Why did Eric shoot at a propane tank in the empty cafeteria?

When you consider E & D's objective was to kill hundreds of their fellow students ,why did Eric try to blow up an empty cafeteria? They both had enough bullets to kill a hell of a lot of people. Why waste time attempting to destroy an empty room? Another thing bugs me too. Whilst in the library ,why didn't E & D have everyone stand up in a line and execute them? Why didn't they go from room to room and carry out executions? I know they told everyone in the library to stand up ( i guess they lacked authority) They were there to kill as many people as they could. Was the cafeteria bombing their MAIN objective? Could Eric not face defeat? The more time they spent in that empty cafe ,the less time time they had to complete their objectives. I guess they could not tolerate failure. I guess they never could..

The bombing was their main objective, yes. Columbine was meant to be a bombing, not a shooting. They figured their bombs would kill hundreds of people and the shooting was only to kill the ones who survived the bombing. They were going to shoot people as they ran out of the school.

Why didn't Dylan and Eric have people stand in a line and execute them? That would never work. There was only two of them and people that are scared and hiding are not going to just come out of their hiding spots and say "Here I am, go ahead and shoot me". If you were in this situation, would you have stood up? Knowing you'd be killed for sure or would you take your chances and stay in your hiding spot and hope you don't get shot? I think most people would stay put.

I think Eric felt very defeated that his bombs didn't blow up. A year's worth of work for nothing and then on top of that, he broke his nose and was probably bleeding and in a lot of pain. It seems to me that all Eric was interested in after the Library shooting was going down to the Cafeteria to shoot at those bombs to try and get them to blow up. At this point, if they did blow up, all that would have happened is they would have killed the few remaining people in the Cafeteria, themselves and maybe done some structural damage to the school. I don't think it mattered to Eric that the Cafeteria was nearly empty. I think he wanted those bombs to blow up so that this mission wasn't a complete failure. He set out to blow up that Cafeteria and that is what he was going to try and accomplish, whether it blew his ass up too or not. He wanted those bombs to explode.

I think Eric died feeling like this whole mission was a complete failure. I think he was disappointed. I think he was in pain from a broken nose which I am sure he felt that getting that broken nose ruined it for him. How could he enjoy doing this when he was in pain and bleeding? I bet Eric thought to himself that it didn't turn out how he thought it would and was the whole thing even really worth it. And I am sure a lot of people feel like why should he die with the satisfaction of knowing it went as planned and exactly how he wanted it to?

I don't think Dylan gave a shit one way or the other. The bombs could have blown up and he'd be fine with that. The bombs didn't blow up and that was OK too. He just wanted to run around like a lunatic, have some fun killing people and then kill himself. He didn't care what happened, just as long as he was dead at the end of it.

That is just my 2 cents anyway.

Thanks for that Jenn! You clarified a few points for me. Would i stand up? Honestly..NO. I have reading about the cafe bomb and how it was triggered. I know that you will be well aware of how the bomb was made and how it functioned. I am not knowledgeable when it comes to bombs. Common sense tells me that the plan was doomed to fail. So a container of petrol sat beside the propane ,the petrol would burn and heat up the propane tank and BOOM! They wanted it to blow up and be a deadly shrapnel blast? I cant quite understand how they thought it would blowup without triggering the sprinkler system. Using TNT or C4 etc, would trigger an instant blast. Planting a bomb that needs to be 'warmed up' beforehand ? What do you think Jenn? I would like your opinion please.

These bombs were doomed to fail no matter what way you look at it. Lets say for arguments sake that things worked out as planned. The alarm clocks rang and ignited a spark that ran down the cannon fuse to the gasoline which then caught on fire. That fire has to burn for at least 5-20 minutes to heat up that propane tank to the point of explosion. As soon as that fire started, the sprinkler system would have turned on, putting the fire out and the bombs never would have exploded.

Now lets say there was no sprinkler system and again things worked out as planned, the alarm clocks rang and ignited a spark that ran down the cannon fuse to the gasoline tank which then caught on fire.  As soon as the people in the Cafeteria saw this fire they would have done one of two things. They would have 1. Ran out of the school to safety or 2. Would have put the fire out themselves. And being that there are teachers all around that Cafeteria and their priority is to keep the students safe, it is almost a guarantee that someone would have put that fire out before those propane tanks could heat up to the point of explosion.  

No, the propane bombs did not have shrapnel on them, not that I am aware of anyway. To my knowledge, it was only the pipe bombs that had shrapnel.

I believe that Eric was under the impression that as soon as this fire ran down the length of the cannon fuse and lit that fire that the propane tanks would explode instantly. If he would have known that the tank had to heat up before it would explode, he would have realized that using propane tanks never would have worked.

I don't think Eric did much research on this nor do I think he actually tested this idea before doing it. I guess it is good that he didn't or maybe if he did test it he would have realized it wouldn't have worked and decided not to go through with it. I guess we will never know.

I've spent a lot of time on these bombs. Trying to figure out how Eric thought they were going to work and I still don't have all the answers I am looking for. Like why didn't he research this more? This was his life's work, this is what he lived and was going to die for and he never tested this idea beforehand? He never actually thought this through? That is the one thing that baffles me the most, that he never tested this beforehand. I don't think he even bought the propane tanks until the morning of the massacre. I just can't grasp that. That this is what you're going to die for and you are not 100% sure it will even work? But then I remember he was basically just a kid and kids can be really naive. I bet he never even doubted it would work. He probably thought he had it all figured out and it would go exactly how he thought it would. Luckily he was naive and thought he had it all figured out because if he would have second guessed himself just once, it could have been a lot worse.

Again, just my 2 cents. I have no proof of any of this. It is just how I feel and how I think Eric thought.

I would like to know more about their thought process. The basement tapes apparently include a lot of discussion of this, but only in digest form. For example from 3/18:

They say that they need a "lot more napalm" and may just use "gas and oil". They express concern that it will be tough, and opening the zipper may make it go off. They say they need some "back-ups". They talk about how the sprinkler system may "put out a fire" and Eric says he should possibly keep the battery out of the device, set the bag, put it in and leave so it doesn't "blow up in the commons".

Is this a description of some alternate device or the same one? Or two different ones? In any case, it seems they were well aware of the sprinkler problem, which is perhaps an indication that Eric was not as surprised or disappointed as we think.

This sounds like the familiar one, from the same date:

They say they need "devices" for the propane tanks and they need more "bomb holders". Eric says they need to go to Radio Shack because he heard they had a "thing to increase the voltage" through a clock and speaker, igniting a solar igniter.


It sounds like the original plan involved putting bags of homemade napalm nearby, which was eventually scrapped? From 3/15:

The boys talk about the large propane bombs they plan to use on the unsuspecting students in the school cafeteria. They discuss bombs and two bags of "propane and napalm"

Am I reading that correctly?

Jenn wrote:

These bombs were doomed to fail no matter what way you look at it. Lets say for arguments sake that things worked out as planned. The alarm clocks rang and ignited a spark that ran down the cannon fuse to the gasoline which then caught on fire. That fire has to burn for at least 5-20 minutes to heat up that propane tank to the point of explosion. As soon as that fire started, the sprinkler system would have turned on, putting the fire out and the bombs never would have exploded.

Now lets say there was no sprinkler system and again things worked out as planned, the alarm clocks rang and ignited a spark that ran down the cannon fuse to the gasoline tank which then caught on fire.  As soon as the people in the Cafeteria saw this fire they would have done one of two things. They would have 1. Ran out of the school to safety or 2. Would have put the fire out themselves. And being that there are teachers all around that Cafeteria and their priority is to keep the students safe, it is almost a guarantee that someone would have put that fire out before those propane tanks could heat up to the point of explosion.  

No, the propane bombs did not have shrapnel on them, not that I am aware of anyway. To my knowledge, it was only the pipe bombs that had shrapnel.

I believe that Eric was under the impression that as soon as this fire ran down the length of the cannon fuse and lit that fire that the propane tanks would explode instantly. If he would have known that the tank had to heat up before it would explode, he would have realized that using propane tanks never would have worked.

I don't think Eric did much research on this nor do I think he actually tested this idea before doing it. I guess it is good that he didn't or maybe if he did test it he would have realized it wouldn't have worked and decided not to go through with it. I guess we will never know.

I've spent a lot of time on these bombs. Trying to figure out how Eric thought they were going to work and I still don't have all the answers I am looking for. Like why didn't he research this more? This was his life's work, this is what he lived and was going to die for and he never tested this idea beforehand? He never actually thought this through? That is the one thing that baffles me the most, that he never tested this beforehand. I don't think he even bought the propane tanks until the morning of the massacre. I just can't grasp that. That this is what you're going to die for and you are not 100% sure it will even work? But then I remember he was basically just a kid and kids can be really naive. I bet he never even doubted it would work. He probably thought he had it all figured out and it would go exactly how he thought it would. Luckily he was naive and thought he had it all figured out because if he would have second guessed himself just once, it could have been a lot worse.

Again, just my 2 cents. I have no proof of any of this. It is just how I feel and how I think Eric thought.

If they had tested the propane and found that it would not blowup instantly ,E&D may have looked into using other explosives. I think Eric researched the ' anarchists cookbook'. They might have learnt how to make bombs from chemicals that are cheap and available to buy innocently. I think their lack of bomb making skills probably saved a hell of a lot of lives. They said that they wanted the bombing to rival? Timothy Mcveigh? I wonder why they didn't use Mcveighs recipe? Or any other known recipe from the 'cookbook'? Its a mystery !

rik75 wrote:

Jenn wrote:

These bombs were doomed to fail no matter what way you look at it. Lets say for arguments sake that things worked out as planned. The alarm clocks rang and ignited a spark that ran down the cannon fuse to the gasoline which then caught on fire. That fire has to burn for at least 5-20 minutes to heat up that propane tank to the point of explosion. As soon as that fire started, the sprinkler system would have turned on, putting the fire out and the bombs never would have exploded.

Now lets say there was no sprinkler system and again things worked out as planned, the alarm clocks rang and ignited a spark that ran down the cannon fuse to the gasoline tank which then caught on fire.  As soon as the people in the Cafeteria saw this fire they would have done one of two things. They would have 1. Ran out of the school to safety or 2. Would have put the fire out themselves. And being that there are teachers all around that Cafeteria and their priority is to keep the students safe, it is almost a guarantee that someone would have put that fire out before those propane tanks could heat up to the point of explosion.  

No, the propane bombs did not have shrapnel on them, not that I am aware of anyway. To my knowledge, it was only the pipe bombs that had shrapnel.

I believe that Eric was under the impression that as soon as this fire ran down the length of the cannon fuse and lit that fire that the propane tanks would explode instantly. If he would have known that the tank had to heat up before it would explode, he would have realized that using propane tanks never would have worked.

I don't think Eric did much research on this nor do I think he actually tested this idea before doing it. I guess it is good that he didn't or maybe if he did test it he would have realized it wouldn't have worked and decided not to go through with it. I guess we will never know.

I've spent a lot of time on these bombs. Trying to figure out how Eric thought they were going to work and I still don't have all the answers I am looking for. Like why didn't he research this more? This was his life's work, this is what he lived and was going to die for and he never tested this idea beforehand? He never actually thought this through? That is the one thing that baffles me the most, that he never tested this beforehand. I don't think he even bought the propane tanks until the morning of the massacre. I just can't grasp that. That this is what you're going to die for and you are not 100% sure it will even work? But then I remember he was basically just a kid and kids can be really naive. I bet he never even doubted it would work. He probably thought he had it all figured out and it would go exactly how he thought it would. Luckily he was naive and thought he had it all figured out because if he would have second guessed himself just once, it could have been a lot worse.

Again, just my 2 cents. I have no proof of any of this. It is just how I feel and how I think Eric thought.

If they had tested the propane and found that it would not blowup instantly ,E&D may have looked into using other explosives. I think Eric researched the ' anarchists cookbook'. They might have learnt how to make bombs from chemicals that are cheap and available to buy innocently. I think their lack of bomb making skills probably saved a hell of a lot of lives. They said that they wanted the bombing to rival? Timothy Mcveigh? I wonder why they didn't use Mcveighs recipe? Or any other known recipe from the 'cookbook'? Its a mystery !

How can someone even buy bomb making equipment "innocently"? If the intention is to blow up a school full of children, there's hardly anything innocent about that. And they didn't use Mcveigh's "recipe" because they were two teenage boys who were on a strict budget. There's no mystery in stupidity, and both Eric and Dylan did show that with their horrid planning and terrible bomb designs.

" McVeigh did not need to raise money for the bomb, which only cost about $5,000."

Eric and Dylan had nowhere near enough money to create a bomb of that magnitude.



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McVeighs bomb was made from fertilizer. Doesnt you have to prove that youre a farmer, when you buy big amounts of fertilizer? McVeigh lived at the farm of Terry Nichols at the time, he planned and build the bomb. Breivik even created a fake Geofarm-company to buy similar substances (sure this was in Norway, so the laws may be different).
But if this is correct, there would have been no way for Eric to buy a huge amount of fertilizer.

Ivan wrote:

How can someone even buy bomb making equipment "innocently"? If the intention is to blow up a school full of children, there's hardly anything innocent about that. And they didn't use Mcveigh's "recipe" because they were two teenage boys who were on a strict budget. There's no mystery in stupidity, and both Eric and Dylan did show that with their horrid planning and terrible bomb designs.

I really don't think rik75 used the word "innocent" to mean free of guilt. I think he used it to say that the materials could be bought without someone thinking suspiciously of it.

lasttrain wrote:

I would like to know more about their thought process.  The basement tapes apparently include a lot of discussion of this, but only in digest form.  For example from 3/18:

They say that they need a "lot more napalm" and may just use "gas and oil". They express concern that it will be tough, and opening the zipper may make it go off. They say they need some "back-ups". They talk about how the sprinkler system may "put out a fire" and Eric says he should possibly keep the battery out of the device, set the bag, put it in and leave so it doesn't "blow up in the commons".

Is this a description of some alternate device or the same one?  Or two different ones?  In any case, it seems they were well aware of the sprinkler problem, which is perhaps an indication that Eric was not as surprised or disappointed as we think.

This sounds like the familiar one, from the same date:

They say they need "devices" for the propane tanks and they need more "bomb holders". Eric says they need to go to Radio Shack because he heard they had a "thing to increase the voltage" through a clock and speaker, igniting a solar igniter.


It sounds like the original plan involved putting bags of homemade napalm nearby, which was eventually scrapped?  From 3/15:

The boys talk about the large propane bombs they plan to use on the unsuspecting students in the school cafeteria. They discuss bombs and two bags of "propane and napalm"

Am I reading that correctly?  

I'm not really sure what your question is but as far as Eric talking about keeping the battery out of the device. He is referring to the propane bombs they brought into the Cafeteria on the morning of the shooting, not a different bomb. He used a 9 volt battery attached to an alarm clock. Perhaps he was afraid the movement of the bag would accidentally set the alarm clock off, igniting a spark from the battery and starting the fire? Maybe he was suggesting that he wait until he set the bag down in the Cafeteria, attach the battery then and set the clock, to avoid the thing from blowing up while he was carrying it in.

If this is the case and that is how he was thinking then that is just more proof he wasn't aware of the fact that the propane tank had to heat up before it would explode.

I honestly don't know what the hell they were talking about when they said they needed 'back ups', that could mean anything, really. I imagine it had something to do with bombs though.

Eric saying the sprinkler system could put out "a fire" does not necessarily mean the fire in the Cafeteria that was meant to heat up the tanks for the explosion, because like I said, I don't think he was aware the things had to heat up and him being so concerned that the thing would blow up while he was carrying it makes me believe that.(No I don't have actual proof, just what I think). Eric could have been talking about any one of the fires a pipe bomb or Molotov would have created. If they wanted to do a lot of damage to the school, then they would have wanted to set off a lot of pipe bombs and Molotov's to set the place on fire and they wouldn't want some sprinklers coming on and putting out all their fires.

I don't know much about the napalm they were talking about. As far as I know they used gasoline. Maybe this was an earlier idea that they didn't go through with. I don't remember reading anything about napalm actually being at the crime scene. If someone else knows anything about that perhaps they could add it in?

"Devices" for the propane tanks could mean clocks, batteries or cannon fuse, I suppose. I really don't know what else they could be talking about and "bomb holders" could be bags they needed to buy to carry their pipe bombs in. Again, I don't really know for sure what they were talking about with that. The transcripts that are available for the basement tapes don't really go into detail about what they were talking about. And God only knows if they even explained it on video. They were probably talking to each other and they knew what they hell they were talking about but didn't shed any light in the video about exactly what they meant.

fatlittleparasite wrote:

Ivan wrote:

How can someone even buy bomb making equipment "innocently"? If the intention is to blow up a school full of children, there's hardly anything innocent about that. And they didn't use Mcveigh's "recipe" because they were two teenage boys who were on a strict budget. There's no mystery in stupidity, and both Eric and Dylan did show that with their horrid planning and terrible bomb designs.

I really don't think rik75 used the word "innocent" to mean free of guilt. I think he used it to say that the materials could be bought without someone thinking suspiciously of it.

That is what i meant by using the "innocently". Thank you fatlittleparasite.

Yes i do think that their confidence regarding the cafe bombs capabilities were unrealistic and rather sloppy. It WILL be an awesome explosion and it will kill hundreds because we have the power and WE ARE GODLIKE! Now thats quite an inflated viewpoint (especially for a couple of kids)My main point is this : If they had tested the propane bombs beforehand and realized that there would be no Instant explosion ,what then? Ok they cant really afford to buy a truck load of fertilizer & ammonia etc. But then again ,they only wanted to blowup one room (and its occupants)They took apart a lot of fireworks and collected the black powder. Instead of making dozens of pipe bombs ,which were nothing more than big firecrackers. What if they had made 1 pipe bomb? A large pipe bomb. A bomb that would explode Instantly. Its inside a duffle bag and surrounded by gallons of petrol/oil and hundred of nails. Triggering a 30 second cannon fuse ,it would blowup and ignite the fuel. There would be a massive blast ,a massive fire blast and a massive shrapnel blast. That is just 1 alternative. As i have said previously ,i know nothing about bombs ,but they did? Thankfully they both believed their bomb would do as planned and thankfully they never tested the propane abilities and thankfully they had no other minds involved ,more minds can have more ideas and better ideas.

The napalm thing bothers me. Jenn, to my knowledge, no napalm or any substance that could be mistaken for napalm was found at the scene or even in their cars or rooms. And apparently they stored it at someone else's house? Wasn't there a quote about that in the basement tapes?

I wonder if they considered disabling the sprinklers, locking all the doors and just burning the school down. I don't know much about bombs...or arson, for that matter. But it seems like that might be easiser. Then again, that school had a TON of doors.

About the napalm: I read some notice of Eric that they tested napalm. But I am no expert with bombs. Don´t know why they didn´t use napalm. And I don´t understand their propane bombs. I discussed it with two of my friends who were in the army and both said that propane bombs aren´t the best thing because they need too much time to heat and that they would use other bombs.

At the end of the day, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were two kids who used internet instructions to construct their bombs. They were too inebriated with the thought of taking revenge, rather than checking which was the best option bomb to build.

The fact that they never tested a few bombs in an open field also boggles the mind. Ignorant kids.

JDM87 wrote:

At the end of the day, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were two kids who used internet instructions to construct their bombs. They were too inebriated with the thought of taking revenge, rather than checking which was the best option bomb to build.

The fact that they never tested a few bombs in an open field also boggles the mind. Ignorant kids.

Excellent points.

There is no question that they were quite naive and ignorant in many ways, particularly concerning this. The more things of this nature are discussed it further emphasizes just how young they truly were in every way.

em81 wrote:

About the napalm: I read some notice of Eric that they tested napalm. But I am no expert with bombs. Don´t know why they didn´t use napalm. And I don´t understand their propane bombs. I discussed it with two of my friends who were in the army and both said that propane bombs aren´t the best thing because they need too much time to heat and that they would use other bombs.

He em81, i was reading the ' basement tapes ' transcript on wiki and Eric was talking and was being filmed looking through his journal. Eric points out one of his drawings. It is a picture of a backpack and it has ' napalm ' written on it and Eric said that's his suicide plan. He talks about how his attack plans have changed over the year. Did he plan to blow himself up with napalm? I'm not sure what to make of it 

JDM87 wrote:

At the end of the day, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were two kids who used internet instructions to construct their bombs. They were too inebriated with the thought of taking revenge, rather than checking which was the best option bomb to build.

The fact that they never tested a few bombs in an open field also boggles the mind. Ignorant kids.

Yep, me too. That is one thing I always think to myself. Why didn't they take one of these bombs they were concocting up into the mountains and test it out, to make sure the stupid thing would work?

Erics plan and thinking process itself lacked insight as well as depth. For God sake all this shit happened bc either one of em could see past fuckn high school. As for the bombs, Eric was drunk on OCd mixed with narcicism clouding his vision...thank god.

In the CCTV footage Eric is seen shooting at one of the propane tanks with his rifle from the stairs, but it doesn't go off immediately and only partially explodes/ignites, though maybe that fire was from Dylan's molotov cocktail? I may be wrong so forgive me if I am because I haven't seen the CCTV in a while

Pretty clearly from the footage and evidence, and at least from what I understand, the molotov cocktail lit the gas can next to the propane tank/bomb. Eric's gunshot did nothing, and nothing partially detonated.

Given Jeffco's bs, it's easy to get confused. On the CNN/Jeffco CD, it says the bomb partially detonated, then shows a picture of the wrong bomb, and it says it took out the windows, which was apparently due to one of the pipe bombs they tossed into the cafeteria.

Randy Brown's theory of hypervigilance seems to be the case, the main objective was to destroy that building. You even see part of the video 3 kids run out of the side doors after the fire begins and you can see Eric and Dylan in the top corner who seem to have no interest in shooting them. Eric even runs away from the fire, as does the other kids.