Columbine High School Massacre Discussion Forum
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.
Columbine High School Massacre Discussion Forum

A place to discuss the Columbine High School Massacre along with other school shootings and crimes.
Anyone interested in researching, learning, discussing and debating with us, please come join our community!
 
HomeHome  PortalPortal  CalendarCalendar  Latest imagesLatest images  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  RegisterRegister  Log inLog in  

 

 Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?

Go down 
4 posters
AuthorMessage
Moseley




Posts : 107
Contribution Points : 96457
Forum Reputation : 0
Join date : 2013-10-30

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeMon Nov 04, 2013 10:18 am

That's what the actor who plays him says in "Zero Hour", was that just improvisation from the actor or did Eric actually say that?

I ask because he did carry out shooting in the Commons later and witnesses say they saw both him and Dylan reload in the hallway?
Back to top Go down
rik75




Posts : 504
Contribution Points : 97618
Forum Reputation : 50
Join date : 2013-10-12
Age : 48
Location : Cornwall England

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeMon Nov 04, 2013 10:41 am

Check this out. [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
rik75




Posts : 504
Contribution Points : 97618
Forum Reputation : 50
Join date : 2013-10-12
Age : 48
Location : Cornwall England

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeMon Nov 04, 2013 10:49 am

Moseley wrote:
That's what the actor who plays him says in "Zero Hour", was that just improvisation from the actor or did Eric actually say that?

I ask because he did carry out shooting in the Commons later and witnesses say they saw both him and Dylan reload in the hallway?
They did reload several times ,but they didn't run out of bullets. They had enough bullets to kill dozens and dozens more people.
Back to top Go down
rik75




Posts : 504
Contribution Points : 97618
Forum Reputation : 50
Join date : 2013-10-12
Age : 48
Location : Cornwall England

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeMon Nov 04, 2013 10:57 am

Also ,there are a lot of theories as to why they stopped killing kids. One being that they knew that SWAT would be charging in at any moment. They probably didn't fancy the idea of a fire fight with SWAT. Neil Gardner yes. SWAT had a lot of fire power ,much more than E&D.
Back to top Go down
Moseley




Posts : 107
Contribution Points : 96457
Forum Reputation : 0
Join date : 2013-10-30

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeMon Nov 04, 2013 11:18 am

That's very true. I wonder if they knew that SWAT wouldn't reach library till much later they would have continued killing. But I guess Eric was really pre-occupied with bombs and probably thought it was his main focus.
Back to top Go down
rik75




Posts : 504
Contribution Points : 97618
Forum Reputation : 50
Join date : 2013-10-12
Age : 48
Location : Cornwall England

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeMon Nov 04, 2013 5:53 pm

Moseley wrote:
That's very true. I wonder if they knew that SWAT wouldn't reach library till much later they would have continued killing. But I guess Eric was really pre-occupied with bombs and probably thought it was his main focus.
E&D wouldn't have known exactly when SWAT would enter ,they knew the place was being surrounded by regular cops. They knew that time was running out. Yes your right about Eric's concern regarding the cafe bombs. The bombs failed. 12 months of planning went up in smoke ( pun intended ) I guess Eric couldn't accept the failure. As we all know ,Eric shot at the bombs in the empty cafe. He had to blow them up even though the blast would have caused no deaths. He had to go out with a bang ( pun intended )Right now in my opinion ,E&D set the cafe bombs ,they waited a few minutes and they didn't blow. They had a few shots and killed a few outside. They went inside and shot a few people and threw some bombs. Upon entering the school they went along the east hallway ( far from the library ) and let out some bullets and bombs. Dylan ( i think ) then approached the library by himself. He passed by and didn't even look through the windows. By that time Patti Nielson had made the 911 call. All the kids would have been hidden under the desks. I have 1 query. HOW DID ERIC and DYLAN KNOW THE LIBRARY WAS FULL?? As far as E&D knew ,everybody could have already left the library via the north exit. Could they have seen a few kids that were not quite hidden ,due to the fact that some were trying to hide next to desks rather than under the desks. E&D possibly thought that there was 5 or 10 kids in there?  Entry of the library may have also been a good viewpoint. As in E&D had a good view of the outside and could monitor the arrival of the cops etc.
Back to top Go down
rik75




Posts : 504
Contribution Points : 97618
Forum Reputation : 50
Join date : 2013-10-12
Age : 48
Location : Cornwall England

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeMon Nov 04, 2013 6:23 pm

Also, E&D left the library and went down to the cafe and had a drink and blew a few pipes and came back up and BANG BANG ! Game over
Back to top Go down
mattmatthew1337




Posts : 10
Contribution Points : 96076
Forum Reputation : 0
Join date : 2013-11-10
Age : 28

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeTue Nov 12, 2013 12:30 pm

I think it is likely that lack of ammunition contributed to them offing themselves when they did.
Eric had expended 10 of his 12x10 round clips. He was found with only 2 clips in his pocket with one having 10x9mm rounds and the other having 8x9mm rounds. Eric was found with 14 shotgun shells in 5 green pouches attached to black shoulder straps, and he had another green pouch in his left pocket containing 10 shotgun shells. 1 more shotgun shell was unfired in the internal magazine of his pump action shotgun. Dylan left a 36 round magazine in his car (loaded with 34 rounds), his 50 round magazine was dropped outside possibly because of malfunction (it was found with 40 rounds in it), and he had just about emptied a 36 round magazine which malfunctioned in the hallway. His final 24 round magazine was found with 3 rounds in it, there was a round in the Tec-9 chamber which meant before he shot himself Dylan had a total of 5x9mm rounds left. Dylan was found with 14 shotgun shells in his black nylon belt, and a green pouch found near the entrance to the library in the hallway contained 7 shotgun shells (this would have been worn around Dylan's right shin as it can be seen in the cafateria footage. Dylan was found with 7 crickets and 1 pipebomb in his pocket while Eric had 5 crickets in his pocket. A further 5 crickets were found on the floor near their bodies. So here is the total ammunition that they had available unfired which they could have used:

Eric: 18x9mm rounds
      23x12 ga shotgun shells
Dylan: 5x9mm rounds
         14x12 ga shotgun shells
Both: 17 crickets, 1 pipebomb

While they both had an adequate amount of shotgun shells remaining, their shotguns were the secondary weapons and they could not hope to engage any SWAT with shotguns as it takes time to reload them. Their primary semi-automatic weapons were very low on ammunition. I think multiple reasons contributed to their suicide. 1.) Their cafateria bombs had failed to detonate and their master plan failed. 2.) They failed to initiate a detonation even after shooting the tanks and throwing a molotov cocktail at it. 3.) their car bombs failed to go off creating the casualties they wanted to cause. 4.) Eric had his nose broken which would have been hurting him by this point. 5.) They would have witnessed hundreds of police outside their windows showing the gravity of what had occurred and the impossible force they now would have to face. 6.) When they returned to the library possibly to continue the massacre, everyone was gone, and it appeared a majority in the school had already fled. 7.) after 40+ minutes their adrenaline would have worn down, they would have experienced a crash 8.) they were low on ammunition at this point, they might have heard SWAT approaching from their gunfire shooting out locked doors and searching them.

For the two of them, being taken alive was not an option. With them probably feeling depressed from their main plan failing, only small numbers of kids left to shoot, hundreds of police outside, low ammunition, adrenaline drop and the prospect of being captured alive, they probably felt that the alone time they had in the library was the best time to off themselves.
Back to top Go down
Moseley




Posts : 107
Contribution Points : 96457
Forum Reputation : 0
Join date : 2013-10-30

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeTue Nov 12, 2013 1:04 pm

Thankfully they probably didn't look around the library much when they returned because then they might have been aware that Ireland & Kreutz were both still live although possibly in an unconscious state. I've heard Nielson retracted what she was supposed to have said in initial reports, that is H/K both said "1!2!3!" before simultaneously shooting themselves. I've always believed also that Klebold killed himself after Harris because of their positionings, possibly by a millisecond because maybe in the back of Klebold's mind, he wanted to be 100% Eric wouldn't have second thoughts.
Back to top Go down
lasttrain




Posts : 624
Contribution Points : 102738
Forum Reputation : 74
Join date : 2013-04-04

Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeSat Nov 16, 2013 1:27 pm

mattmatthew1337 wrote:
I think it is likely that lack of ammunition contributed to them offing themselves when they did . . .
All of this is a great post. It brings to light an entire aspect of that day that we have never fully discussed. Witnesses report that Eric and Dylan constantly referred to ammo. It was a major concern, both because it was finite and because they had become aware that their weapons were prone to malfunction. They ended things right after exchanging fire with outside law enforcement because they concluded that they did not have the firepower to engage with SWAT (who they believed would enter at any moment).

Eric always had a fantasy of dying by police bullet. I believe the brief exchange of fire through the window was his way of staging this fantasy and making it seem like he had somehow gone down fighting.
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest




Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitimeSat Nov 23, 2013 9:48 pm

mattmatthew1337 wrote:
I think it is likely that lack of ammunition contributed to them offing themselves when they did.
Great post and analysis. Thanks.
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content





Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Empty
PostSubject: Re: Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?   Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition? Icon_minitime

Back to top Go down
 
Did the shooting stop because Eric ran out of ammunition?
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Sightings of Eric just before the shooting
» Eric and Dylan's shooting accuracy.
» Could Eric and Dylan Stop NBK After Bombs Failed?
» Excerpt from Eric's journal where he wouldn't stop cursing?
» Zachary Cruz says failure to stop Parkland shooting 'haunts me'

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Columbine High School Massacre Discussion Forum :: Columbine High School Massacre Discussion Forum :: Thoughts on the Shooting-
Jump to: