What's the consensus on Peter Langman?

Personally, I think he throws the term "psychopath" around with way too much looseness. He also excludes information; he writes of Eric Harris reading Hobbes, Nietzsche, and Hitler's works, but doesn't bring up the fact that he has Les Misérables in his room. Idk, I just get bad vibes from him.

Another thing, psychopaths are entirely self-serving. No true psychopath would off themselves. A good chunk of the shooters Langman clumps into the "psychopathic" category ended up killing themselves, think Eric Harris and Robert Steinhauser.

I only like him for the info he finds on less "popular" shooters like on Robert Poulin, Michael Slobodian, etc. Really I don't read his articles for his psychological profiles, but to see if he found any new or rare info on a shooter. I have School Shooters: Understanding High School, College, and Adult Perpetrators, but just to see if there was any shit I haven't learned yet. Read Why Kids Kill a few years ago but I don't think I ever finished it or can't remember what new shit I learned other than Eric Harris bit off the head of an action figure when he was a kid

He's gay.

Cunt

NEXT STEP UP wrote:

Personally, I think he throws the term "psychopath" around with way too much looseness.

I think the same but in regards to his frequent labeling of several shooters as "schizotypal", a diagnosis that is very rare.

NEXT STEP UP wrote:

Another thing, psychopaths are entirely self-serving. No true psychopath would off themselves. A good chunk of the shooters Langman clumps into the "psychopathic" category ended up killing themselves, think Eric Harris and Robert Steinhauser.

I don't know if it makes any difference but I believe in one of his books he disputes the assertion that a psychopath wouldn't kill themselves. I personally believe a psychopath is capable of suicide.

QuestionMark wrote:

NEXT STEP UP wrote:

Personally, I think he throws the term "psychopath" around with way too much looseness.

I think the same but in regards to his frequent labeling of several shooters as "schizotypal", a diagnosis that is very rare.

NEXT STEP UP wrote:

Another thing, psychopaths are entirely self-serving. No true psychopath would off themselves. A good chunk of the shooters Langman clumps into the "psychopathic" category ended up killing themselves, think Eric Harris and Robert Steinhauser.

I don't know if it makes any difference but I believe in one of his books he disputes the assertion that a psychopath wouldn't kill themselves. I personally believe a psychopath is capable of suicide.

I believe a psychopath could kill themselves, but under very specific circumstances. The whole "psychopath" thing always rang as a sort of excuse in my eyes. The truth is, some people are just assholes, and Robert Steinhauser throwing a hissy fit because his school found out that he'd forged documents isn't a sign of psychopathy, it's a sign of Robert Steinhauser being a spoiled brat.

My gf once sent him an e-mail with a lots of info with sources about Brześć Kujawski shooter, Marek Nowak, for analysis and has not added any info about him on the site (even has not added Nowak on the site).

Not too long ago, I also sent him an e-mail asking for psychological support and clues about my life problems and he just ignored me.

And I fully agree, he just throws the term ''psychopath'' around and was into Gayve Cullen's narration of ''depressive and the psychopath''.

xDarkRazoR wrote:

My gf once sent him an e-mail with a lots of info with sources about Brześć Kujawski shooter, Marek Nowak, for analysis and has not added any info about him on the site (even has not added Nowak on the site).

Not too long ago, I also sent him an e-mail asking for psychological support and clues about my life problems and he just ignored me.

And I fully agree, he just throws the term ''psychopath'' around and was into Gayve Cullen's narration of ''depressive and the psychopath''.

Oh? Do u still habe the info about Marek?

NEXT STEP UP wrote:

xDarkRazoR wrote:

My gf once sent him an e-mail with a lots of info with sources about Brześć Kujawski shooter, Marek Nowak, for analysis and has not added any info about him on the site (even has not added Nowak on the site).

Not too long ago, I also sent him an e-mail asking for psychological support and clues about my life problems and he just ignored me.

And I fully agree, he just throws the term ''psychopath'' around and was into Gayve Cullen's narration of ''depressive and the psychopath''.

Oh? Do u still habe the info about Marek?

yeah, I created a thread ''2019 Brześć Kujawski shooting'' on this forum and posted some info about him there:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

xDarkRazoR wrote:

NEXT STEP UP wrote:

xDarkRazoR wrote:

My gf once sent him an e-mail with a lots of info with sources about Brześć Kujawski shooter, Marek Nowak, for analysis and has not added any info about him on the site (even has not added Nowak on the site).

Not too long ago, I also sent him an e-mail asking for psychological support and clues about my life problems and he just ignored me.

And I fully agree, he just throws the term ''psychopath'' around and was into Gayve Cullen's narration of ''depressive and the psychopath''.

Oh? Do u still habe the info about Marek?

yeah, I created a thread ''2019 Brześć Kujawski shooting'' on this forum and posted some info about him there:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

thx! I'll go read it right now!

Peter Langman wrote:

• "Many shooters faced biological challenges in the form of birth defects, minor physical anomalies, short statures, or other concerns. Williams reportedly was short (one report said “barely 5 feet tall” and another said 5’4”), scrawny, and unusually thin and pale (he was reportedly called “anorexic” and “albino”). These biological challenges may have resulted in his attempting to overcompensate and act tough." (Source)
  

What he describes here: "biological challenges in the form of birth defects, minor physical anomalies, short statures, or other concerns" are victim stereotypes that differentiate an individual from the crowd and makes him a focus point and a target.

It is impossible to ignore as an academic, unless being biased without restraint, that these signs are related to social violence. They have nothing to do with an hypothetical "overcompensation" easy recycled from Alfred Adler's works. Langman used the weakest argument ever in his effort to deny any collective responsibility, he couldn't be less serious.

It is well known that these "birth defects, minor physical anomalies, short statures, or other concerns" attract violence, polarize group violence on the individual bearing them. There are thousands of texts from all over the world, from all past and present cultures, attributing these "birth defects, minor physical anomalies, short statures, or other concern" to victims of group persecution.

The life expectancy of a "dwarf albino" never exceeded one day in any part of the world... and if they ever survived by miracle the first day, their fate was sealed at the first drought or the first livestock disease: bonfire.

We have here with Langman an example of total intellectual collapse.

I think Langman did a good job given the time period and the diagnostic manuals as they were at the time.

However, diagnosing a dead person that you cannot observe and interact with... it always ends up being an educated guess rather than a strict diagnosis.

As far as my opinion goes: Langman states that Dylan was depressed, which I think is the best and most obvious educated guess you can do after reading Dylan's journal.
I'm pretty sure that it was more than that, that it was depression comorbid with something like Schizotypal PD. But that can be argued over ad nauseam, becaus eof how vague and mystical Dylan's writings are.

Eric.. I feel we are looking at psychopath, or a particularly violent and criel malignant narcissist. Which are very 'related' disorders, next to impossible to make a 100% certain distinction when you have a dead guy to evaluate. So I feel Langman is either right, or just one step away from being right here.

I used to think psychpath was more likely. Over time I'm leaning more towards malignant narcissist more.

Have you ever participated in the persecution of one of these “malignant narcissists”? when you were at school?

Saint George wrote:

Have you ever participated in the persecution of one of these “malignant narcissists”?  when you were at school?

We never had any in school.

I had a boss once who I suspect was one. But I wasn't really in a position to persecute her, rather vice-versa.

So neither bullied nor bully, sticking to schoolgirl lessons and conformist platitudes, and fantasizing about being a victim that you are not... a kind of tourist?

Saint George wrote:

So neither bullied nor bully, sticking to schoolgirl lessons and conformist platitudes, and fantasizing about being a victim that you are not... a kind of tourist?

You are asking me? I was bullied way back 25+ years ago, when I was in our local equivalent of the US middle school. Contrary to popular opinion, my life does not revolve around bullying.

Were you actually bullied or was it only a perception?

Anyway, what did Peter Langman there:

• "Many shooters faced biological challenges in the form of birth defects, minor physical anomalies, short statures, or other concerns. Williams reportedly was short (one report said “barely 5 feet tall” and another said 5’4”), scrawny, and unusually thin and pale (he was reportedly called “anorexic” and “albino”). These biological challenges may have resulted in his attempting to overcompensate and act tough." (Source)
  

is a true disgrace. In the "other concerns", mental health was not mentioned although it is a well-known stereotype triggering persecution. Among all the "weirdos" that differ from the majority, there are intellectually gifted individuals, and also the ones with mental health issues. In Kenya, majorities lynch individuals suffering from mental illnesses:

• "Women suspected of being witches sometimes flee to witch camp settlements for safety, often in order to avoid being lynched by neighbours. Many women in such camps are widows; relatives are believed to accuse them of witchcraft in order to seize their late husbands' possessions. Many women in the witch camps also suffer from mental illness, a poorly understood phenomenon in Ghana." (Witch camp)
  

The same in the US and everywhere else. So Peter Langman listed biological stereotypes triggering persecution, but he kept mental health appart and only to explain the revenge taken by some of the persecuted... Fortunately, Peter Langman does not exercise any serious responsibility in society, no one counts on him to pilot an airliner or manage a nuclear power plant.

But for sure we can conclude from Peter Langman that persecution - bullying and lynching - is a poorly understood phenomenon in the US.

Saint George wrote:

Were you actually bullied or was it only a perception?

Whose perception and a perception of what? I don't get the question.

I was bulied by roughly a bit over a year betwen the ages of 12-13 at school. Day in and day out harassment, people attacking me on the bus on the way home from school and stuff.

Was it fun? No. Did it alter my personality in some huge way? Not really. I was never nice, warm or fuzzy to begin with.

I wasn't the only person bullied at the time, there were other people, but it wasn't equal. One of the guys had it much worse than the rest of us though. There were two vicious bullies (one being a sidekick of the other), then also a bunch of people who participated in the bullying half-heartedly pretty much to avoid becoming targets themselves. The whole atmosphere wasn't great in the whole school.

Ironically enough I first became a target because I wouldn't let the main bully have my lunch or eat my candy bars. He pretty much turned on me at that time because I was the only person who would stand up to him and tell him to go jump in a lake. I used to be his friend at an earlier age, when nobody else wanted to play with him because he was fat... so i kind of never was able to treat him seriously after he became a top bully. Cause I always remembered him as the 8 year old fat kid with no friends.

The whole thing mellowed down by the time we were 14 though.

Sabratha wrote:

I was bulied by roughly a bit over a year betwen the ages of 12-13 at school. Day in and day out harassment, people attacking me on the bus on the way home from school and stuff.

Was it fun? No. Did it alter my personality in some huge way? Not really. I was never nice, warm or fuzzy to begin with.

I wasn't the only person bullied at the time, there were other people, but it wasn't equal. One of the guys had it much worse than the rest of us though. There were two vicious bullies (one being a sidekick of the other), then also a bunch of people who participated in the bullying half-heartedly pretty much to avoid becoming targets themselves. The whole atmosphere wasn't great in the whole school.

Ironically enough I first became a target because I wouldn't let the main bully have my lunch or eat my candy bars. He pretty much turned on me at that time because I was the only person who would stand up to him and tell him to go jump in a lake. I used to be his friend at an earlier age, when nobody else wanted to play with him because he was fat... so i kind of never was able to treat him seriously after he became a top bully. Cause I always remembered him as the 8 year old fat kid with no friends.

So nobody will ever know if your present "antisocial and unstable" condition was caused by your previous bullying.

Sabratha wrote:

The whole thing mellowed down by the time we were 14 though.

It "mellowed down" at puberty? Don't you tell us that you made up in bed with your former bully, please.

But you were lucky not to be bullied exactly by "peers", like in the cases of Dagmara Przybysz:

• "She told me when year 10 [aged 14-15] girls said she ‘did not belong here’  [...] “We saw two girls on the pavement and Dagmara said: ‘Uncle, can you run them over.’ [...] She told me she had hurt her hand while punching the wall as some girls had laughed at her because she could not play the game properly.” (Dagmara Przybysz's bullying and suicide)
  

and of Rebecca Sedwick:

• "Two girls, ages 14 and 12, encouraged others to fight Sedwick, and sent her electronic messages encouraging her to commit suicide." (Rebecca Sedwick's bullying and suicide
  

As I already explained, it's not only "birth defects, minor physical anomalies, short statures, or other concerns" (stupid idiot of Langman) that polarize social violence and trigger persecution, it's any significative difference from the majority, including intellectual gifts and beauty. Dagmara cumulated at least 3 victim stereotypes: she was a "bright and talented" beautiful stranger, and thus the average girls didn't miss her, they pushed her to commit suicide.

Girl on girl bullying produces a pressure more similar to all on one bullying, it's more destructive. Maybe you were lucky to make out with that bully boy and get away with only "antisocial and unstable" consequences.

The desire or fantasy to fight back at bullies is not a symptom of any mental health issue, it is a normal reaction...

Dagmara Przybysz:

• “We saw two girls on the pavement and Dagmara said: ‘Uncle, can you run them over.’"
  

Melissa Sowder:

• In her first few weeks at Columbine, Sowder ditched class several times, resulting in a parent conference and restrictions imposed on her ability to leave campus during the day. But when she tried to complain to teachers about harassment by jocks, she was told, "Deal with it", she says. [...] One day last fall, Sowder was called to the dean's office after she was late to one class. "He asked me what I think about all day at school," Sowder says, "so I told him I thought about blowing up the school. The school made me that angry. He told me I was suspended for a day and called my mom."
  

Adults and educators who don't want to take responsibility for peace and justice at school might crush certain students with neuroleptics and anxiolytics, to force them to endure the harassment without reacting, there will always be perfectly sane students who will try to take revenge:

• By eighth grade approximately 37 percent of boys and 23 percent of girls reported having unspecified violent thoughts in response to being bullied; 11 percent said they had resorted to violence to cope with the problem, often by striking a classmate.(Source: Gifted and Tormented)
  

These masses of bullied students who would like to defend themselves are not all mentally ill.

And by way, many bullied students don't need medication at all to endure the bullying, they just die in the inside as a person, they don't resist anymore, they give in and agree with humiliation. And that's probably a secret satisfaction for adults unable to inspire respect among students, to see some of them being tamed by means of violence, like in:

• [Jean Sunde] Peterson conducted detailed interviews with 57 students as part of her study. Some told her their intelligence was used against them; school officials, including teachers, were low on the list of people to whom they turned for help. "Many students said they assumed responsibility for fixing the problem" [Jean Sunde] Peterson said. "Some felt they had essentially been told by school officials, 'If you're so smart, figure it out yourself.' "(Source: Gifted and Tormented)
  

Mediocre professionals like Frank DeAngelis and the staff of Mentor High School who reached a sad record of 5 suicided students between 2005 and 2008 due to bullying, who prefer coaching sports rather than to heal interpersonal relationships, we can understand they fail as educators. But academics like Peter Langman and Jordan Peterson, they have no excuses.

What do Peter Langman and Jordan Peterson say about Dagmara Przybysz's cry for help: "Uncle, can you run them over"? She was "possessed" and a genuine "enemy of god"!

Langman is a good source of information for some of the lesser known shooters, but I've always felt that he was too wedded to his "Psychopathic/Psychotic/Traumatized" typology.