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 Monday April 19th 1999

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PostSubject: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeFri Nov 29, 2013 7:08 pm

One aspect of Columbine I am interested in is the timeline of events leading up to 4/20. I'm actually surprised sometimes there wasn't more of an investigation into what Eric and Dylan were doing in the weeks and months leading up to the massacre. I still wonder sometimes if the plan to attack the school was completely set in stone particularly at the last minute, I feel like it probably was but i still ponder this thought at times.  
In this thread [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] we discussed what Eric and Dylan were supposedly doing the morning of 4/20 and some of those details are pretty hazy at best. I am equally as interested to know what they were said to be doing the day before the massacre on 4/19 and how this effected them on the surface, if at all.

Note: Dylan's class timetable pg(10452) Eric's class timetable pg(26319) Apologies that this isn't completely in chronological order as some sightings did not mention time.

On Monday April 19th Chris Morris followed Harris to bowling class and was there with Harris, Klebold and Dykeman. After class they all went to a nearby King Soopers for doughnuts. Morris then went back to school but does not recall if Harris and Klebold returned to school. pg(10836 - 7)

Dustin Gorton saw Eric on Monday morning in their bowling class pg(10743) According to Gorton, Harris was seen shooting a c02 powered pellet gun at the outside wall of the bowling alley. pg(10747) He said the class meets from 6.15 to 7.20 on Monday. There are a couple of witnesses who saw either Eric or Dylan or both in bowling class on Monday 4/19: Dylan was in bowling class, as usual dressed in black and wearing dark glasses pg(6186)

Eric Harris scanned and uploaded materials onto the school server. The times on the bottom of the pages range from 8.09 - 8.45 pg(26797 - 26815)

Nicholas Romanyshyn told IO he saw Eric Harris was on 4/19 in their 2nd hour video class. He remembered seeing Eric in the hallway outside the Tech Lab while he (Romanyshm) was filming with other kids. (Mike Vendegnia and Ryan Selchert)
He said Eric came along and sat down on the floor as he was in the same class. Eric asked Romanyshyn if he was in the way, Romanyshyn told him he was not. Romanshyn said Eric had some white papers that he was writing on. He believes Selchert asked Eric what he was working on, Eric replied "plans for tomorrow." pg(10931) Ryan Selchert confirms the "I'm planning for tomorrow" comment. pg(2173 - 4)
Eric Veik was told by Nick Romanyshyn that he saw Harris on 4/19 with a notebook. Harris apparently made a comment that he was "finalizing plans for tomorrow." pg(10930) Another report says Romanshyn saw Harris in the hall outside the Tech Lab sitting against the lockers. Harris said "If i'm in your way i'll move." Harris apparently had a notebook in his hand and told Romanyshyn "I'm just working on finalizing my plans for tomorrow." pg(10917)

Dylan makes a journal entry: "About 26.5 hours from now the judgement will begin" and "In 26.4 hours, I’ll be dead, & in happiness." pg(26486) If according to their original notes they planned for the massacre to start at 11:16 / 17 pg(26490 - 26313) This entry could have been written while Dylan was in school, although i am confused as to why he would take his journal into class, unless it was normal for him to carry it around with him.

Robyn Anderson said she saw Dylan was on 4/19 after their calculus class which begins at approximately 8.25. She says Dylan and another friend of hers named Joe were walking down the hallway after class. The last time she saw Dylan was when he was walking towards his video production class. Robyn replied "not really" when asked if Dylan seemed different on 4/19, just saying that he was kind of quiet. pg(10628)

Zach Heckler said he saw Dylan in the hallway on 4/19 sometime after his second period hour between 9.20 and 9.25. He was with Robyn Anderson when Heckler saw him. pg(10758)

Dustin Gorton states that himself, Harris and Klebold made a video tape at Eric Jacksons residence on 4/19. pg(10736)
Gordon says he made a video tape of Harris and Klebold on 4/19 as a "looking video." He said he and his friend Eric Jackson filmed them for their "looking video assignment." pg(10745)

(Breakfast Run Video)- Eric Jackson saw Klebold on Monday at Jacksons home, they filmed a "breakfast" video for Dylan's school project called "American Dream." Jackson said Dylan was concerned about his grades. pg(10770) The driver in the video Dustin Gorton confirms he saw Klebold on 4/19 where himself and Klebold were filmed by Eric Jackson. pg(10734) 'Adv Video' class was 3rd period for Dylan. As we can see from the video footage, Dylan went to burger King then drove back to the school.
It sounds like there were two videos made the morning of 4/19, The Breakfast video (with Klebold, Jackson and Gordon) then a separate video filmed by Jackson and Gordon featuring Eric and Dylan.

Teacher Eric Kritzer said Eric was in Philosophy class on Monday. pg(3485) This was third period for Eric.

Susan Dewitt saw Eric while walking to her car from school on 4/19 at around 10:15. She saw him and another boy who she didn't know and they waved. Eric walked over to her while the other boy waited a short distance away. She asked him what he was doing and he said he was ditching class (Creative writing/ 4th period?). They talked for around five minutes and he seemed like something was bothering him. She said he seemed like he was not concentrating on things and was anxious and irritated as though something was disturbing him. Susan described the other boy as tall with ear length curly brown hair and a trench coat, she said he might be called "Nate." pg(6198) and (6200)

Michael Bierman said Eric and Dylan were in attendance in English class (4th Period) on 4/19. pg(6134)

Spencer Grange thinks both Harris and Klebold were in creative writing class on Monday. pg(1905)

Louis Scileppi said that on 4/19 he went to his residence with a friend about 10:30 - 10:45. He went out to get the mail at which time he saw two males on the walkway adjacent to his driveway. They were walking toward the street from the greenbelt area which runs behind the houses in the block. He recognized one of the males as Eric Harris and believes the other male was Dylan Klebold. In reference to a game called "Annihilation" seniors played, Scileppi asked Harris "What are you doing back there? Killing someone?" Harris replied "Yeah, so don't go back there for a couple of days." pg(4356)
Note: This is the same area the Diversionary bomb was found.

On 4/19 Brian Sergent observed Dykeman, Harris and Klebold leave the commons area of CHS at around 11:10. pg(10886)

Dustin Gorton saw Eric Harris on 4/19 when they passed each other in the school hallway. pg(10743)

Veronica Griffith possibly saw Eric in the hallways on Monday. pg(3205)

Rachel Baker observed the two suspects on Monday 4/19 in fifth period psychology class. She said they sat at the back of the class and kept to themselves as usual but their demeanor was the same. pg(6082)

Anthony Hassman remembered seeing Dylan at the end of school on the prior Monday (19th?), Friday or Thursday to the shooting running out of the west door of the school by the library. pg(3247)

Nicole Markham said the only thing that was suspicious about Harris and Klebold was on Monday 4/19, both were in the CHS student parking lot after school about 2.30 - 2.40. She thought this was strange as she says neither ever stayed after school for anything. pg(10774)

Ashley Steele said she heard a custodian had seen Eric Harris in the school on Monday night. She doesn't remember who told her and indicated this was a rumor. pg(2202)

Alexandra Goldberg was told by another student Katie Ergen (Littleton HS) that on 4/19 a janitor had admitted two students to the school after hours. pg(3148)

Andrew Beard said on 4/19 he telephoned Klebold, attempting to arrange a trade of players in their fantasy baseball league. Beard said Klebold responded with "I don't know. I'll think about it and let you know tomorrow." Beard said the conversation was normal and didn't sense anything was troubling Klebold. pg(685)

The Klebold's said that Dylan told them on the Monday night 4/19 that he Eric and some friends went to dinner at the Outback restaurant. Dylan had said this was Eric's favorite restaurant and that he had coupons. The Klebold's said Dylan left between 6.00 and 7.00 that evening then returned sometime later, he indicated he had eaten steak for dinner. pg(10514 - 5)

Eric called Mark Manes to buy him two boxes of 9mm ammunition on Thursday 4/15, he'd forgotten and received a call from Eric on 4/19. Manes said Eric asked him again to purchase the 9mm ammunition, he said he would and would call Eric back when he had done that.
Manes said he forgot again and Eric called him again at approximately 8.00 p.m. Eric again asked for two boxes of 9mm ammunition. Manes said he would go to K-Mart to make the purchase. After making the purchase Manes says he called Eric and told him to meet him at his (Manes) house to pick the ammunition up. Manes waited in his driveway and Eric showed up a short time later, giving Manes $25 for the two boxes of ammunition. Manes said Harris said something about going to the Marines in a few weeks and Manes told Eric he would not recommend going into the Marines. Eric stated "It's the last option I have."
Interesting to note that Harris had not returned the call of the Marine Corps Staff Sgt on 4/16 or 4/17, and also had not been informed about the issue with his medication and joining the Marines.
Manes said he asked Eric if he was going shooting that evening to which he replied "Maybe tomorrow." pg(15047)

Jerry Sundgard said that on 4/19 his wife saw two males she believes to be Harris and Klebold carving words into a picnic table in a park between Pierce and Wadsworth and Davis Dr and Elmhurst. His wife Roma later checked the table and saw the following carved into (the table) 420, Wrath, Revenge, a Nazi symbol. pg(22760 - 10k)
300 yards North of REDACTED Dr, words scratched into a picnic table: Doom, Revenge, Terrorism, Wrath (with what looks like a "v" underneath and 4-19-99. There was also a pentagram on the table and other markings. pg(11764)

In the phone call between Chris Morris and Phillip Duran:
Duran: "Dylan worked Monday night."
Morris: "Yeah I heard that he was supposed to be workin' that night or whatever and..."
Duran: "Or he came in or something Ann said he came in or he was workin' Monday night she, she couldn't remember."
pg(10827)
Note: Christopher Lau the owner of Blackjack Pizza said that the last night Eric and Dylan worked was Friday April 16th. I just assumed the "Monday" referred to in the phone conversation could mean Monday 4/19.

Ed Reffitt who was working on the home next door to the Harris home on 4/19 and 4/20 says he saw both Harris and Klebold on both days. He heard them banging on wood and breaking glass. He saw Harris with a crowbar. I mentioned this before on here but strangely the times they were reported to be working between have been redacted. I'd be interested to know why others think these times have been redacted? It's also not clear if this banging on wood / breaking glass was on one specific day or on both days.

Zach Heckler said he telephoned Dylan Klebold at approximately 22:30 on 4/19. Dylan told him that he really wasn't in the mood to talk and just wanted to go to bed. Zach noted this as odd as he said Dylan doesn't usually get off the phone until 0030 - 0100 most nights. pg(10764)
Jocelyn Heckler (Zach's sister) said Dylan did not call their residence so Zach called Dylan at approximately 23:00. She said Zach asked Dylan if he wanted to play on the Internet, Dylan said he was tired and that he did not feel like talking, and just wanted to go to bed. She noted this was very unusual. pg(1451)

The micro cassette tape or "Nixon Tape" is recorded by Eric Harris. He states the reasons why these things are happening and says it will happen in "less than nine hours now." So presumably this tape would have been recorded around or just after 2.00 a.m. pg(10409)

I've heard of other accounts of what Eric and/or Dylan were reportedly doing on 4/19 but i did not include these, as without a source they may have just been rumors. But please feel free to add to this list. There were also a number of reports of seeing Eric and/or Dylan in and around the school on the Monday.
What do you guys make of these accounts? Are there any that stand out to you in particular? For me many of these accounts seem more reliable compared to those from the morning of 4/20. I still can't make my mind up why Eric would upload these pages of his writings onto the school server on 4/19. I also feel like the accounts of the Klebold's and Zach Heckler are extremely accurate, so that would mean Dylan was in his home on the evening of 4/19, i assume alone. We probably can't answer this question but I wonder if he spoke with Eric that night later or if it was all part of the plan to have an early night.

This could all be completely unrelated but there has been discussion in the past over rumored bomb threats just prior to 4/20 so i thought i would include this information here. As always these could just be rumors, or something more. I highly doubt the school or LE would admit to anything of this nature occurring so close to the actual attack:
Nathan Lopatin had heard from a friend Zachary Ingels that a student named Nathan had seen bombs in the trash cans on Monday 19th of April. He believes this is true as Zach Ingels is his best friend and would not lie to him. pg(2016)
Jamie Munkeby overheard that there was a bomb threat made at the school on 4/19. pg(3820)

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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSat Nov 30, 2013 5:35 am

First off, fantastic work of putting this together. That must've taken ages. Smile

I think many of these seem more reliable because they didn't happen on a day where everything was chaotic and uncertain. Smile These are mostly witness statements from people who really knew the boys well enough to be able to tell a change in mood/demeanour or witness statements from people whose statements can all be confirmed by other witnesses.

Statements that really stand out for me:

- Eric's scanning and uploading of materials to the school computer. (Why do that so early when there's a chance they might be found before the next day?)
- Susan's statement of seeing Eric in an anxious/irritated state. She knew him well enough to be able to tell if something was bothering him. Her description of 'the other boy' sounds like Dyl, doesn't it?
- Nicole Markham's statement of seeing both of them in the parking lot after school while she knew they never stayed after. I think the most logical answer to 'what were they doing?' is that they were checking the position of their cars one last time?
- The two statements about them being allowed in school after hours/at night. Was this ever followed up on? What would they have done inside the school then? We know they didn't get a hold of the propane until the next day, so it can't have been the bombs.. Was this another sensationalised rumour, or something else?
- The redacted times of them working in/near Eric's house are quite strange. I think there are only a handful of redacted times in the entire mountain of evidence, aren't there? Would those redacted times interfere with other credible witness statements or something? It seems really 'off' to me.
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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSat Nov 30, 2013 9:53 am

thedragonrampant wrote:
First off, fantastic work of putting this together. That must've taken ages. Smile

I think many of these seem more reliable because they didn't happen on a day where everything was chaotic and uncertain. :)These are mostly witness statements from people who really knew the boys well enough to be able to tell a change in mood/demeanour or witness statements from people whose statements can all be confirmed by other witnesses.
I agree that many of these statements seem to come from more reliable witnesses, as in people who knew Eric and Dylan fairly well and also occurred on a regular school day.

In response to your points:
Quote :
- Eric's scanning and uploading of materials to the school computer. (Why do that so early when there's a chance they might be found before the next day?)
I know some have people suggested before that Eric may have uploaded his files because he wanted to get caught last minute. I guess this is possible, I wonder how often the student files were scanned for inappropriate materials or at least for materials unrelated to school work? Also was Eric aware of this?
I've always been more drawn to the idea that he possibly just wanted to make the school look stupid, like some kind of final dig. Surely he would have know his school files would have been looked at after the massacre. But it's still confusing to me as to why he made the effort to scan and upload these materials the morning before 4/20.


Quote :
- Susan's statement of seeing Eric in an anxious/irritated state. She knew him well enough to be able to tell if something was bothering him. Her description of 'the other boy' sounds like Dyl, doesn't it?
I agree that the other boy described in Susan's statement does sound like Dylan, that was my first thought. Eric and Dylan were seen together shortly after by Louis Scileppi so i think it's very likely it was Dylan. However both Susan and Louis don't 100% identify the other person as Dylan but they both spoke to Eric and knew him.

Quote :
- Nicole Markham's statement of seeing both of them in the parking lot after school while she knew they never stayed after. I think the most logical answer to 'what were they doing?' is that they were checking the position of their cars one last time?
That's a great suggestion that they could have possibly been checking the position of their cars. As awful as it sounds they could have been trying to figure out where to park the following day that would give them the best aim for fleeing students.

Quote :
- The two statements about them being allowed in school after hours/at night. Was this ever followed up on? What would they have done inside the school then? We know they didn't get a hold of the propane until the next day, so it can't have been the bombs.. Was this another sensationalised rumour, or something else?
It seems like this was perhaps just a rumor. I have heard similar stories of Eric / Dylan having access to the school the night before. I guess if a janitor had allowed them or anyone access to the school on 4/19 he probably wouldn't want to admit it. I'll have to dig a little deeper into this rumor as i'm not sure if there was any kind of credible source that can support the claim.  

Quote :
- The redacted times of them working in/near Eric's house are quite strange. I think there are only a handful of redacted times in the entire mountain of evidence, aren't there? Would those redacted times interfere with other credible witness statements or something? It seems really 'off' to me.
It certainly is strange that the times are redacted.  One possibility I've always considered would be that the times contradict the official version of events. For example they could have been working much later on 4/20 so they arrived at the school later than we thought. I've always questioned the timeline of events at the beginning of the massacre. Maybe they were doing the "wood banging / glass breaking" when the Harris family were home and it's just not been mentioned. Could they have been working extremely late at night perhaps? It does seem very odd to redact these times.
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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSat Nov 30, 2013 2:23 pm

queenfarooq wrote:
I know some have people suggested before that Eric may have uploaded his files because he wanted to get caught last minute. I guess this is possible, I wonder how often the student files were scanned for inappropriate materials or at least for materials unrelated to school work? Also was Eric aware of this?
Eric must've been aware of some of the work they did on the computers, especially because he and some of their friends worked on stuff like the school's website before. I think they were drawn to the whole IT-thing in earlier schoolyears, so I think they had a pretty solid handle on how the staff worked with the computers and such. I don't think they'd check them every day for wrong materials. Seems like too much work.

Quote :
I've always been more drawn to the idea that he possibly just wanted to make the school look stupid, like some kind of final dig. Surely he would have know his school files would have been looked at after the massacre. But it's still confusing to me as to why he made the effort to scan and upload these materials the morning before 4/20.
It's the more likely scenario for sure. Like, "hahaha here have another warning sign you missed". It seems like something he'd do. Rolling Eyes Maybe he wanted the materials to be found outside of his house, though? Perhaps he was worried that the cops would take it all in and never release any of it to the public, so he was counting on someone to see them and spread the word through the school's computer instead? (I'm really just gambling here, haha.)

Quote :
I agree that the other boy described in Susan's statement does sound like Dylan, that was my first thought. Eric and Dylan were seen together shortly after by Louis Scileppi so i think it's very likely it was Dylan. However both Susan and Louis don't 100% identify the other person as Dylan but they both spoke to Eric and knew him.
Mm, I think it's most likely to be Dylan. Susan may not have known Dylan well enough to be sure that it was him. The fact that she said "he may have been called Nate" really says to me that she vaguely knew the names of some of Eric's friends but couldn't put faces to them.

Quote :
That's a great suggestion that they could have possibly been checking the position of their cars. As awful as it sounds they could have been trying to figure out where to park the following day that would give them the best aim for fleeing students.
Precisely. It seems like something they would've gone over multiple times. Perhaps this was the final check before the big show. Making sure they'd 'calculated' the whole thing correctly. I don't think it's a far stretch to assume that at least one of them (Eric Laughing ) was being a big control freak over getting every itty bitty thing right. Rechecking everything one final time is certainly what I'd do in this case, too.

Quote :
It seems like this was perhaps just a rumor. I have heard similar stories of Eric / Dylan having access to the school the night before. I guess if a janitor had allowed them or anyone access to the school on 4/19 he probably wouldn't want to admit it. I'll have to dig a little deeper into this rumor as i'm not sure if there was any kind of credible source that can support the claim.  
I've seen quite a few of those stories flying around. The real interesting question is if these rumours were coined before or after public knowledge of the bombs. If it was before, then what did people think the boys were doing inside the school? What on earth would fuel that rumour as something that made sense? If it was after, then I think the rumours may have started because nobody knew how they got the bombs into the school without anyone noticing. It's inconceivable to some people that bags with bombs in them don't stand out in a full cafeteria, apparently?

Quote :
It certainly is strange that the times are redacted.  One possibility I've always considered would be that the times contradict the official version of events. For example they could have been working much later on 4/20 so they arrived at the school later than we thought. I've always questioned the timeline of events at the beginning of the massacre. Maybe they were doing the "wood banging / glass breaking" when the Harris family were home and it's just not been mentioned. Could they have been working extremely late at night perhaps? It does seem very odd to redact these times.
Yeah, well, it doesn't take a lot to contradict the official version of events. I'm working on a translation of Krabbé's narrative timeline right now and he, too, deviates from the official in some instances because the official version does not always correspond with witness statements or other information given. I think they were certainly running late for almost everything that morning and perhaps one of their reasons for being late is that the work they did at Eric's home took longer than expected? Them working extremely late at night might contradict Zach's statement of speaking with Dylan on the phone, right? (I'm going to add this to my endlessly growing list of 'things I need to very nicely ask JeffCo about'. Laughing )
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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSun Dec 01, 2013 10:37 am

Its quite strange of Dylan to be concerned about his grades ,considering he will be dead inside of 24 hours!
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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSun Dec 01, 2013 3:57 pm

queenfarooq wrote:
Jerry Sundgard said that on 4/19 his wife saw two males she believes to be Harris and Klebold carving words into a picnic table in a park between Pierce and Wadsworth and Davis Dr and Elmhurst. His wife Roma later checked the table and saw the following carved into (the table) 420, Wrath, Revenge, a Nazi symbol. pg(22760 - 10k)
300 yards North of REDACTED Dr, words scratched into a picnic table: Doom, Revenge, Terrorism, Wrath (with what looks like a "v" underneath and 4-19-99. There was also a pentagram on the table and other markings. pg(11764)
I've never seen this before. If it was true, it's quite disturbing...

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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSun Dec 01, 2013 7:16 pm

thedragonrampant wrote:
I've seen quite a few of those stories flying around. The real interesting question is if these rumours were coined before or after public knowledge of the bombs. If it was before, then what did people think the boys were doing inside the school? What on earth would fuel that rumour as something that made sense? If it was after, then I think the rumours may have started because nobody knew how they got the bombs into the school without anyone noticing. It's inconceivable to some people that bags with bombs in them don't stand out in a full cafeteria, apparently?
As i mentioned i have also heard various rumors that the boys were inside the school possibly leaving the propane tanks somewhere before 4/20. There were early news stories and claims that they had keys to the school, some people say they did, some say they didn't. I think the idea the propane tanks could have been left inside the school prior to 4/20 was certainly a concern for LE early on. They certainly seemed to spend a great deal of time trying to figure out where the propane tank that was seen in the kitchen at after prom came from.

thedragonrampant wrote:
Yeah, well, it doesn't take a lot to contradict the official version of events. I'm working on a translation of Krabbé's narrative timeline right now and he, too, deviates from the official in some instances because the official version does not always correspond with witness statements or other information given. I think they were certainly running late for almost everything that morning and perhaps one of their reasons for being late is that the work they did at Eric's home took longer than expected? Them working extremely late at night might contradict Zach's statement of speaking with Dylan on the phone, right? (I'm going to add this to my endlessly growing list of 'things I need to very nicely ask JeffCo about'. Laughing )
Depending on what the workman was doing I would guess he would likely be working during day light hours, although i could be wrong. Maybe the banging occurred when Eric and Dylan were seen in school, or as you mentioned maybe the times they were working do not correspond with other information given. If so this causes all kinds of problems.
The translation of Tim Krabbe's timeline would be great. For me there are so many time discrepancies: Rachel Scott's lunch receipt paired with confusing first responder times and the fact students who were in different areas reported hearing gunshots inside the school at times where Eric and Dylan were elsewhere, and also while they were still alive.  I would go off topic if i continued to talk about that anymore so i'll shuttup Smile

I didn't mean to seem like i was ignoring your other points thedragonrampart, it was just that i agreed with what you'd said.

rik75 wrote:
Its quite strange of Dylan to be concerned about his grades ,considering he will be dead inside of 24 hours!
For me i assume Dylan was just making conversation here. I don't think that we can assume just because he expressed concerns over his grades that he must have really been worried about them. He could have been just attempting to act normally in order to divert any unwanted attention. Likewise the group he was in could have been discussing their grades and Dylan was asked about his or just simply joined in.
On the other hand others may suggest, maybe he was genuinely concerned about his grades as he didn't think the massacre was actually going to happen or reality hadn't sunk in yet.

TheFragile wrote:
queenfarooq wrote:
Jerry Sundgard said that on 4/19 his wife saw two males she believes to be Harris and Klebold carving words into a picnic table in a park between Pierce and Wadsworth and Davis Dr and Elmhurst. His wife Roma later checked the table and saw the following carved into (the table) 420, Wrath, Revenge, a Nazi symbol. pg(22760 - 10k)
300 yards North of REDACTED Dr, words scratched into a picnic table: Doom, Revenge, Terrorism, Wrath (with what looks like a "v" underneath and 4-19-99. There was also a pentagram on the table and other markings. pg(11764)
I've never seen this before. If it was true, it's quite disturbing...
It is an interesting connection if Roma Sundgard found those words carved / scratched into the table. They are pretty specific markings. Although the words in the actual police report do differ from the ones initially reported, but this could be just down to what Mrs Sundgard remembered reading etc. I also found this point interesting as it places Eric and Dylan at another location the evening prior to the shooting.
The only thing that makes me question the accuracy of this event is the fact it wasn't reported or investigated until a couple of weeks after the shooting. The 'Information Received' date on the Sundgards report is 05/17/99. So it could be possible someone else made these markings after the attack, unless Mrs Sundgard saw checked the table the evening of 4/19 or early 4/20 as it is not made clear in the report when she actually saw the markings unless i'm missing something.

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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 19, 2014 8:13 pm

I don't know if I believe that Dylan and Eric were really sitting around carving on tables the day before the massacre. Didn't they have more important stuff to do? It just sounds like another story. I could be wrong though; that is just my opinion on that.


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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 19, 2014 10:51 pm

Thanks for this queenfarooq. Is always very interesting to see what the boys did the day before 04/20. The fact about Eric with the notebook and his words "I'm just working on finalizing my plans for tomorrow", is creepy and I wonder if Nicholas Romanyshyn and Ryan Selchert found strange what he said and wonder what Eric meant with that and what he was planning. The video with Dustin Gorton is something that make me wonder several things too. I find weird how that video is not with the rest of home videos that the police released, but I dont know if the video didnt work in the end or the police didnt find it, something that I doubt. This could be another proof that they are keeping a lot of more evidence but I can be wrong of course.

The story about them craving on tables, I find it hard to believe too but it could be a lot of coincidence that in the table were written a lot of things that are related to Eric and Dylan so it doesnt seem to me like another story and is possible that they took a moment to go a do it. And I think is strange too how Dylan was concerned about his grades and commented it. It shows how they really were living like another life with their friends and family and how they could act normal around them.

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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 19, 2014 11:00 pm

003119 & 008924: At 2045 hours on April 20,1999, Barrie GOETZ of the Colorado Bureau of Investigation Pueblo office related to me that he had noticed a carving in a picnic table in the park to the north of the High School. A canopy covers a picnic area were laboratory personnel were gathered and being briefed on the scene. The carvings were the numbers "4:20" and on the opposite side of the same wooden table were the numbers "187" Both carvings appeared that they had been freshly cut through the painted surface of tbe tables.

011774 & 011776 has more information related to this

018651 contains another reference

022759 more information related to the picnic table


Last edited by sororityalpha on Sun Apr 19, 2015 1:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSun Apr 19, 2015 8:37 am

Bump
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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeMon Apr 20, 2015 8:13 am

Well, several things that seem to be relevant:

1) Seems they had an entirely normal, mundane day at school and probably tried not to stand out in any way.

2) They seem to have had everything ready for the massacre. No frantic last-ditch bomb making or anything, especially on Dylan's part. They took time to sit at a picnic table, which suggest they themselves had everything ready.

3) In contrast to point 2 above, there was Mark Manes late with ammo. Now that I think about it, this may be the reason why they made the massacre on the 20th and not a few days before as some evidence may point to being an original plan. Perhaps it was relaly just Eric waiting for Manes to deliver the rest of the ammo. This might explain why Eric was observed to be angry or anxious - he was afraid Manes will cause another day of delay.

4) Probably both decided to go to bed early once Manes delivered and they agreed that 20th will be the day.

5) I think Dylan being "concerned" about his grades, or Eric being "concerned" about having no option other than Marines were just ploys really.They were making people around them feel like they are regular teenagers. Remember, both pretended to take decisions that their families would approve of (Eric's dad was military remember?). They were not the leats bit concerned, Eric not bothering to check up on theMarines enlistment being the best evidence.

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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSat Dec 26, 2015 8:17 pm

Good informative post about April 19 1999
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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeWed Aug 30, 2017 4:56 pm

I love it queenfarook! When I try to copy and paste this it comes up with black text....can I have an emailed copy of this?
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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeFri Sep 01, 2017 3:00 am

Great post [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] almost 4 years ago - amazing how time flies!
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PostSubject: Re: Monday April 19th 1999   Monday April 19th 1999 Icon_minitimeSat Apr 20, 2019 8:54 am

I should have bumped this yesterday, but better late than never.

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» Was Chris Morris and Cory Friezen at School on 20 April 1999?

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