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 Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?

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PostSubject: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeWed May 20, 2015 2:27 am

I actually want to know this...why is the Dylan we read about in the Basement Tapes completely different to how we see him in his journals, and videos?

Apparently Cullen's FBI buddy who I can't remember his name for the life of me right now said "Dylan gave away himself with his eyes in the Basement Tapes"; "He kept glancing at his partner for his approval".

But I must know. None of us here have ever watched the tapes, so why is it Dylan acts so codly on these tapes? The Klebolds said when they watched the tape, "That was not my son". Did he hide himself THAT well? Or was he just trying to act all bad ass for his partner, Eric? Or vice versa?

Eric cried on the Basement Tapes. Dylan did not. Eric kept expressing remorse. Dylan barely expressed any. That last "Goodbye" tape said a lot between the two. Dylan really does seem like the leader in the basement tapes. He talks much more, he expresses much more hatred, and he even snaps his fingers at Eric because he was taking too long (lol). Why is this?
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeWed May 20, 2015 5:06 am

Because Dylan was good at hiding his angry and depressed side during typical day-to-day life. He seemed to be a lot better than Eric was at hiding his anger. The two were pretty much polar opposites when it came to inner demons and the masks they used to cover them. Much of Eric's personality comes across as someone whos trying their hardest to appear "macho". But when its just him filming he drops the act and shows a much more sympathetic attitude. Dylan was able to do the same when it came to letting his rage out during the BT. I personally believe that much of Dylan's attitude during the BT is him over-exaggerating his anger. Embodying "WRATH" and putting on for Eric because that's what the two of them did: feed each others rage. They were trying to one-up each other which in turn only made the urge to kill and die more stronger.

I don't consider either one to be the leader. I think they both took charge at different times depending on the situation. Sometime I think Dylan did this to eric as a way to make NBK bigger. Eric was the one who mainly worked on the big bombs. Egging him on so NBK would be something neither one would feel they could walk away from. Dylan was suicidal but he needed to be pushed into it. Baiting Eric to the point of multiple time bombs and an estimated death toll in the hundreds would seal his fate. Neither could go back to living a boring life after something like that, nor would they want to be caught alive. He would die in the attack which is the thing he said he wanted the most. And he wouldn't have to die all alone. That's why IMO he wasnt as into the attack as Eric was when it all started. After a few kills and entering the building it became a reality: He was going to die. At that point he got more involved during the time in the library.


This is all my opinion though. Dylan isn't really on the BT alone at any point. He didnt have the chance to be intimate and open with his feeling like Eric did.

P.S. - Sorry if I went a little off topic. I just find the boys interactions with each other extremely interesting. I'm not sure any of the evidence shows the true side of either boys.
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeWed May 20, 2015 11:21 am

Frankly, I think Dylan was in fact shy and had far moe social-anxiety issues than Eric did. Eric was not afraid of venting his anger in public and was prone to impulsive, reckless behavior (best example was destrying Brooks windscreen when Books was late to pick him up).

Dlan was not like taht. In public Dylan was shy and meek. Much like Cho was in fact. Only alone or just with Eric he felt free enough to express his anger.

I do not think either was a "leader", but I do think they had distinct and clearly defined role sin this. Dylan was the dreamer that invnted the idea of the spree-suicide, Eric was the guy that made it happen in reality.

Both were angry and both wanted to kill people. I do think Dylan's anger was more narrow, directed at people specificaly. Eric's anger was much more broad - Eric had a bef with modern society and everyday life as a whole.

Ido not think they fed eac otehr's rage, although I migth be wrong. What they did imho was showing each other the way out of a situation they both hated.

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeWed May 20, 2015 11:37 am

Good points everyone.

Do you think Dylan in the Basement Tapes is the true Dylan? Eric cut his macho crap in the tapes. He expressed remorse, constantly apologized, while Dylan didn't seem to give a damn. One line that stands out:

Dylan: "They gave me my fucking life. It's up to me what I do with it."

Eric: (shrugs) "My parents might have made some mistakes that they weren't really aware of."

And this isn't the only example. It's intriguing to see how different Dylan was here, and how angry, and cold he is. Personally, he does remind me of Cho, and I believe if he never got any help, nor ever met Eric he would have done a school shooting in college, just like Cho IMO.

Another thing that stands out...people to this day from CHS said it was not surprising Eric was involved. But they were all shocked that Dylan was involved. To this day, Dylan fooled everyone.

I have to bring up that Cullen is also a complete moron stating that Eric lied throughout his juvenile diversion. That was Dylan, but of course "Sweet innocent Dylan" never lied. He had no idea what was going on till 4/20

*rolls eyes
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeWed May 20, 2015 12:16 pm

lol wrote:
Good points everyone.

Do you think Dylan in the Basement Tapes is the true Dylan? Eric cut his macho crap in the tapes. He expressed remorse, constantly apologized, while Dylan didn't seem to give a damn. One line that stands out:

Dylan: "They gave me my fucking life. It's up to me what I do with it."

Eric: (shrugs) "My parents might have made some mistakes that they weren't really aware of."

And this isn't the only example. It's intriguing to see how different Dylan was here, and how angry, and cold he is. Personally, he does remind me of Cho, and I believe if he never got any help, nor ever met Eric he would have done a school shooting in college, just like Cho IMO.

Another thing that stands out...people to this day from CHS said it was not surprising Eric was involved. But they were all shocked that Dylan was involved. To this day, Dylan fooled everyone.

I have to bring up that Cullen is also a complete moron stating that Eric lied throughout his juvenile diversion. That was Dylan, but of course "Sweet innocent Dylan" never lied. He had no idea what was going on till 4/20

*rolls eyes

I think "everyday Dylan" and "basement tape Dylan" are both true Dylans. Just like meek Cho was as true as question-mark-Cho.
People behave differently in different circumstances and among different groups.

I think Dylan was probably capable of a university shooting, but we never know if he would have done so had it not been for Eric the "made it happen for real guy". Dylan was a dreamer, not an "action man" like Eric.

In the year before the shooting both Eric and Dylan tried hard to "calm down" their public presence, pretending to be passionately intereste din their future careers and given up on any illegal activities whatsoever. They both lied to everyone around them, at least since their anger management program.

Eric was much more conservative than Dylan was and Eric also (despite his nickname Reb) understood and valued authority (even if he decided he would go against all authorities). Dylan was not like that, he was not raised like taht. This is imho the reason why their "goodbye" statements to their families are so different.

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeWed May 20, 2015 1:20 pm

lol wrote:
I have to bring up that Cullen is also a complete moron stating that Eric lied throughout his juvenile diversion. That was Dylan, but of course "Sweet innocent Dylan" never lied. He had no idea what was going on till 4/20

*rolls eyes

I wonder if Cullen will ever get over his fangirl crush on Dylan. lol!

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeThu May 21, 2015 2:46 am

SodaCanHalfwayOpen wrote:
lol wrote:
I have to bring up that Cullen is also a complete moron stating that Eric lied throughout his juvenile diversion. That was Dylan, but of course "Sweet innocent Dylan" never lied. He had no idea what was going on till 4/20

*rolls eyes

I wonder if Cullen will ever get over his fangirl crush on Dylan. lol!

I was thinking the same thing!

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeThu May 21, 2015 4:06 am

I agree with much of this post. Very good quality post. But I would have to see the tapes for myself to be able to form a true opinion on this because I don't trust Cullen and Fusilier on anything.


Nirvana92 wrote:
Because Dylan was good at hiding his angry and depressed side during typical day-to-day life. He seemed to be a lot better than Eric was at hiding his anger. The two were pretty much polar opposites when it came to inner demons and the masks they used to cover them. Much of Eric's personality comes across as someone whos trying their hardest to appear "macho". But when its just him filming he drops the act and shows a much more sympathetic attitude. Dylan was able to do the same when it came to letting his rage out during the BT. I personally believe that much of Dylan's attitude during the BT is him over-exaggerating his anger. Embodying "WRATH" and putting on for Eric because that's what the two of them did: feed each others rage. They were trying to one-up each other which in turn only made the urge to kill and die more stronger.

I don't consider either one to be the leader. I think they both took charge at different times depending on the situation. Sometime I think Dylan did this to eric as a way to make NBK bigger. Eric was the one who mainly worked on the big bombs. Egging him on so NBK would be something neither one would feel they could walk away from. Dylan was suicidal but he needed to be pushed into it. Baiting Eric to the point of multiple time bombs and an estimated death toll in the hundreds would seal his fate. Neither could go back to living a boring life after something like that, nor would they want to be caught alive. He would die in the attack which is the thing he said he wanted the most. And he wouldn't have to die all alone. That's why IMO he wasnt as into the attack as Eric was when it all started. After a few kills and entering the building it became a reality: He was going to die. At that point he got more involved during the time in the library.


This is all my opinion though. Dylan isn't really on the BT alone at any point. He didnt have the chance to be intimate and open with his feeling like Eric did.

P.S. - Sorry if I went a little off topic. I just find the boys interactions with each other extremely interesting. I'm not sure any of the evidence shows the true side of either boys.
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeThu May 21, 2015 9:55 am

Sabratha wrote:
Ido not think they fed eac otehr's rage, although I migth be wrong. What they did imho was showing each other the way out of a situation they both hated.

You don't think so? Take the exchange from the leaked BT clip:  

Dylan: "I don't like you, Rachel and Jen, you're stuck up little bitches, you're fucking little.. Christian, Godly little whores!"
Eric: "Yeah.. 'I love Jesus! I love Jesus!' -- shut the fuck up!"
Dylan: "What would Jesus do? What the fuck would I do..?" (he acts like he's shooting the camera with his hand, with sound to accompany it)
Eric: "I would shoot you in the motherfucking head! Go Romans! Thank God they crucified that asshole."

They seem to excite each others anger. Its like when one of the boys says he hates something the other has to make it known he hates it just as much, if not even more. Dylan even says something about wishing we could see all the anger he's stored up over his time in highschool. It might not have even been a concious thing between them.
Of course I might be wrong and it could just be posturing. Both of them constantly trying to be the alpha of the duo. That all ties back into the boys each having a "secret" agenda. I still think Dylan used Eric's rage against him to make NBK bigger, either because he needed the push to suicide or to leave his mark as the "god of sadness" he saw himself as.
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeThu May 21, 2015 9:27 pm

Every time I read the basement transcripts they do feed off each other's anger, but it seems to me Dylan pushes Eric's anger out. That leaked BT clip shows what I mean.

Eric said "And those two girls next to you want you to shut the fuck up too. Jesus! Rachel, and Jen...whatever"
Dylan comes out with his hatred stating he doesn't like them, and then Eric follows.
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeFri May 22, 2015 2:55 pm

Nirvana92 wrote:
Sabratha wrote:
Ido not think they fed eac otehr's rage, although I migth be wrong. What they did imho was showing each other the way out of a situation they both hated.

You don't think so? Take the exchange from the leaked BT clip:  

Dylan: "I don't like you, Rachel and Jen, you're stuck up little bitches, you're fucking little.. Christian, Godly little whores!"
Eric: "Yeah.. 'I love Jesus! I love Jesus!' -- shut the fuck up!"
Dylan: "What would Jesus do? What the fuck would I do..?" (he acts like he's shooting the camera with his hand, with sound to accompany it)
Eric: "I would shoot you in the motherfucking head! Go Romans! Thank God they crucified that asshole."

Hard to say, but to me it just sounds like two guys talking about people who they do not like. Reallly reminds me of some of my co-workers talking about people who they do not like behind their backs. I wouldn't call it feeding each other's anger.

Take away the schoool shooting context from that leaked BT discussion and what you get is basically two teenagers badmouthing their fellow students and then going on a random anti-religious rant. The leaked part really doesn't seem at all significant to me.

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeSat May 23, 2015 6:36 am

Sabratha wrote:
Nirvana92 wrote:
Sabratha wrote:
Ido not think they fed eac otehr's rage, although I migth be wrong. What they did imho was showing each other the way out of a situation they both hated.

You don't think so? Take the exchange from the leaked BT clip:  

Dylan: "I don't like you, Rachel and Jen, you're stuck up little bitches, you're fucking little.. Christian, Godly little whores!"
Eric: "Yeah.. 'I love Jesus! I love Jesus!' -- shut the fuck up!"
Dylan: "What would Jesus do? What the fuck would I do..?" (he acts like he's shooting the camera with his hand, with sound to accompany it)
Eric: "I would shoot you in the motherfucking head! Go Romans! Thank God they crucified that asshole."

Hard to say, but to me it just sounds like two guys talking about people who they do not like. Reallly reminds me of some of my co-workers talking about people who they do not like behind their backs. I wouldn't call it feeding each other's anger.

Take away the schoool shooting context from that leaked BT discussion and what you get is basically two teenagers badmouthing their fellow students and then going on a random anti-religious rant. The leaked part really doesn't seem at all significant to me.

Maybe I just see it that way because I was once an angry teenage boy thats was friends with other angry teenage boys. I just get the vibe that they each felt the need to match each others intensity. It may not have been fully conscious. The two of them were both very lonely and felt they didn't have any true friends. Neither wanted to lose the other which meant they needed to be accepted by each other. Unfortunately the one thing they bonded over most was anger and hate.

Exchanges like that one would not only re-affirm their shared hatred, but constantly going back and forth would logically cause it to build up even more. I know first hand how easy it is to start genuinely hating something that you may have once liked or been indifferent to, simply because you faked the emotion trying to fit in with someone who expressed their own dislike for it. I'm not saying I'm right, but I've always gotten the feeling E and D were a lot like me and my friends were in terms of interaction between each other. We fed each others anger through exchanges just like this and we were very aware that we were doing it. You'd think two smart boys who were hoping to commit mass murder together would purposefully try and psyche each other up. The plan would have been squashed if one of them got over the depression and anger. Neither seemed to very much want that.
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeSun May 24, 2015 10:05 am

Would you show your diary or confess some private thoughts to your best buddy in your teen years?

Imagine Dylan showing Eric his journal filled with hearts and love.

Eric wouldn't probably right out call Dylan a 'fag' to his face, they seemed to be too good of friends for that, but he'd probably laugh at this on the inside.

Dylan was very introverted, he'd never show his sensitive side to the others, not even Eric - especially not to Eric, whom he probably felt had little interest in love or something like that.

And it was the 90's, it was the time of XTREM!!! - faggy hearts and love are for dorks, only manly man are cool etc etc
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeMon May 25, 2015 8:38 pm

asdf12345 wrote:
Would you show your diary or confess some private thoughts to your best buddy in your teen years?

Imagine Dylan showing Eric his journal filled with hearts and love.

Eric wouldn't probably right out call Dylan a 'fag' to his face, they seemed to be too good of friends for that, but he'd probably laugh at this on the inside.

Dylan was very introverted, he'd never show his sensitive side to the others, not even Eric - especially not to Eric, whom he probably felt had little interest in love or something like that.

And it was the 90's, it was the time of XTREM!!! - faggy hearts and love are for dorks, only manly man are cool etc etc

Funny I thought the 90's was a time for more expressive men. Then again I was a child then so all I have to go on is blurry memories and pop culture. It seems pretty wussy compared to older decades lol.

Dylan drawing hearts is just as "faggy" as Eric kissing a girl on the cheek without trying anything, even though he knew he'd be dead in 3 days. Eric more than likely had the exact same types of feeling Dylan did. He just worked as hard as he could to hide it. Dylan's journal also spans multiple years where Eric's is a span of months. For all we know he had two journals: one we were meant to see and a second for his REAL private thoughts. Its not too much of a stretch to imagine Eric destroying it before the attack, or even months before when he decided the shooting was his future. At that point he would have become the man he always wanted to be and he'd have no need to be honest with himself. That's just speculation of course. I think many people view Eric as a monster simply because that's how he wanted us all to see him. He was still a confused and lonely teenager, even if he hated it.
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeTue May 26, 2015 12:53 am

I love this post. And agree so much especially this part .I've also believed that Eric had other thoughts and feelings he never recorded anywhere because they did not fit with the image he has crafted to leave behind:

I think many people view Eric as a monster simply because that's how he wanted us all to see him. He was still a confused and lonely teenager, even if he hated it.



Funny I thought the 90's was a time for more expressive men. Then again I was a child then so all I have to go on is blurry memories and pop culture. It seems pretty wussy compared to older decades lol.

Dylan drawing hearts is just as "faggy" as Eric kissing a girl on the cheek without trying anything, even though he knew he'd be dead in 3 days. Eric more than likely had the exact same types of feeling Dylan did. He just worked as hard as he could to hide it. Dylan's journal also spans multiple years where Eric's is a span of months. For all we know he had two journals: one we were meant to see and a second for his REAL private thoughts. Its not too much of a stretch to imagine Eric destroying it before the attack, or even months before when he decided the shooting was his future. At that point he would have become the man he always wanted to be and he'd have no need to be honest with himself. That's just speculation of course. I think many people view Eric as a monster simply because that's how he wanted us all to see him. He was still a confused and lonely teenager, even if he hated it.[/quote]
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeWed May 27, 2015 10:58 am

PaintItBlack wrote:
I love this post. And agree so much especially this part .I've also believed that Eric had other thoughts and feelings he never recorded anywhere because they did not fit with the image he has crafted to leave behind:

I think many people view Eric as a monster simply because that's how he wanted us all to see him. He was still a confused and lonely teenager, even if he hated it.

I am still very much convinced that there was a real diference between the two shooters. One can say that Eric tried to craft an image of himself and did not include some of his real self in it not to seem incoherent. But we have evidence of Eric's previous actual behaviors that were not made with his own "post-columbine self-image" in mind, but yet still fit very well with the person taht is presented in Eric's journal.

The incident with the girls who were poor divers at the parking lot. Smashing Brown's windshield. The fake blood event.

The angry, impulsive, callous Eric wasn't just something he made up in his mind. This was in every way the real Eric and his previous behavior in his life correlates with it.

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeThu May 28, 2015 1:07 am

I think he definitely had that angry, vengeful, raging side. I have never denied it was there. He probably wouldn't have destroyed others and himself if it hadn't been.
What I am saying is that I think that was not the only side of him and not all there was to him in a long shot, although by reading his journal you might think it was.
I think he only included his angry,tough side in the journal because that is how he wanted to people to see him after he was gone. I see much more to Eric than this. I see an intelligent, serious thinker of a kid who was easily hurt and felt things very deeply.
I believe this side of him is there to see if one looks for it. I realize that most people will only look for the side of Eric that caused this tragedy and not care about the rest. But I think he definitely had another dimension and depth to him.

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeThu May 28, 2015 7:54 pm

Nirvana92 wrote:

Funny I thought the 90's was a time for more expressive men.

Not really, especially compared to today. As far as I remember it, 90's were very anti-intellectual, materialistic and financial success-driven.
If you were a nerd, a geek, or a fag, you were supposed to, like, get real, and, like, get a life dude.

When the school principal DeAngeles have let himself to cry on the scene when giving a speech alongside Clinton, many of his colleagues even told him that this was wrong of him to do, that he was showing his weakness, which is showing IMO.
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeThu May 28, 2015 8:56 pm

asdf12345 wrote:
Nirvana92 wrote:

Funny I thought the 90's was a time for more expressive men.

Not really, especially compared to today. As far as I remember it, 90's were very anti-intellectual, materialistic and financial success-driven.
If you were a nerd, a geek, or a fag, you were supposed to, like, get real, and, like, get a life dude.

When the school principal DeAngeles have let himself to cry on the scene when giving a speech alongside Clinton, many of his colleagues even told him that this was wrong of him to do, that he was showing his weakness, which is showing IMO.

I do not think ti was anti-intellectuall (at leats nto here), but I do think the 90s was an anti-emotional and anti-sensitive period of time. You were supposed to be tough and sucessfull in life and business (both men and women).

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Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeThu May 28, 2015 9:14 pm

Sabratha wrote:

I do not think ti was anti-intellectuall (at leats nto here)

1 word. BioDome.
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeThu May 28, 2015 9:21 pm

asdf12345 wrote:
Sabratha wrote:

I do not think ti was anti-intellectuall (at leats nto here)

1 word. BioDome.
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Don't get the reference, not sure what bio dome is.

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeFri May 29, 2015 1:29 am

PaintItBlack wrote:
I think he definitely had that angry, vengeful, raging side. I have never denied it was there. He probably wouldn't have destroyed others and himself if it hadn't been.
What I am saying is that I think that was not the only side of him and not all there was to him in a long shot, although by reading his journal you might think it was.
I think he only included his angry,tough side in the journal because that is how he wanted to people to see him after he was gone. I see much more to Eric  than this. I see an intelligent, serious thinker of a kid who was easily hurt and felt things very deeply.
I believe this side of him is there to see if one looks for it. I realize that most people will only look for the side of Eric that caused this tragedy and not care about the rest. But I think he definitely had another dimension and depth to him.

I agree 100% with you on Eric being a deeper individual than people give him credit for. At the same time though they had a lot of similarities which is why they were capable of meshing together and creating their NBK fantasy. Its almost like Eric hated the feelings he kept hidden, while Dylan hated that he didnt have anyone to share his deepest thoughts and feelings with. I have such a big issue with Cullen's psychopath claim against Eric. The kid was more than capable of feeling for others. He tried his hardest to hide it though because he wanted so much to be a tough guy. Someone who loves animals, who worries about his parents feelings, and acts as a gentleman while facing certain death is NOT a psycho/sociopath.

Don't even get me started on Cullen's views on Dylan. If he was a simple follower then why did he have so much fun killing in the library? He wanted to kill and he wanted to die. I definitely think Dylan's violent urges were stronger than Eric's. He was just so damn good at hiding it all. Eric wanted to go NBK to "leave a lasting impression on the world" and prove himself an alpha male. Dylan just wanted a grande finale to cap off his "miserable" existence. They helped each other and I don't believe NBK would have had the same body count if they didnt do it together.

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeFri May 29, 2015 2:07 am

Sabratha wrote:
PaintItBlack wrote:
I love this post. And agree so much especially this part .I've also believed that Eric had other thoughts and feelings he never recorded anywhere because they did not fit with the image he has crafted to leave behind:

I think many people view Eric as a monster simply because that's how he wanted us all to see him. He was still a confused and lonely teenager, even if he hated it.

I am still very much convinced that there was a real diference between the two shooters. One can say that Eric tried to craft an image of himself and did not include some of his real self in it not to seem incoherent. But we have evidence of Eric's previous actual behaviors that were not made with his own "post-columbine self-image" in mind, but yet still fit very well with the person taht is presented in Eric's journal.

The incident with the girls who were poor divers at the parking lot. Smashing Brown's windshield. The fake blood event.

The angry, impulsive, callous Eric wasn't just something he made up in his mind. This was in every way the real Eric and his previous behavior in his life correlates with it.
No, but his tough guy attitude should be fooling no one.

Eric's journal fooled Dave Cullen, and his FBI buddy. They couldn't see Eric more than what he purposely wrote for an audience. Eric seems depressed, suicidal, wants to be accepted by his peers, lonely, etc.

In my view he seems less angry than Dylan, and more "normal"..but what is normal anyway? He was more "normal" than Dylan (and I use the term normal loosely because anyone who is normal wouldn't actually go and kill innocent people).
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeFri May 29, 2015 4:46 am

I do think Eric was sincerely suicidal and had been for a long time. There is a school of thought that says that he didn't really want to die and only agreed to kill himself to either get Dylan to get along with the plan or to escape punishment for what he had done. Of course he would have not wanted to be captured and go to jail. Neither did Dylan.
But I believe Eric really did want to die.
He hated his life and how the world operated and had no hope it ever would be better so he left the planet.
I think someone who killed themselves the way he did has got a genuine death wish.
Apparently, he didn't hesitate very long about pulling the trigger either.
It's a quick way to die but one that I think takes enormous nerve to go through with.
Eric (and Dylan too) has been called a coward but I think he was anything but cowardly for the way he died alone. I have heard people say that they have put empty shotguns in their mouths before and pulled the trigger to get an idea of what his last minutes were like and even that was a unnerving, frightening experience.

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeFri May 29, 2015 8:07 am

Nirvana92 wrote:
I have such a big issue with Cullen's psychopath claim against Eric. The kid was more than capable of feeling for others. He tried his hardest to hide it though because he wanted so much to be a tough guy. Someone who loves animals, who worries about his parents feelings, and acts as a gentleman while facing certain death is NOT a psycho/sociopath.

Well, you seem to assume that Eric was more honest around other people (highschool students during the last year, with Dylan on the basement tapes) than he was in his own journal. I assume the opposite.

I have not sen the tapes, but it isn't psychology news that friends behave more like one another when they are togeather, but more individual when they are alone. That's why their journals are so different. My impression is that they did no read each other's journals and felt like they could write more honestly there.

I'm sure Eric would not be impressed by Dylan's love-writing and Dylan stating taht NBK with Eric is in some way just a last way out option.

Dylan would probably not enjoy all of Eric's journal rants either.


also... when did Eric act liek a gentleman when facing certain death? Saying "peekaboo!" to an unarmed girl and killing her point blank doesn't fit my idea of a gentleman, sorry.

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeFri May 29, 2015 2:12 pm

Sabratha wrote:

not sure what bio dome is.

Everything that was wrong with the 90's suppressed in 1,5 painful, painful hours.
I mean, just look at it...

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeFri May 29, 2015 9:33 pm

I don't think Dylan in the Basement Tapes is an act. I think he kept all his rage bottled up and this was his venue to express it. So was NBK

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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeSat Jun 13, 2015 10:29 am

Nirvana92 wrote:
Sabratha wrote:
Ido not think they fed eac otehr's rage, although I migth be wrong. What they did imho was showing each other the way out of a situation they both hated.

You don't think so? Take the exchange from the leaked BT clip:  

Dylan: "I don't like you, Rachel and Jen, you're stuck up little bitches, you're fucking little.. Christian, Godly little whores!"
Eric: "Yeah.. 'I love Jesus! I love Jesus!' -- shut the fuck up!"
Dylan: "What would Jesus do? What the fuck would I do..?" (he acts like he's shooting the camera with his hand, with sound to accompany it)
Eric: "I would shoot you in the motherfucking head! Go Romans! Thank God they crucified that asshole."

They seem to excite each others anger. Its like when one of the boys says he hates something the other has to make it known he hates it just as much, if not even more. Dylan even says something about wishing we could see all the anger he's stored up over his time in highschool. It might not have even been a concious thing between them.
Of course I might be wrong and it could just be posturing. Both of them constantly trying to be the alpha of the duo. That all ties back into the boys each having a "secret" agenda. I still think Dylan used Eric's rage against him to make NBK bigger, either because he needed the push to suicide or to leave his mark as the "god of sadness" he saw himself as.
I think dylan referrers to this
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Dylan: "What would Jesus do? What the fuck would I do..?" (he acts like he's shooting the camera with his hand, with sound to accompany it)`
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PostSubject: Re: Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why?   Dylan in the Basement Tapes, why? Icon_minitimeSat Jun 13, 2015 1:21 pm

Guest wrote:
Sabratha wrote:

not sure what bio dome is.

Everything that was wrong with the 90's suppressed in 1,5 painful, painful hours.
I mean, just look at it...


Bio-Dome ... I love that fucking movie! Very Happy

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