One Question

If you could have just one yes or no question answered definitively about Columbine, what would it be?

You don't get any further explanation, just a straight "yes" or "no" answer. Feel free to speculate answers to each other's questions as well! (If possible)

I'll start: Did Eric or Dylan give a sincere warning/heads up to any of their friends about NBK?

"Did the ketchup tampon incident actually happen?"

Was Dylan the first one to bring the idea of NBK to Eric?

Screamingophelia wrote:

Was Dylan the first one to bring the idea of NBK to Eric?

Omg ok I change my answer to this one. I SO want to know.

Or...did either of them originally want to plan it with someone else

Littlelo wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Was Dylan the first one to bring the idea of NBK to Eric?

Omg ok I change my answer to this one. I SO want to know.

Or...did either of them originally want to plan it with someone else

That's a great one! It seemed at first Dylan wanted Zach or a girl

Another option..

Was Dylan's love acronym written about Marla?

Did Dylan and Eric ever think about killing there parents to protect them from the backlash there actions would cause?

Giga143 wrote:

Did Dylan and Eric ever think about killing there parents to protect them from the backlash there actions would cause?

I have wondered this many times.

I don't believe they would have though.

Littlelo wrote:

Giga143 wrote:

Did Dylan and Eric ever think about killing there parents to protect them from the backlash there actions would cause?

I have wondered this many times.

I don't believe they would have though.

I agree.

I'd ask Wayne if he's written Eric off as a psychopath and evil?

I would ask Dr. Albert if he had prior knowledge that something like this was coming.

Was it Eric who asked "are you still with me, are we still doing this?"

Also, was it before entering the library the first time?

Screamingophelia wrote:

Was it Eric who asked "are you still with me, are we still doing this?"

Yes! This would give better insight as to who was really running the show.

If Dave Sanders had been evacuated earlier would he have lived?

(JeffCo's official account is that even with immediate medical attention, he would not have been able to be saved)

Does Erics parents still love him?

Did Dylan really need to kill people in order to kill himself?

If he didn't, he could have always killed himself at school. That would have effed people up. I mean and not massacred anyone. Just walked into the cafeteria and shot himself in the head.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Did Dylan really need to kill people in order to kill himself?

If he didn't, he could have always killed himself at school. That would have effed people up. I mean and not massacred anyone. Just walked into the cafeteria and shot himself in the head.

THIS! That question has boggled my mind forever. WHY didn't/couldn't Dylan just commit suicide and be done with it.

I think Sue touches on that in her book. Many teens are suicidal but there is a much smaller subset of them who go on to kill others. I think she believes he had another issue in addition to depression that allowed him to do it...

Would Eric spare Brooks if he was in the library?

Was it worth it?

or

Would you do it again?

Was Eric really a psychopath?

Did the antidepressants help Eric with being able to do it?

Were there any specific victims they regretted killing or shooting at immediately after?

Lunkhead McGrath wrote:

"Did the ketchup tampon incident actually happen?"

I still feel like I need clarification on a few things regarding all things ketchup.

-was it just Dylan or Eric too?

- if it was tampons I'd assume the people who did it must have been doing it out of revenge, like it was planned, not spur of the moment. Since you have to get tampons, dip them etc..

-who initially reported the incident? Is it in the 11k?

I would also like clarification on the ketchup incident because I don't think I've seen anything from the 11k or from Brooks, Sue, etc. Very interested in hearing more about it.

Ps. I love your phrasing of "all things ketchup" [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] LOL

EDIT: I did find a couple articles regarding the incident and Brooks is quoted in one. Student Chad Laughlin is quoted in another.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Was it Eric who asked "are you still with me, are we still doing this?"

Also, was it before entering the library the first time?

According to Lisa Kreutz's 11K interview (62), it was before they entered the first time.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Did Eric and Dylan feel bad for killing people in the end?

sscc wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Was it Eric who asked "are you still with me, are we still doing this?"

Also, was it before entering the library the first time?

According to Lisa Kreutz's 11K interview (62), it was before they entered the first time.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Since Lisa Kreutz is the only one to ever report this, I believe that if she did hear it, she may have heard it when Eric and Dylan came back into the library later on and she simply got it mixed up. Like they were planning on committing suicide and Eric or Dylan was verifying that the other was still with him on that. Something like that.
I think if Kreutz heard it when they entered the library the first time, someone else would have heard it as well but no one else reported it.

Wowowwww also never thought about this possibility.

I always figured it was in reference to the shooting, not to the suicide. You're onto something and it's making me super sad.

Littlelo wrote:

I would also like clarification on the ketchup incident because I don't think I've seen anything from the 11k or from Brooks, Sue, etc. Very interested in hearing more about it.

Ps. I love your phrasing of "all things ketchup" [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] LOL

EDIT: I did find a couple articles regarding the incident and Brooks is quoted in one. Student Chad Laughlin is quoted in another.

Thank you

I think Chad helped Dylan clean up.

sscc wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Was it Eric who asked "are you still with me, are we still doing this?"

Also, was it before entering the library the first time?

According to Lisa Kreutz's 11K interview (62), it was before they entered the first time.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

It's a beautiful area that did seem to take part in ruining Eric and Dylan. There were a Lot of factors

Littlelo wrote:

Wowowwww also never thought about this possibility.

I always figured it was in reference to the shooting, not to the suicide. You're onto something and it's making me super sad.

I can get behind that

I assume then it would be Dylan to Eric then.

Littlelo wrote:

I would also like clarification on the ketchup incident because I don't think I've seen anything from the 11k or from Brooks, Sue, etc. Very interested in hearing more about it.

Ps. I love your phrasing of "all things ketchup" [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] LOL

EDIT: I did find a couple articles regarding the incident and Brooks is quoted in one. Student Chad Laughlin is quoted in another.

You probably already saw it but Sue did write about it in a mothers reckoning:

Sue Klebold wrote:

One day, Dylan came home, his shirt spotted with ketchup. He refused to tell me what had happened, only that he’d had “the worst day of his life.” I pressed, but Dylan downplayed it, and I let him. Kids have disagreements, I thought. Whatever it is, it’ll blow over—and if it doesn’t, I’ll know. There has been reporting that the incident was more serious than I could ever have imagined: a circle of boys taunting Dylan and Eric, shoving them, spraying them with ketchup, and suggesting they were gay. That incident alone may not explain the deadly kinship forged between the boys, but it is the kind of shared humiliation in which a bond is formed.

Thanks [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]! I have read AMR twice and I still forgot about that haha

Littlelo wrote:

Thanks [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]! I have read AMR twice and I still forgot about that haha

can't say I'm any better

23september wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

I would also like clarification on the ketchup incident because I don't think I've seen anything from the 11k or from Brooks, Sue, etc. Very interested in hearing more about it.

Ps. I love your phrasing of "all things ketchup" [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] LOL

EDIT: I did find a couple articles regarding the incident and Brooks is quoted in one. Student Chad Laughlin is quoted in another.

You probably already saw it but Sue did write about it in a mothers reckoning:

Sue Klebold wrote:

One day, Dylan came home, his shirt spotted with ketchup. He refused to tell me what had happened, only that he’d had “the worst day of his life.” I pressed, but Dylan downplayed it, and I let him. Kids have disagreements, I thought. Whatever it is, it’ll blow over—and if it doesn’t, I’ll know. There has been reporting that the incident was more serious than I could ever have imagined: a circle of boys taunting Dylan and Eric, shoving them, spraying them with ketchup, and suggesting they were gay. That incident alone may not explain the deadly kinship forged between the boys, but it is the kind of shared humiliation in which a bond is formed.

Thank you! I forgot about that!

There was another anecdote she told when Dylan was in Elementary School where he came home crying and fell asleep in the closet. I think nowadays someone would probably go to the school and ask what happened, but I know back a lot of kids really didn't share those things.

I always think back the Brooks' story about him and Dylan having to clean something out of a clothing item in the bathroom in elementary school. I honestly forget the whole story..but he said the teachers were especially harsh and it really affected him. I wonder if Dylan was affected just as much.

Anyone else remember this? I could have the details wrong

Littlelo wrote:

I always think back the Brooks' story about him and Dylan having to clean something out of a clothing item in the bathroom in elementary school. I honestly forget the whole story..but he said the teachers were especially harsh and it really affected him. I wonder if Dylan was affected just as much.

Anyone else remember this? I could have the details wrong

I think it was mud that had gotten accidentally splashed on some little girl's coat. They were made to scrub it clean, or as clean as they could get it.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

I always think back the Brooks' story about him and Dylan having to clean something out of a clothing item in the bathroom in elementary school. I honestly forget the whole story..but he said the teachers were especially harsh and it really affected him. I wonder if Dylan was affected just as much.

Anyone else remember this? I could have the details wrong

I think it was mud that had gotten accidentally splashed on some little girl's coat. They were made to scrub it clean, or as clean as they could get it.

I remember that story. It seemed more harsh than necessary. I bet that was something that affected Dylan immensely. I think things built on him for years. Which is why in the Tapes he went as far back as day care.

When somethings been going on seemingly forever it's hard to pinpoint the beginning or see an end

I'd ask Eric if he wishes his parents had never moved to Colorado and I'd ask Dylan, if he wishes he had never been born into this existence (since Dylan seemed to hate his existence in this realm).

42099_4EVA wrote:

I'd ask, Eric if he wishes his parents had never moved to Colorado and I'd ask Dylan, if he wishes he had never been born into this existence (since Dylan seemed to hate his existence in this realm).

I am certain that Eric's answer would be YES! I don't think he ever really considered Colorado his home.

Dylan would likely answer yes as well. He seemed to think he wasn't made for this world/reality.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

42099_4EVA wrote:

I'd ask, Eric if he wishes his parents had never moved to Colorado and I'd ask Dylan, if he wishes he had never been born into this existence (since Dylan seemed to hate his existence in this realm).

I am certain that Eric's answer would be YES! I don't think he ever really considered Colorado his home.

Dylan would likely answer yes as well. He seemed to think he wasn't made for this world/reality.

Yes, I agree, I feel like Dylan's spirit was born into human form and brought forth into this existence, but he wasn't meant for this existence. It's like going back in time and bringing someone from the 1900s to this time and era. That person from the 1900s wouldn't survive emotionally and mentally in this time and era because he belongs in the time of era of elsewhere and the person from the 1900s isn't meant to be in this time and era, you know what I mean?

That's how I feel about Dylan, his spirit was born into the body that came to be known as Dylan Klebold but his spirit wasn't meant for this existence, and so because it wasn't, he had a hard time trying to survive through life in his existence, and now where he is, his spirit is back home, where he feels comfortable and where he ultimately belongs. Just my take on it.

It's interesting because it's almost like Dylan felt like he'd be rewarded after he died, he'd be in peace even though he was a killer in his final moments.

I've never been clear on Eric's feelings of where he'd go or want to go.

Ever get the feeling no discusses how suicidal Eric was?

Which now makes me think of what Lisa K heard. It makes me think it was Dylan asking Eric if he was still going to kill himself..

Screamingophelia wrote:

It's interesting because it's almost like Dylan felt like he'd be rewarded after he died, he'd be in peace even though he was a killer in his final moments.

I've never been clear on Eric's feelings of where he'd go or want to go.

Ever get the feeling no discusses how suicidal Eric was?

Which now makes me think of what Lisa K heard. It makes me think it was Dylan asking Eric if he was still going to kill himself..

I do believe that Eric was both suicidal and homicidal. Yet he mainly played up the homicidal part and that is all most people focus on.

Screamingophelia wrote:

It's interesting because it's almost like Dylan felt like he'd be rewarded after he died, he'd be in peace even though he was a killer in his final moments.

I've never been clear on Eric's feelings of where he'd go or want to go.

Ever get the feeling no discusses how suicidal Eric was?

Which now makes me think of what Lisa K heard. It makes me think it was Dylan asking Eric if he was still going to kill himself..

Well I believe he was rewarded in death and is at peace because I honestly feel like he never wanted to be here in the first place. It's how I fee a lot of times - A LOT. I remember the doctors telling my mother when she was in labor how I didn't want to be born because no matter how much my mother pushed, I wouldn't come out of the - birthing canal, (for better words without getting technical). It was hours and hours and I just wouldn't come out to be born. The doctors had to give my mother a drug to force me out. I never understand why I gave such trouble during labor until I became an adult and understood why - I didn't want to be here, in this existence. I still don't, but I'm here and I'm coping but I feel like I don't belong in this existence, like I belong in another existence because from the time of childhood up until now, I've felt like a tortured soul, no one understands the things I say, the way I act (which is very eccentric and very old fashioned), the way I think (which is more older than my age, a lot older than my age).

So anyway, I believe that's how Dylan felt, like he didn't belong here. So despite the bad thing(s) that Dylan did, I do believe upon crossing over, he was forgiven and went to where he could truly find peace.

Eric....is in hell, lol. Nah, I'm funnin'. With Eric, Eric seemed to want to be among the stars and galaxies. One of his Doom game levels had a starry galaxy that he added to the game and he talked once in his journal about looking up at the stars and all that, and all of that is very reminiscent of the astral realm, where, if you do not go into the light after death, you can travel to the astral realm and visit other galaxies and such.

So I think all in all, both of them went where they belonged, where they could both finally feel peace. Eric went his way and Dylan went his way, but with them going to their separate destinations, I do believe they finally found the peace they could never find in this realm.

I do think too though that Eric was suicidal as well but just hid it well behind his rage and anger. I think he too was a tortured soul and the only way he could express his torturous pain and suicidal feelings was through rage and anger.

I'll confess I got a twinge of sadness when I realized E&D got split up too. They'll never see each other again either. It's hard to explain. They did so much and then it was just over. You wish they could have done something different.

How do you cope with not feeling like you should be here? I feel I don't fit in anywhere, like I'm very different than those around me, not even therapists undestood. They said to find a hobby.. so I'm a film maker now writing about mass murder... :/

Screamingophelia wrote:

I'll confess I got a twinge of sadness when I realized E&D got split up too. They'll never see each other again either. It's hard to explain. They did so much and then it was just over. You wish they could have done something different.

How do you cope with not feeling like you should be here? I feel I don't fit in anywhere, like I'm very different than those around me, not even therapists undestood. They said to find a hobby.. so I'm a film maker now writing about mass murder... :/

Oh no, if neither went into the light, they can definitely see each other again, because if they didn't go into the light, they're both in the astral realm, just in two different locations/realm levels, but according to research, if you don't go into the light (which going into the light equals reincarnation), you can travel where ever you want, you can even remain in this realm. The only difference is that, you're no longer in flesh form, you're in spirit form.

How do I cope with not feeling like I should be here? Well there are days when I don't cope and I slip into depression, just like Dylan, and boy and those days are rough, so rough to where it's like I have to watch myself or I will fall deep in my depression and follow through on suicidal feelings, because like I said, I don't feel like I belong here, because I feel so different from people, just like you said.

The emotions and feelings that I express towards people, people find them odd and bizarre, such as me deeply caring for people I don't even know, to the point of me mothering them and I don't know why I do that, but I just do. I like mothering people, like they're my own children or something (I have no kids btw) and I go way, way, way out of my way to be friends with people. Like I'll go through Twitter, see it's someone's birthday and tweet them a birthday message and I don't even know them. I do that on FB too, and people find it weird when I act like this, they think I'm being too friendly and too caring and nice and that I want something from them, but I don't, I just am like that and I try to turn those feelings off but I can't and because I can't, when I act that way towards people, they treat me mean and cruel and I never say anything outwardly about it but every time they treat me that way, it hurts a lot to where I take what people say to and about me personally and I've become over sensitive to things people say, like it doesn't take much to hurt my feelings and make me bawl tears, and so all of that makes me not want to be here because I know with people treating me like that, I obviously don't belong here, because I have yet to find someone exactly like me, who does the exact same things that I do.

I don't know but so, it's rough. I just have days where I feel out of place in this world, like I'm a stranger in a foreign world and I long to cross over and find a realm where I belong. It's funny you say you're a filmmaker, because so am I and that's what's been keeping me here but...yeah, it's rough for me sometimes.

Internet was just coming into its own when everything went down. I wonder if shit would have turned out different if everything we have available now like google, social media, twitter etc.. was available back then.

Depression sucks. We all get depressed but we can’t let it define us and make us. You can’t go through life blaming others or go through life with an axe to grind against society because it just won’t end well.

42099_4EVA wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

I'll confess I got a twinge of sadness when I realized E&D got split up too. They'll never see each other again either. It's hard to explain. They did so much and then it was just over. You wish they could have done something different.

How do you cope with not feeling like you should be here? I feel I don't fit in anywhere, like I'm very different than those around me, not even therapists undestood. They said to find a hobby.. so I'm a film maker now writing about mass murder... :/

Oh no, if neither went into the light, they can definitely see each other again, because if they didn't go into the light, they're both in the astral realm, just in two different locations/realm levels, but according to research, if you don't go into the light (which going into the light equals reincarnation), you can travel where ever you want, you can even remain in this realm. The only difference is that, you're no longer in flesh form, you're in spirit form.

How do I cope with not feeling like I should be here? Well there are days when I don't cope and I slip into depression, just like Dylan, and boy and those days are rough, so rough to where it's like I have to watch myself or I will fall deep in my depression and follow through on suicidal feelings, because like I said, I don't feel like I belong here, because I feel so different from people, just like you said.

The emotions and feelings that I express towards people, people find them odd and bizarre, such as me deeply caring for people I don't even know, to the point of me mothering them and I don't know why I do that, but I just do. I like mothering people, like they're my own children or something (I have no kids btw) and I go way, way, way out of my way to be friends with people. Like I'll go through Twitter, see it's someone's birthday and tweet them a birthday message and I don't even know them. I do that on FB too, and people find it weird when I act like this, they think I'm being too friendly and too caring and nice and that I want something from them, but I don't, I just am like that and I try to turn those feelings off but I can't and because I can't, when I act that way towards people, they treat me mean and cruel and I never say anything outwardly about it but every time they treat me that way, it hurts a lot to where I take what people say to and about me personally and I've become over sensitive to things people say, like it doesn't take much to hurt my feelings and make me bawl tears, and so all of that makes me not want to be here because I know with people treating me like that, I obviously don't belong here, because I have yet to find someone exactly like me, who does the exact same things that I do.

I don't know but so, it's rough. I just have days where I feel out of place in this world, like I'm a stranger in a foreign world and I long to cross over and find a realm where I belong. It's funny you say you're a filmmaker, because so am I and that's what's been keeping me here but...yeah, it's rough for me sometimes.

I feel like I like connecting with people that I don't know too. I really like creating things because I feel like I'm serving a purpose. It's like I'm on the outside of a mesh fence. I'm there and people like me, but I can't get through the mesh.

So I force myself to be social.

I'm really excited about the film I'm making, it got me back into researching Columbine and I got to have some cool experiences (through an unrelated job interview too) my film isn't about Columbine but it kind of has the undertone. I'm excited about it.