prevent their release. If I am entirely wrong about that, please correct me.

I personally have wondered if the basement tapes were released if we might see a cessation of the hero worship. Or at least if it would let up a little. Perhaps if people saw more of the hateful, angry Eric and Dylan they would have a harder time turning them into role models and/or harmless teddy bears.
I've wondered the same thing about the release of the full 911 call from the library. I see why officials won't release it; it is after all an audio recording of murder. I think far fewer people could look up to E&D or relate to them or make excuses for them if they could hear how completely terrifying E&D actually were.

For some reason I think they'll never be released, enough time has passed, why would the have to wait so much?
Their release could either stop the worship or fuck up their worshippers even more if they have some issues but I don't believe it would create copycats, since Columbine there have been more school shooting even without the release of the BT, I think who wants to shoot up his school or is against it already has his ideas clear, it wouldn't make normal kids violent.

Pardon, this makes little sense, I have too many opinions about it to write them down decently.

The whole logic of if they were going to release them, they would have done it by now because there isn't any point to waiting longer, doesn't really work. The parents' depositions are being kept back until 2027. I can very well imagine that the basement tapes are considered at least as potentially explosive as the depositions.

"what about that 29 second leaked clip of them talking?"

There's a leaked clip of the basement tapes??

MarmaladeSkies wrote:

"what about that 29 second leaked clip of them talking?"

There's a leaked clip of the basement tapes??

Yes, there is. The clip of them talking about the girls in their Psychology class.

Rachel's dad snuck in a recorder to a basement tapes viewing.


I tried asking him about it long ago but he ignored me.

He only released that part because it related to his daughter.

Most of the parents watching the basement tapes weren't in ANY kind of emotional state to process the information properly, and most knew little about Eric and Dylan and their motives. (and still do not to this day, given that none of them have even tried to get Frank DeAngelis fired or to change the school's culture there)

They weren't even talking about his daughter.

It seemed that way at the time to him though, so he heavily fixated on that part.

He REALLY needs to release all of the tape though. :/

You can find the clip online pretty easily.
I sort of think all this calling for the basement tapes is pointless. Yes, they would be more information and yes, they would answer some questions. But it seems like, with Columbine, for every 1 question answered, 100 more appear.

I'm sure this has been rehashed so many times but I thought that maybe bringing it up may shed some light on it... Has anyone ever tried to file a F.O.I.A (Freedom of Information Act) to have the tapes released? I would think that these would be accessible through that.

The mention of the F.O.I.A. is something I hadn't considered as a possibility.. I don't think I'd be able to file it, being a non-US citizen, but it'd be interesting to see what they'd do with such an appeal instead of the usual "please give us the tapes"-talk. I'm still holding out the secret hope that maybe one day they'll come to their senses enough to give us at least a small part of the tapes, but I think I'd have better success rooting for the release of the depositions in 2027 instead. I have this sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach that what we know about the tapes isn't even everything and that there are scenes/comments that have been withheld for whatever reason and that some of the stuff in there might overhaul the entire case again..  

@thedragonrampant: what do they conceal us according to your opinion?

2027 is so far away. But I remember the reason they don´t release it was not the copycats, it was the requirement of the killers parents. (I am not sure maybe I am wrong)

One time I dreamed about the tapes, it was really crazy. At first both guys were fucking happy about attack, but then it turned and they cried.

em81 wrote:

@thedragonrampant: what do they conceal us according to your opinion?

Quite honestly, I have no clue! It just seems to me that the transcripts we have don't match up to the hours of tapes the boys made. (You'd have to act them out to be sure, I guess, but it just feels off to me somehow.) It's a gut feeling that there's more to them, but I don't have an idea as to what could be hidden from the public. Maybe I'm just really paranoid, though. ;) 

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2027 is so far away. But I remember the reason they don´t release it was not the copycats, it was the requirement of the killers parents. (I am not sure maybe I am wrong)

You mean the court depositions? They're the only things with a definite 2027-release. There's no release date for the basement tapes. JeffCo keeps citing the FBI's advice to not release them for fear of copycats (and hero worship?) and I also recall reading something similar to what you're saying about their families not wanting them to be released. I just don't know.. I have never read a reason that's 'good enough' to withhold these tapes from the public, especially because we do have their transcripts and a video like Rampart Range and whatever..

thedragonrampant wrote:

Quite honestly, I have no clue! It just seems to me that the transcripts we have don't match up to the hours of tapes the boys made. (You'd have to act them out to be sure, I guess, but it just feels off to me somehow.) It's a gut feeling that there's more to them, but I don't have an idea as to what could be hidden from the public. Maybe I'm just really paranoid, though. ;) 

I agree with this point completely, the transcripts definitely do not match up to the time limits. In another post I mentioned this:

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This is slightly off topic but when I was at University we had to make tapes for 'counselling sessions' which ran for around 30 minuets and was just two people doing a practice session, pauses etc were not uncommon but trying to write a transcript for a tape took forever and it was not uncommon to think 'oh no i have 5 pages and i'm only just half way through a tape.' So I feel there is no way even with pauses / time to show off weapons etc that the transcripts we have are full ones, it's not possible in my opinion.
Then that raises the whole question of well, what were they talking about / doing on the tapes if they ran for that amount of time?
Like you also suggested perhaps the Time magazine people were sat down and just watched everything straight through and had to take notes on what they could and these were things that just ended up getting written down.

The Columbine Documents pg(10374 - 10383) and the Time magazine article offer similarities of what is said on the basement tapes. But obviously unless Time magazine had prolonged access to the tapes it would be difficult for them to describe exactly what they heard in its entirety, or maybe they were not shown the full tapes in the first place. I don't believe the official transcripts we have reflect 3 hours worth of footage.

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We talked about the basement tapes here as well and this may answer some of the questions posted in this thread.

I know in the last thread about the Deep Web it got closed due to discussions about porn. I just want to make it clear that all I'm talking about in this post is just my search for the tapes in this deep web. I f it does turn into discussions about that please just remove the posts rather than closing the whole thread.
After reading the Deep Web thread I got interested and managed to get inside it. (Through a specific program named Tor.) In the beginning you're told to go to the "hidden wiki" which is a general index of the most popular sites. As you would probably have guessed it didn't have any links on there so I had to search on my own. I began with a broad search of "columbine basement tapes" and was greeted with two forums discussing the tapes. One had a post claiming to have found the tapes but upon further inspection it turned out to be that 30 second audio clip floating around. After a few hours of research that's really all that turned up, even after narrowing down searches with booleons and the other things you use. I think the Deep Web is more of a in or out thing; you have o be in the know to get certain things as there wasn't really much to be found out just be searching the browser.
I also want to note if any of you are planning on doing some more searches you are barraged by some disgusting content so be warned.

The Deep Web thread did go off topic into inappropriate subjects not at all associated with Columbine and it is understandable it was closed. I linked it just because there was some interesting discussion about the basement tapes before it got closed which seemed relevant to this thread. I often wonder if there is more to the 30 second audio clip. With regards to that clip in particular, it was allegedly released to prove E/D were discussing Rachel Scott which turned out not to be the case. I'm wondering if whoever recorded the clip recorded much more or had viewed the tapes previously and went back to the second viewing armed with a audio recording device.

There's further discussion and speculation about the tapes in [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] from a while back, too.

Unfortunately, I doubt the basement tapes will be released anytime soon - if ever. It seems slightly suspicious how the transcripts from the basement tapes have been released, but not the actual tapes.

tragedy79 wrote:

There is still a chance if this sheriff is replaced eventually, his replacement has the choice to release them anyway.

Is that true?

-eulogy- wrote:

tragedy79 wrote:

There is still a chance if this sheriff is replaced eventually, his replacement has the choice to release them anyway.

Is that true?

I've heard this as well, but I'm not sure about the source.. AColumbineSite writes the following, so I'm guessing this is where part of the statement comes from (bolded mine):

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In 2006, the courts allowed Jefferson County Sheriff Ted Mink (who took the job after John Stone) the choice to release the Basement Tapes to the public but he decided not to, on the basis that he feared that other troubled youths would see the tapes as a "call to arms" and a "how-to instruction video" to attack their own schools. He decided to release 946 pages of previously unreleased documents (including diaries belonging to the shooters, day planners and schoolwork, and a journal written by Eric's father Wayne Harris). An earlier Supreme Court ruling allowed the parents of the shooters to appeal the decision to release the documents, and Wayne Harris tried to do just that. However, the courts ruled that the Columbine Documents would indeed be released as a supplement to the Columbine Report.

I am really sure we will never see them.

The Klebold only saw the last tape. Eric parents have seen none of none of them. I did not know this. I thought if my son would do such a thing, I wanted to see everything.

thedragonrampant wrote:

I've heard this as well, but I'm not sure about the source.. AColumbineSite writes the following, so I'm guessing this is where part of the statement comes from (bolded mine):

Quote :

In 2006, the courts allowed Jefferson County Sheriff Ted Mink (who took the job after John Stone) the choice to release the Basement Tapes to the public but he decided not to, on the basis that he feared that other troubled youths would see the tapes as a "call to arms" and a "how-to instruction video" to attack their own schools. He decided to release "946 pages" of previously unreleased documents (including diaries belonging to the shooters, day planners and schoolwork, and a journal written by Eric's father Wayne Harris). An earlier Supreme Court ruling allowed the parents of the shooters to appeal the decision to release the documents, and Wayne Harris tried to do just that. However, the courts ruled that the Columbine Documents would indeed be released as a supplement to the Columbine Report.

em81 wrote:

I am really sure we will never see them.

The Klebold only saw the last tape. Eric parents have seen none of none of them. I did not know this. I thought if my son would do such a thing, I wanted to see everything.

I can't make my mind up on this, most of the time I think we will just never see them, and even if we do they will not be in their entirety. We have an indication of how long each tape lasts and i bet if they were released the actual viewing times would differ.

The Klebold's only saw the last tape? I was under the impression they saw them all. In Far From the Tree it is mentioned that they saw the basement tapes, Mrs Klebold says: "Seeing those videos was as traumatic as the original event." She mentions "the anti-Semitic stuff"  and that they went through "every derogatory word."
She also says the tapes "would provide a lasting contradiction to anything that could be said about his character" and also that she wanted to destroy them. I could be wrong but I presumed from these statements that they had seen all if not most of the tapes.

You're right there's nothing that we have that indicates Eric's family had seen the tapes, they may have or may not have.
I included the statement by thedragonrampant in this post because it mentions Wayne Harris trying to stop the release of the 946 pages of documents which I have come across before. Based on media sources it would seem the Harris family spent a lot of time and no doubt money trying to prevent the release of these documents and I would imagine they would do the same if it came down to the basement tapes getting released.
In Jeff Kass' book he mentions: "Should the basement tapes be made public?" he says the Klebolds and their attorney said "no."

These articles are interesting as they mention Wayne Harris trying to prevent the release of the additional Columbine documents:
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"The Post is seeking notes written by Wayne Harris, Eric's father, about the two teenagers; medical records of Harris and Klebold; the audiotapes and videotapes they made; and their writings, including school papers, notations in the Columbine yearbook and diaries.
Also Tuesday, Wayne Harris disputed the Supreme Court's determination that private records seized by a search warrant are criminal justice records.
There is nothing in state law to suggest that the General Assembly intended that items seized during an official search be classified as "criminal justice records" that can be made public, he said.
Michael Montgomery, Harris' lawyer, said the Supreme Court decision rewrote the Colorado Criminal Justice Records Act and inserted completely new and different procedures."

I highlighted the section about "video tapes" as I am wondering if this could refer to or include the basement tapes? Just a side note the article was published in 2005. The Rampart Range Tape was released in October 2003, the cafeteria footage, H4H and other videos had already been released by this point. I'm wondering if the Harris family believed at this point that the basement tapes could be released? I'm just throwing this question out there but if so, would it have not made sense for them to have seen the tapes?
Likewise could the audiotape refer to the Nixon Tape?

"Columbine records decision challenged
12/21/2005

In a decision handed down last month, the Colorado Supreme Court decided that Jefferson County Sheriff Ted Mink should be able to decide whether to release evidence seized after the 1999 Columbine High School shootings now, that decision has been delayed.
Wayne Harris, father of Columbine killer Eric Harris, petitioned the high court for a rehearing within the allowed 15-day period to make such a request.
The petition allows for further arguments about the courts decision that seized items after the shootings, including the so-called "basement tapes" made by the killers before the massacre, and other items taken from the killers homes, are part of criminal justice records and are subject to release unless proven to be detrimental to the public interest.
The court had ruled that Mink, in his official capacity as sheriff, should be able to review the records and decide whether to release them instead of a judge making that determination.
Wayne Harris is challenging the ruling that the records are criminal justice records. He has repeatedly argued that the items are personal property and should be returned to him and not made public. Michael Montgomery, Harris attorney, did not return several phone calls.
The Denver Post, which is seeking the release of the records, also used last weeks hearing to voice its concern over the decision to let Mink be the deciding factor.
Steve Zansberg, an attorney for The Denver Post, said Mink should not be allowed to make the decision about the seized items because he has previously said he does not want them released.
"(Mink) took the position that if (the records) are subject to the Colorado Criminal Justice Records Act, they should not be disclosed," Zansberg said. "Now, were asking the court if his denial was proper."
Zansberg said the state Supreme Court must now decide whether to reverse its earlier ruling or not. If it does not, Mink has said he will solicit input from a variety of interested people about whether the release of the records is in the public interest."
(I don't have a link to the above article it was just something I had saved a while back)

I know this has been mentioned before but does anybody know how much if any control the families would have over the release of the tapes? Fighting the release of the journals etc (even though many believe they are not in complete form) did not seem to work, perhaps if both families had filed an objection it may have added more weight to the case. I don't know too much about this.  

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Interesting Denver Post article: "Rohrbaugh (Rohrbbough) continues to battle for release of the "basement tapes" and other materials, saying that information "would show what was happening in their homes and their involvement with law enforcement and what utter, foolish idiots they were."

I read "Far from the Tree" too. I liked it very much. The infos that the Klebolds watched only one tape was new for me.

My sources for my statment:

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I do not know if the families would have any co ntrol about the release. I understand that they did not want the release. They suffered a lot. But I think that to relase the tapes is very important.

Rohrbough says the tapes should be released so the public can see "what utter, foolish idiots they were."

Actually, this is a reason not to release them. Harris and Klebold really were immature, even for high school students. While their words are of public interest, the images of their behavior are not. In my opinion, the tapes should be occasionally screened for audiences that are not allowed to record them.

em81 wrote:

I read "Far from the Tree" too. I liked it very much. The infos that the Klebolds watched only one tape was new for me.

My sources for my statment:

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That's really interesting, I wonder where Time got that information from. The comments in Far From the Tree to me i felt implied they had seen more than just one tape. Especially since Sue mentions specific language that was used in the tape which is not on the final tape. Unless when the Time article was published they had only seen the final tape and since then they have seen more.

I read this article and got the impression that there is more than the known quotes...

Yes, that could be true. The interviews with the Klebold for "Far from the tree" took place from 2005-2007. Time article is from 1999.

em81 wrote:

I read this article and got the impression that there is more than the known quotes...

Yes, that could be true. The interviews with the Klebold for "Far from the tree" took place from 2005-2007. Time article is from 1999.

If I understand correctly then yes I agree and also get the impression that there is more than the known quotes. As we have discussed on this site before it's highly unlikely the transcripts that we have would accurately match up to the length of time the basement tapes supposedly last for. The transcripts appear very short in length considering they were written for sometimes lengthy sections of tape.

It is a likely scenario that the Klebolds could have initially only seen one tape then seen the rest at a later date. Especially as Sue seems to mention them using derogatory words then gives examples in FFTT, such words were not used in the final tape but were in previous recordings which made me think it is likely they have now seen other tapes.

What's with the word "CLUE" on the wall on the final tape? Does anybody have any info on it?

MarmaladeSkies wrote:

What's with the word "CLUE" on the wall on the final tape? Does anybody have any info on it?

Someone (probably Harris) drew a picture of a bomb on his wall along with a drawing of the school and wrote "CLUE" on it.

(Personally I think this was one of the things he did to make it harder for him to back out).

lasttrain wrote:

MarmaladeSkies wrote:

What's with the word "CLUE" on the wall on the final tape? Does anybody have any info on it?

Someone (probably Harris) drew a picture of a bomb on his wall along with a drawing of the school and wrote "CLUE" on it.

(Personally I think this was one of the things he did to make it harder for him to back out).

I wonder why he did that. Whose benefit was it for? I mean his parents were never in his room, were they?

areyoulistening wrote:

lasttrain wrote:

MarmaladeSkies wrote:

What's with the word "CLUE" on the wall on the final tape? Does anybody have any info on it?

Someone (probably Harris) drew a picture of a bomb on his wall along with a drawing of the school and wrote "CLUE" on it.

(Personally I think this was one of the things he did to make it harder for him to back out).

I wonder why he did that. Whose benefit was it for? I mean his parents were never in his room, were they?

Well as I said I think it was one of a whole host of actions he undertook in order to make it hard to back out.

Planting the diversion bomb, leaving shotgun shells and a bomb by his bed, making the drawing (which could not be removed unless you painted over it), leaving the Nixon tape, even planting the bomb in the commons--these were all easy things to do, but they all made it progressively harder to back out.

Suppose he gets up there on the hill and he can't get up the nerve. He could turn around, but he'd have to get the bombs out of the cafeteria, face a potential investigation over the diversion bomb, run home and try to get the Nixon tape, somehow cover his wall.

People who have homicidal or suicidal ideation will often paint themselves into a corner like that.

Nobody addressed my question, so I'll ask it again, Wouldn't all of this fall under the freedom of information act? Has anyone ever tried filing one to get all of this released?
And the copycats BS.... They released all of the idiot from Virginia Techs crap why not this?

deathmedic wrote:

Nobody addressed my question, so I'll ask it again, Wouldn't all of this fall under the freedom of information act? Has anyone ever tried filing one to get all of this released?
And the copycats BS.... They released all of the idiot from Virginia Techs crap why not this?

Eric and Dylan were a lot more influential in terms of shootings, which could explain why it hasn't been released. As much as I hate to admit it they did cause a bit of a domino affect, with different people (Cho included) citing them as inspiration.

As for the freedom of information act, I have no clue (non American)

Exemption 7F of the Freedom of Information Act pertains to releasing information that might endanger someone's life. 7C is violation of privacy.

Seems like F is what they would cite. I'm not sure that a reporter would lose here, though.

deathmedic wrote:

Nobody addressed my question, so I'll ask it again, Wouldn't all of this fall under the freedom of information act? Has anyone ever tried filing one to get all of this released?
And the copycats BS.... They released all of the idiot from Virginia Techs crap why not this?

No, there was a series of legal battles and a judge ruled that the basement tapes do fall under the Colorado Criminal Justice Records Act (CCJRA) (meaning they're not private property). However, disclosure of the tapes is at the discretion of the county sheriff who oversaw the investigation. He opted out of releasing them for fear of copycats (ex. 7).

I just stumbled upon this in a search and it's essentially, another shooter's "Basement Tapes" - Alvaro Castillo - and it's all there for anyone to view on Youtube.  Alvaro goes into details as to why he's doing it, and also showing him spinning his homicidal and suicidal fantasies. In one tape you see him beating himself up to a particular movie that inspires his fantasies.  He was partially inspired by E & D (regardless of their tapes not being released) as well as media inspiration out there.  So, again, this begs the question as to why E & D's Basement Tapes are so special that Jeffco refuses to release them.  It's a double standard that other shooters tapes are released and not E & D's.  The whole justification is that releasing these videos will inspire other shooters..and yet, here it is, Alvaro's tapes accessible for any depressed, angry potential shooter to find inspiration from.

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InFiNiNcEX5 wrote:

I just stumbled upon this in a search and it's essentially, another shooter's "Basement Tapes" - Alvaro Castillo - and it's all there for anyone to view on Youtube.  Alvaro goes into details as to why he's doing it, and also showing him spinning his homicidal and suicidal fantasies. In one tape you see him beating himself up to a particular movie that inspires his fantasies.  He was partially inspired by E & D (regardless of their tapes not being released) as well as media inspiration out there.  So, again, this begs the question as to why E & D's Basement Tapes are so special that Jeffco refuses to release them.  It's a double standard that other shooters tapes are released and not E & D's.  The whole justification is that releasing these videos will inspire other shooters..and yet, here it is, Alvaro's tapes accessible for any depressed, angry potential shooter to find inspiration from.

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I've never seen these before thanks for posting. It is a double standard that Alvaro's tapes are on Youtube of all places and probably elsewhere all over the internet to view.
As I've mentioned before i don't believe the reason for not releasing Eric and Dylan's tapes are due to potential copycats. I feel like there's a lot more on those tapes than we know. Obviously there is no way the transcripts we have are in their entirety, which makes me wonder what else is on those tapes. I do feel like with the Basement Tapes, we have already been told how long each tape runs for, so if anything was ever released i would bet the running times would be significantly less than what we were originally told.