New Book

Kacey wrote a book as well!



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im gonna read it when it comes out

Our cups runneth over with new books! This is one I would definitely like to read.

Kerea2244 wrote:

im gonna read it when it comes out

It's available right now in paperback on Amazon
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I don't know if a digital version will be forthcoming.

I hope it comes out on a digital format I really want to read it too. Her cover picture is beautiful

I decided I'd rather spend my money on this one than on the DeAngelis book. Just bought it; should arrive Thursday and I'll post my thoughts once I read it.
It has several Amazon reviews already- if I'm being honest, I suspect they are from her friends and family and not objective 3rd parties. But I'm still really interested in what she has to say.

Got Kacey's book today. I started it during my lunch hour at work and am about 1/4 of the way through.

I don't want to give away spoilers for those that may be interested, but I will say I do recommend it.

She goes into detail about what went on in her life prior to transferring to Columbine and how she feels that dark period helped prepare her for dealing with her injuries and recovery. There is also a pretty intense play by play of what happened to her in the library, how her parents found out and how they each dealt with it, and what happened at the hospital. I'm currently at the part where a pioneering doctor was brought in to try to figure out how to put her shoulder and hand back together.

The book is well written and engaging. As always, it's interesting to hear things from the perspective of someone who went through it and came out ok the other end.

I will reveal this, though. She is quite gracious (at least so far) about how law enforcement was completely overwhelmed in handling what was going on. She writes that after getting out of the library a cop drove her a short distance away to shelter behind a shed and then made her get out of the car. He then comes back and tells her to get back in but she is weak from blood loss and having trouble breathing. She says:
"I ask for his help. He doesn't help me. He seems frantic.
I somehow manage to stumble into the car and am halfway inside when, in his haste, he slams the door into my left shoulder, pushing me over on to my severely injured right shoulder."
He took her to a triage area "Again, no one helps me out of the car."

Just ordered mine!!

thelmar wrote:

She is quite gracious (at least so far) about how law enforcement was completely overwhelmed in handling what was going on. She writes that after getting out of the library a cop drove her a short distance away to shelter behind a shed and then made her get out of the car. He then comes back and tells her to get back in but she is weak from blood loss and having trouble breathing. She says:
"I ask for his help. He doesn't help me. He seems frantic.
I somehow manage to stumble into the car and am halfway inside when, in his haste, he slams the door into my left shoulder, pushing me over on to my severely injured right shoulder."
He took her to a triage area "Again, no one helps me out of the car."

It's amazing to me how when it seems like JeffCo can't seem any worse they outdo themselves.

What the fuck do we pay these people for?

Ordered! I also ordered DeAngelis' book, dont judge me.

Hopefully Randy Brown's book is released this year too.

Juicy Jazzy wrote:

Ordered! I also ordered DeAngelis' book, dont judge me.

Hopefully Randy Brown's book is released this year too.

Would love to hear your impressions of DeAngelis' book once you read it. I'm sure I'll read it eventually but I'm being petty at the moment and don't really want to finance him

I think a book from Randy Brown would be 4th on my list of things I most want to see. ([You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] Basement Tapes, [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] TV Interview with the Harrises, [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] the depositions).
Fingers crossed!

Haven't had much time for reading so caught up a little this morning.
I did not know that Kacey viewed the Basement Tapes. I knew that some of the families did, but aside from the Scotts and Rohrbough's, I don't know which ones.

Anyway, she says
"In what I can only describe as tirades of hate, evil, and arrogance, I quickly learned what victory meant to those two boys: utter destruction. They did not care about surviving on April 20, Hitler's birthday. They were not hoping for relationship or growth with their classmates. Instead, they bragged how they intended to haunt our dreams forever. They hoped to kill as many as possible. They laughed. They smirked. Showing mercy was definitely not part of their plan. They even took their time to dismiss their parents from all the blame. And as I watched the videos, I realized something: they were winning in my life."

She goes on to say that she used this as a motivator to work to put Eric and Dylan and the fear they had instilled behind her; to reclaim her life for herself and to stop giving them the victory they wanted over her.

I don’t want to say I Believe what everyone says about why they pick the 20th, because it was hitlers birthday. I still maintain Dylan didn’t give a shit about him or anything like that. I think he said those things to be contrary and to piss people off and probably to make Eric happy. Not in a follower way just in an egging on your friend away

I just Wonder if something about it was mentioned in the basement tapes? Because it keeps getting brought up? Even though I don’t think that’s why they picked it. I think people have been picked up the Assumption because of Erics interest in World War II

Did Kacey mention why she was able to see the tapes? I don’t think Brooks was allowed to? I still maintain that it would’ve been good for some of their friends to see them . They would’ve been able to pick up on things no one else did.

I’m going to ask my friend if she was able to see them.Maybe it was just the injured survivors?

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]. Were you given the chance to see them?

Quote :

They even took their time to dismiss their parents from all the blame.

That's interesting how she added that and where she did. For the most part it would seem that them dismissing blame from their parents was something done out of love. But here it seems like some backwards demented way of keeping their parents from getting any of the credit

She’s not unbiased though.

It's interesting to say the least.

I still believe Sues interpretation

Screamingophelia wrote:

Did Kacey  mention why she was able to see the tapes? I don’t think Brooks was allowed to? I still maintain that it would’ve been good for some of their friends to see them . They would’ve been able to pick up on things no one else did.

I’m going to ask my friend if she was able to see them.Maybe it was just the injured survivors?

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]. Were you given the chance to see them?

All she said was:
"Families of victims at Columbine were given the chance to view 'the basement tapes'"

She didn't specify if "victim" was limited to those physically injured or killed, or if it included everyone that was victimized that day.
No, Brooks didn't see them. In his book he wrote:
"However, I've been able to learn a lot about them from what my parents remember seeing, as well as by reading the police summary of their contents (contained in a report released by the sheriff's office in November, 2000)."

As an aside, while I was looking for this info in his book, I came across the answer to a question in another thread about how the Brown's were allowed to view the tapes. Apparently, they didn't view with the other families, they viewed with members of the press.

"Randy and Judy Brown followed the arrows that led them through the Dakota Building, near the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office, until they reached the room where the videos were to be screened. As the tapes were about to begin, the police asked to see press credentials.
“We don't have any,” Judy said.
The officer demanded their names. When the Browns told him, he replied that they couldn't be there.
“Yes, we can,” Randy replied. “We're citizens and we're going to see those tapes.”
“No, you're not,” the officer replied.
Randy didn't back down. “Are you going to arrest me if I go in that room?” he asked. Behind the officer, members of the press were watching the exchange with interest.
“No,” the officer replied after a moment.
With that, Randy marched past. “Rather than have a knock-down drag-out fight with them, we allowed them in,” Deputy Wayne Holverson told Holly Kurtz and Lynn Bartels of the Denver Rocky Mountain News. “They wanted to watch the tapes, and we figured this was as good a time as any.”
One of the officers spoke with Judy in the hallway while Randy went into the screening room. The officer warned her that the tapes were “extremely disturbing,”
but he recognized her right to see them.
The officer called detective Kate Battan over to meet Judy. “She was so friendly, and said hello,” Judy recalls. “Then the officer said, ‘This is Judy Brown.’ Kate just threw her hands in the air and walked away. The officer said, ‘Well, I don't know what that was about.’ She clearly didn't want to talk to me.”

Screamingophelia wrote:

I don’t want to say I Believe what everyone says about why they pick the 20th, because it was hitlers birthday. I still maintain Dylan didn’t give a shit about him or anything like that. I think he said those things to be contrary and to piss people off and probably to make Eric happy. Not in a follower way just in an egging on  your friend away

I just Wonder if something about it was mentioned in the basement tapes? Because it keeps getting brought up? Even though I don’t think that’s why they picked it. I think people have been picked up the Assumption because of Erics interest in World War II

Seems like cope-posting to me. Eric was interested in the National Socialists, not just WW2. He cared more about learning German than in learning history. Dylan did his report on Charles Manson, who did not wear a swastika on his face as a coincidence.

That said, I doubt they even knew 4/20 was Hitler's birthday. Though, given all the manipulation which seems to possibly go from Dylan to Eric just to let Dylan commit suicide, it is interesting to think maybe this one went the other way. Tell him it will be 4/19 like OKC and then oops sorry we need another day.  Of course Dylan also wore a Soviet Union pin during the massacre to be edgy, and no National Socialist would wear Soviet gear.  

Still it's downright cringey to say they didn't like the Nazis because Nazis were icky naughty boo hiss and they would never. I think they would vomit at that. "So fucking what, you think that's a bad thing?" Seems the crime was so grand it has people searching for 'good' motives, as with the bullying.

I would suspect the main reason it seems so obvious to normal folk that they chose it as Hitler's birthday isn't because of the Basement Tapes, but because Dylan called a black kid "the n word" and the whole "racism" meme is about justifying the civil rights movement using WW2.  Just look at Eric's report. The Nazis were the most "racist" thing ever. Despite blacks hardly being their concern, and the Allied troops supporting segregation, the 1960s birthed that "racism is bad" because "that's what the Nazis would do".

Who knows...Eric himself was just a mess of contradictions. In some journal entries he would blast the 'desert countries' and anyone else who disrespected America, warning them not to mess with us. Then he would turn around and talk about committing domestic terrorism by flying a plane into a building. It seems he had no actual stance on anything. Just an angsty teen with so much hate that he couldn't even focus it on one thing or group

cakeman wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

I don’t want to say I Believe what everyone says about why they pick the 20th, because it was hitlers birthday. I still maintain Dylan didn’t give a shit about him or anything like that. I think he said those things to be contrary and to piss people off and probably to make Eric happy. Not in a follower way just in an egging on  your friend away

I just Wonder if something about it was mentioned in the basement tapes? Because it keeps getting brought up? Even though I don’t think that’s why they picked it. I think people have been picked up the Assumption because of Erics interest in World War II

Seems like cope-posting to me. Eric was interested in the National Socialists, not just WW2. He cared more about learning German than in learning history. Dylan did his report on Charles Manson, who did not wear a swastika on his face as a coincidence.

That said, I doubt they even knew 4/20 was Hitler's birthday. Though, given all the manipulation which seems to possibly go from Dylan to Eric just to let Dylan commit suicide, it is interesting to think maybe this one went the other way. Tell him it will be 4/19 like OKC and then oops sorry we need another day.  Of course Dylan also wore a Soviet Union pin during the massacre to be edgy, and no National Socialist would wear Soviet gear.  

Still it's downright cringey to say they didn't like the Nazis because Nazis were icky naughty boo hiss and they would never. I think they would vomit at that. "So fucking what, you think that's a bad thing?" Seems the crime was so grand it has people searching for 'good' motives, as with the bullying.

I would suspect the main reason it seems so obvious to normal folk that they chose it as Hitler's birthday isn't because of the Basement Tapes, but because Dylan called a black kid "the n word" and the whole "racism" meme is about justifying the civil rights movement using WW2.  Just look at Eric's report. The Nazis were the most "racist" thing ever. Despite blacks hardly being their concern, and the Allied troops supporting segregation, the 1960s birthed that "racism is bad" because "that's what the Nazis would do".

I don’t even know what cope posting is, so again, if you’re going  to be rude, ignore me. You seem to have a weird thing against me lately and it’s uncool.




I’m not arguing with you anymore. I said nothing about the racism thing. Re- read my post.

Screamingophelia wrote:

I don’t want to say I Believe what everyone says about why they pick the 20th, because it was hitlers birthday. I still maintain Dylan didn’t give a shit about him or anything like that. I think he said those things to be contrary and to piss people off and probably to make Eric happy. Not in a follower way just in an egging on your friend away

I just Wonder if something about it was mentioned in the basement tapes? Because it keeps getting brought up? Even though I don’t think that’s why they picked it. I think people have been picked up the Assumption because of Erics interest in World War II

Wasn’t there a little quote somewhere that they may have planned for April 19th, but Eric wanted Mark Manes to pick him up some more ammo the evening of the 19th? I could swear that I read that somewhere.

Also, my theory for prom: if you all remember, Eric wanted to go but couldn’t find a date. He ended up watching a movie with a girl at his house after prom. I truly think he and Dylan’s plan of going to the prom was purely psychological: to haunt the victims even further. Dylan was partying it up knowing the whole time he and Eric were planning on killing everyone there 3 days later. By this time neither one of them gave a shot about anyone or anything.

true_crime wrote:

Wasn’t there a little quote somewhere that they may have planned for April 19th, but Eric wanted Mark Manes to pick him up some more ammo the evening of the 19th? I could swear that I read that somewhere.

The quotes are from the Basement Tapes, hence it's unlikely those are why they think they chose 4/20 for Hitler. There are several, most notably when Eric says on April 11  "There are 7 and 1/3 days left", meaning the 19th, and yes the story with Manes is the usual reason given for why it happened a day later.

Somebody called in after the massacre and said "btw it was Hitler's 110th birthday" and the media ran with it because they are the type of people Hitler hated and because of the "racism" meme (I know screaming didn't say that - I am saying that. Cope posting means coping, damage control). If they wanted a date to tribute the National Socialists, more than likely they would have chosen January 30th. But they certainly wanted to be antagonists of the status quo, 'Nazis' even. "WW2 was the last good war" and "I love everything the Nazis stood for too bad they lost" (paraphrasing) go together and are as "Nazi" as a teenager gets.

cakeman wrote:

Wasn’t there a little quote somewhere that they may have planned for April 19th, but Eric wanted Mark Manes to pick him up some more ammo the evening of the 19th? I could swear that I read that somewhere.

The quotes are from the Basement Tapes, hence it's unlikely those are why they think they chose 4/20 for Hitler. There are several, most notably when Eric says on April 11  "There are 7 and 1/3 days left", meaning the 19th, and yes the story with Manes is the usual reason given for why it happened a day later.

Somebody called in after the massacre and said "btw it was Hitler's 110th birthday" and the media ran with it because they are the type of people Hitler hated and because of the "racism" meme (I know screaming didn't say that - I am saying that. Cope posting means coping, damage control). If they wanted a date to tribute the National Socialists, more than likely they would have chosen January 30th. But they certainly wanted to be antagonists of the status quo, 'Nazis' even. "WW2 was the last good war" and "I love everything the Nazis stood for too bad they lost" (paraphrasing) go together and are as "Nazi" as a teenager gets.

“Duran, 22, worked at Blackjack Pizza with Harris and Klebold and allegedly introduced them to Manes at a Jan. 23 gun show. Manes later sold Harris and Klebold the TEC-DC9 for $500. He also gave them two ammunition clips. Harris and Klebold were 17 at the time.
The night before the massacre, Manes bought 100 rounds of 9mm ammunition for Harris and sold it to him for $25.”

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“Manes pleaded guilty to selling the pistol to Harris and Klebold for $500 in January, and buying ammunition for them the night before the April 20 massacre. He faced up to 18 years.”

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“In regards to why they chose to do what they did when they did it, there has been a lot of debate and no solid answers. Important dates that have been bandied about by the theorists: the Oklahoma City bombing (courtesy Tim McVeigh, ex-military, April 19th, 1995). The Branch Davidian stand-off in Waco (April 19, 1993). Hitler's birthday (April 20, 1889). There's the classic reference to pot-smoking (4:20) of course. These and other theories have been brought up in public forums and on the news but the real reasoning behind the "When" of the shootings has died with Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold in Columbine's library.

Things the two gunmen wrote in their journals that were confiscated and neighbor Bill Konen's account of hearing them up late on Sunday the 18th grinding glass led to some speculation that the shooters weren't ready by Monday the 19th so they waited till Tuesday. However, they had 95 bombs between them, as well as several knives and four guns when they entered Columbine; they weren't exactly short on firepower. There might be more information on the Basement Tapes regarding why they chose 4-20, but that bit of evidence is still being kept under wraps by Jefferson County.

On Monday the 19th, Eric Harris asked Mark Manes to buy him ammunition for the TEC-9, telling him that he'd be using it the next day. That same day Dylan detailed out specific plans in his dayplanner for the assault they were planning on the school.”

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An earlier thread on here:
“Eric called Mark Manes on April 15th to get him some more ammunition and had to call to remind him again on 4/19 (page 008241). Was that delay part of the reason for it being on 4/20?”

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true_crime wrote:

cakeman wrote:

Wasn’t there a little quote somewhere that they may have planned for April 19th, but Eric wanted Mark Manes to pick him up some more ammo the evening of the 19th? I could swear that I read that somewhere.

The quotes are from the Basement Tapes, hence it's unlikely those are why they think they chose 4/20 for Hitler. There are several, most notably when Eric says on April 11  "There are 7 and 1/3 days left", meaning the 19th, and yes the story with Manes is the usual reason given for why it happened a day later.

Somebody called in after the massacre and said "btw it was Hitler's 110th birthday" and the media ran with it because they are the type of people Hitler hated and because of the "racism" meme (I know screaming didn't say that - I am saying that. Cope posting means coping, damage control). If they wanted a date to tribute the National Socialists, more than likely they would have chosen January 30th. But they certainly wanted to be antagonists of the status quo, 'Nazis' even. "WW2 was the last good war" and "I love everything the Nazis stood for too bad they lost" (paraphrasing) go together and are as "Nazi" as a teenager gets.

“Duran, 22, worked at Blackjack Pizza with Harris and Klebold and allegedly introduced them to Manes at a Jan. 23 gun show. Manes later sold Harris and Klebold the TEC-DC9 for $500. He also gave them two ammunition clips. Harris and Klebold were 17 at the time.
The night before the massacre, Manes bought 100 rounds of 9mm ammunition for Harris and sold it to him for $25.”

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“Manes pleaded guilty to selling the pistol to Harris and Klebold for $500 in January, and buying ammunition for them the night before the April 20 massacre. He faced up to 18 years.”

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]


“In regards to why they chose to do what they did when they did it, there has been a lot of debate and no solid answers. Important dates that have been bandied about by the theorists: the Oklahoma City bombing (courtesy Tim McVeigh, ex-military, April 19th, 1995). The Branch Davidian stand-off in Waco (April 19, 1993). Hitler's birthday (April 20, 1889). There's the classic reference  to pot-smoking (4:20) of course. These and other theories have been brought up in public forums and on the news but the real reasoning behind the "When" of the shootings has died with Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold in Columbine's library.

Things the two gunmen wrote in their journals that were confiscated and neighbor Bill Konen's account of hearing them up late on Sunday the 18th grinding glass led to some speculation that the shooters weren't ready by Monday the 19th so they waited till Tuesday. However, they had 95 bombs between them, as well as several knives and four guns when they entered Columbine; they weren't exactly short on firepower. There might be more information on the Basement Tapes regarding why they chose 4-20, but that bit of evidence is still being kept under wraps by Jefferson County.

On Monday the 19th, Eric Harris asked Mark Manes to buy him ammunition for the TEC-9, telling him that he'd be using it the next day. That same day Dylan detailed out specific plans in his dayplanner for the assault they were planning on the school.”

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An earlier thread on here:
“Eric called Mark Manes on April 15th to get him some more ammunition and had to call to remind him again on 4/19 (page 008241). Was that delay part of the reason for it being on 4/20?”

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Yes, I am familiar with this.

Interestingly, Kate Battan, the lead investigator for JeffCo, says the guy hearing them with glass must be confused or full of it, as there was no glass in any of their bombs. Not even as shrapnel, and what about the Molotovs? I wonder.
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Also, yes, Dylan wrote plans (more like "generic" rather than "specific", e. g. things like "11:09" obviously meant "some time before 11:10" and "11;18" obviously meant "after 11:17", and I am convinced they didn't set the two bombs at the same time). Interesting given how Eric is seen as the mastermind by the average fellow due to all his writing. But not only did Dylan write about the massacre first, he wrote down the timeline.  

And Gardner was watching the Smoker's Pit rather than eating in the lunchroom, probably for the obvious reasons given it was 4/20. I wonder if that was part of the plan, hoping the cops were busy. Though, in this case I tend to agree with the usual narrative you gave, that it was about the ammo from Manes. And that they wanted as much time as possible to gather resources and plan, so they did it as close to the end of the schoolyear as possible while still on a date of significance. If it was simply about a high school tribute to the National Socialists, January 30 is imo a more likely date, the anniversary of when the National Socialists came to power, of Hitler's last speech, etc.

April 19 is also Lexington and Concord, and Columbine's  Rebels refers to the Revolution.