"Don't blame the school."

In one of Eric's writings where he describes the plan for NBK, he says the following:

"We are kind of a select case here so don't think this will happen again. Don't blame the school, don't fucking put cops all over the place just because we went on a killing spree doesn't mean everyone else will...the admin is doing a fine job as it is"
[pg. 26344]

What do you think of these statements? We always think of E&D as having a ton of hatred for their school, including students and faculty. Does this make you question the notion that bullying was a major cause for the shooting?

Was he only talking about the security & safety of Columbine, and not the atmosphere or culture within it?

I'm thinking of particular facts that we have regarding E & D's hatred of the school.

There has to be a reason they targeted it and not any place else.

The culture of the school wasn't very kind to them so it does seem like an odd thing to say.

Screamingophelia wrote:

I'm thinking of particular facts that we have regarding  E & D's hatred of the school.

There has to be a reason they targeted it and not any place else.

The culture of the school wasn't very kind to them so it does seem like an odd thing to say.

We know they likely hated the school. BUT the location very well could have just been one of convenience. They knew that school in and out. Had unlimited access to it every day, etc.

It was much more in their scope of "Yeah this could be possible" then say the police station, a church, or something like that.

I just don't think they would have chosen another location. I think they did hate the school and their classmates, and Columbine was a major reason for the shooting.

I guess you would have to know how the initial convo went between them. Was it...

a. Hey I hate our school and I want to destroy it and harm as many people in it as we can...what do you think

Or

b. I want to destroy something and hurt people to send a message, where should we do it?

Littlelo wrote:

I just don't think they would have chosen another location. I think they did hate the school and their classmates, and Columbine was a major reason for the shooting.

I guess you would have to know how the initial convo went between them. Was it...

a. Hey I hate our school and I want to destroy it and harm as many people in it as we can...what do you think

Or

b. I want to destroy something and hurt people to send a message, where should we do it?

Possibly merge both. Then it could have been "Where the hell could we have the chance to pull this off?

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

I just don't think they would have chosen another location. I think they did hate the school and their classmates, and Columbine was a major reason for the shooting.

I guess you would have to know how the initial convo went between them. Was it...

a. Hey I hate our school and I want to destroy it and harm as many people in it as we can...what do you think

Or

b. I want to destroy something and hurt people to send a message, where should we do it?

Possibly merge both. Then it could have been "Where the hell could we have the chance to pull this off?

The school was the easiest and most accessible target. Plus when it comes to kids anytime kids get hurt it sends a message. People react viscerally.

I wonder if one of them hated the school more than the other. My guess would be Dylan hated the school more.

They probably also said that because they really didn't want anyone else taking the blame but them. They did feel like they were above human and no one else could possibly do what they did. It was a lot of bravado.

Sue was so incredulous in a mothers reckoning when she watched the basement tapes... like all of these don't blame my parents or the school etc... would help absolve everything and make it ok.

Maybe Eric's writing was supposed to mean that the school wouldn't have been able to prevent this. Don't blame them because they really had no warning.

I don't think he meant "don't blame the school for our anger".

Littlelo wrote:

Maybe Eric's writing was supposed to mean that the school wouldn't have been able to prevent this. Don't blame them because they really had no warning.

I don't think he meant "don't blame the school for our anger".

Maybe! That makes a lot more sense.

Littlelo wrote:

In one of Eric's writings where he describes the plan for NBK, he says the following:

"We are kind of a select case here so don't think this will happen again. Don't blame the school, don't fucking put cops all over the place just because we went on a killing spree doesn't mean everyone else will...the admin is doing a fine job as it is"
[pg. 26344]

I think this is an inaccurate quote.

Love wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

In one of Eric's writings where he describes the plan for NBK, he says the following:

"We are kind of a select case here so don't think this will happen again. Don't blame the school, don't fucking put cops all over the place just because we went on a killing spree doesn't mean everyone else will...the admin is doing a fine job as it is"
[pg. 26344]

I think this is an inaccurate quote.

The quote is taken directly from the 11k (2nd photo below):

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

I have always thought Eric and Dylan just used the school to do NBK, but it was never about the school, their reasons for doing NBK was never about bullying or the school or even the kids in it.

42099_4EVA wrote:

Well...here's my weirdo opinion again lol, I have always thought Eric and Dylan just used the school to do NBK, but it was never about the school, their reasons for doing NBK was never about bullying or the school or even the kids in it, I believe Eric just used the kids at the school as an excuse, because his pride wouldn't let him reveal the real reason why he wanted to do NBK.

I think had Eric dropped his pride and just been honest, we would've all known (via all his journal entries) the real truth as to why Eric, and Dylan did NBK, but yeah I no longer think bullying nor Columbine was to blame for NBK.

I guess I can concede that it was more about destruction to them and making a statement, but I do think they saw the school as a symbol for all of the anger and misery they felt, even if there were other outside factors that contributed to it.

Even when Dylan writes to Eric in his yearbook, he says "NBK will be the ultimate revenge, to our shitlists, the pigs, everyone!"

I think this is why a lot of people get confused. No one on their "shit lists" was targeted. Sure, they shot at the police, but they didn't necessarily target them either.

I wonder sometimes if this was a brief period of self-awareness. Obviously the bullying culture at Columbine was at least somewhat of a factor in their motivations (even though the degree of which can be debated), but at the end of the day, they killed because they wanted to. There was some underlying desire there that was spurred by these external factors. I side with the coincidence/convenience rationale.

Maybe this is Eric acknowledging that "Yes, we're targeting the school, but we know we're not the only ones getting bullied, we know that this isn't the only school in America that's like this. But it is our school, and this is why it will be the one to fall."

It was a desire for mass destruction that was channeled into the school because they already grievance against it and already knew the best way to target it.

Then it could have been Eric being contradicting again. After all, Eric did say he hated racism, then at another point, he turned around and talked racist about blacks and Hispanics and was all "heil Hitler". So it seems that he sometimes contradicted himself. So perhaps that's what this was - he said, "don't blame the school", but during another point, didn't - I believe Eric say - it was the kids at the school who made him the way he was and said bring on more hate or whatever? So maybe it was just him contradicting himself again.

Littlelo wrote:

I think this is why a lot of people get confused. No one on their "shit lists" was targeted. 

I wonder if anyone on the "shit lists" were in the cafeteria on the day of the killings.

QuestionMark wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

I think this is why a lot of people get confused. No one on their "shit lists" was targeted. 

I wonder if anyone on the "shit lists" were in the cafeteria on the day of the killings.

Actually, I recall reading something in the 11k about someone from one of their lists actually being in the library that day. I have to go back and check.

Here is the interview I was talking about, [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

He writes "i don't want no fucking laws on buying fucking pvc pipes" after they used them for their pipe bombs. It is odd how concerned he was for the world after he would leave it, he didn't want other people getting problems for what they did, he said he wanted only themselves blamed and he didn't want them to change any laws or make extra hassle for people who just want to purchase everyday items and can't because they would be considered an ingredient in a bomb.

But he also writes that he wants to "fuck up as much stuff as we can" so he does want to create a domino effect of problems.

spidEr wrote:

He writes "i don't want no fucking laws on buying fucking pvc pipes" after they used them for their pipe bombs. It is odd how concerned he was for the world after he would leave it, he didn't want other people getting problems for what they did, he said he wanted only themselves blamed and he didn't want them to change any laws or make extra hassle for people who just want to purchase everyday items and can't because they would be considered an ingredient in a bomb.

But he also writes that he wants to "fuck up as much stuff as we can" so he does want to create a domino effect of problems.

It is strange how often he seems to contradict himself, while also appearing to show a lot of conviction. It's clear he was delusional and naive about a lot. Both E&D were.

spidEr wrote:

He writes "i don't want no fucking laws on buying fucking pvc pipes" after they used them for their pipe bombs. It is odd how concerned he was for the world after he would leave it, he didn't want other people getting problems for what they did, he said he wanted only themselves blamed and he didn't want them to change any laws or make extra hassle for people who just want to purchase everyday items and can't because they would be considered an ingredient in a bomb.

But he also writes that he wants to "fuck up as much stuff as we can" so he does want to create a domino effect of problems.

Perhaps he didn't want potential future shooters to be constrained by laws.

fly-with-me wrote:

spidEr wrote:

He writes "i don't want no fucking laws on buying fucking pvc pipes" after they used them for their pipe bombs. It is odd how concerned he was for the world after he would leave it, he didn't want other people getting problems for what they did, he said he wanted only themselves blamed and he didn't want them to change any laws or make extra hassle for people who just want to purchase everyday items and can't because they would be considered an ingredient in a bomb.

But he also writes that he wants to "fuck up as much stuff as we can" so he does want to create a domino effect of problems.

Perhaps he didn't want potential future shooters to be constrained by laws.

This what I figured. Both of them wanted "followers" after all.

fly-with-me wrote:

spidEr wrote:

He writes "i don't want no fucking laws on buying fucking pvc pipes" after they used them for their pipe bombs. It is odd how concerned he was for the world after he would leave it, he didn't want other people getting problems for what they did, he said he wanted only themselves blamed and he didn't want them to change any laws or make extra hassle for people who just want to purchase everyday items and can't because they would be considered an ingredient in a bomb.

But he also writes that he wants to "fuck up as much stuff as we can" so he does want to create a domino effect of problems.

Perhaps he didn't want potential future shooters to be constrained by laws.

I agree with this. He wanted to kick start an entire movement, so he likely wouldn't want things made harder for someone who wanted to follow in their foot steps.

It is well known that Eric often contradicted himself. But now whether he did it on purpose or not is anyone's guess. I lean more towards he did it just to fuck with peoples heads, considering he did do it constantly.

Yeah I think he knew he contradicted himself at times so you're probably right about fucking with people. He also said being hypocritical was only OK for him.

Littlelo wrote:

Yeah I think he knew he contradicted himself at times so you're probably right about fucking with people. He also said being hypocritical was only OK for him.

With all we know on Eric, he did like things that had double meaning, he like foreshadowing, etc. So him saying things JUST to confuse the hell out of everyone would be something he likely would have laughed at. Probably thinking how clever he was since he was the only one who knew what was going on, or what he truly meant.

Eric possibly wrote many of the entries in a single day, just labeling them as if he has been writing them for months. He laughed in the BT about people not knowing why they did it. He probably contradicted himself on purpose to drive whoever is trying to find answers on a wild goose chase and never find a definitive answer.

spidEr wrote:

Eric possibly wrote many of the entries in a single day, just labeling them as if he has been writing them for months. He laughed in the BT about people not knowing why they did it. He probably contradicted himself on purpose to drive whoever is trying to find answers on a wild goose chase and never find a definitive answer.

Anything is possible. Here we are 18+ years later, still trying to pick apart Columbine.

Littlelo wrote:

Here is the interview I was talking about, [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]:

Whoever they are, they must but extraordinarily lucky. 

spidEr wrote:

He writes "i don't want no fucking laws on buying fucking pvc pipes" after they used them for their pipe bombs. It is odd how concerned he was for the world after he would leave it, he didn't want other people getting problems for what they did, he said he wanted only themselves blamed and he didn't want them to change any laws or make extra hassle for people who just want to purchase everyday items and can't because they would be considered an ingredient in a bomb.

But he also writes that he wants to "fuck up as much stuff as we can" so he does want to create a domino effect of problems.

He also mentioned on TBT that they shouldn't change gun laws after the massacre, reasoning "how do you think we got ours?". So it might just be Eric telling people that whatever solutions they propose after the massacre is pointless and isn't going to stop the next killer.

QuestionMark wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

Here is the interview I was talking about, [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]:

Whoever they are, they must but extraordinarily lucky. 

spidEr wrote:

He writes "i don't want no fucking laws on buying fucking pvc pipes" after they used them for their pipe bombs. It is odd how concerned he was for the world after he would leave it, he didn't want other people getting problems for what they did, he said he wanted only themselves blamed and he didn't want them to change any laws or make extra hassle for people who just want to purchase everyday items and can't because they would be considered an ingredient in a bomb.

But he also writes that he wants to "fuck up as much stuff as we can" so he does want to create a domino effect of problems.

He also mentioned on TBT that they shouldn't change gun laws after the massacre, reasoning "how do you think we got ours?". So it might just be Eric telling people that whatever solutions they propose after the massacre that all of it is pointless and isn't going to stop the next killer.

I forgot about that line from TBT...also very telling.

Littlelo wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

Here is the interview I was talking about, [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]:

Whoever they are, they must but extraordinarily lucky. 

spidEr wrote:

He writes "i don't want no fucking laws on buying fucking pvc pipes" after they used them for their pipe bombs. It is odd how concerned he was for the world after he would leave it, he didn't want other people getting problems for what they did, he said he wanted only themselves blamed and he didn't want them to change any laws or make extra hassle for people who just want to purchase everyday items and can't because they would be considered an ingredient in a bomb.

But he also writes that he wants to "fuck up as much stuff as we can" so he does want to create a domino effect of problems.

He also mentioned on TBT that they shouldn't change gun laws after the massacre, reasoning "how do you think we got ours?". So it might just be Eric telling people that whatever solutions they propose after the massacre that all of it is pointless and isn't going to stop the next killer.

I forgot about that line from TBT...also very telling.

People are still trying to debunk the "gun show loophole' They got 3 of their guns and she didn't get into any trouble.

Say what you want, but the kids were forward thinkers. They just chose a horrible path.

I agree with the other user, in context and relation to what he said in the same paragraph, it is highly likely that he meant don’t blame the school for not preventing the massacre.

Could also be that the school environment was simple hierarchy, and that Eric didn't fit in/wasn't strong enough to be at the top (survival of the fittest/natural selection type of mindset). He wanted to though.

He saw no problem with the way things were structured in the school, he personally wrote about removing all the "lower" beings from earth, people that were weaker. It wasn't the schools fault he didn't fit in, and had a bunch of friends, a hot girlfriend. It was his fault. Goes hand in hand with him hating himself a lot, and ultimately committing suicide.

Just a thought