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 I hate to admit it, but...

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PostSubject: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeTue Jan 28, 2014 2:01 pm

Just a fun thread here to see what everyone thinks. I regards to Columbine, E/D, etc., state something that you hate to admit about your interest in the shooting, etc.

To start off....

I hate to admit it, but Dylan had some pretty interesting existential thoughts for a 16/17 year old kid. They resonate with me now as I think about some of the journal entries, even as a 35 y.o., in both my life and my profession.

I hate to admit it, but Eric was a lot more well-read than I was at his age, and I read A LOT! I was amazed at some of the books and novels he was reading, especially the philosophical stuff.

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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeTue Jan 28, 2014 3:22 pm

Yes I have to admit the same, Dylan's thoughts were not things that many people of his age think, the same with Eric. Their ideologies were pretty interesting, I can even relate to some of them. They thought about society and about life like many teenagers don't do it, I have to admit too that they were very smart for think at that way and see stuff of the world like even adults don't see and they knew it, they knew it and that's why they said that were superior. Maybe Eric wasn't very brilliant with some things but in the end I have to admit that both were very smart and is a shame how their lives ended because they would do a lot of great things

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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeTue Jan 28, 2014 5:07 pm

I hate to admit that, as of now, I've taken way more interest in Eric and Dylan than in their victims. That may be changing. I'd like to think I had as much compassion for the innocent kids that Eric and Dylan killed as I do for the two boys, but much of the time I catch myself focusing on Eric and Dylan while overlooking the people who were killed -- and even more commonly -- all but ignoring those who were "merely" wounded and traumatized.


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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeTue Jan 28, 2014 5:29 pm

ThoughtBox wrote:


I hate to admit it, but Eric was a lot more well-read than I was at his age, and I read A LOT!  I was amazed at some of the books and novels he was reading, especially the philosophical stuff.


I remember reading about some of the books he had to read for class. Do you know of any other books he may have read?

And I hate to admit it but, both of them seemed like they had a much more successful future ahead of them than I did. I dropped out of high school, they didn't.

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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 1:57 am

gustopoet wrote:
I hate to admit that, as of now, I've taken way more interest in Eric and Dylan than in their victims.

I hate to admit the same thing. All the information relating to the boys is firmly stuck in my brain, but I really have to dig to drag up the same random facts about the people most affected by their actions. I've spent so much time 'getting to know' the psyches of the boys and it is a little painful to realise that I have not spent the same learning things about those people whose lives were cut short so abruptly because Eric and Dylan went off the deep end. One of the reasons why I'd love to see 13 Families is to step away from all roads leading to the boys for a minute and really refocus on the families left forever changed by their actions.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 6:31 am

In regards to how well read Eric was - I was reading through one of his essays and it mentioned prisoners were released early from their sentence in WWII and instructed to go and kill Jews. I think it was in Riga or somewhere like that. I'd never heard of this before (I'm no history buff) but neither had the history teacher marking his paper.

There are a couple of other instances like this. Now perhaps they are or aren't true - I never bothered to look them up.

Interestingly though - I suppose this proves he is either well read - or made up imaginative violent fantasies and passed them off as fact (a bit like Dylan but who wrote his violent story in some sort of creative writing session).
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 8:57 am

thedragonrampant wrote:
gustopoet wrote:
I hate to admit that, as of now, I've taken way more interest in Eric and Dylan than in their victims.

I hate to admit the same thing. All the information relating to the boys is firmly stuck in my brain, but I really have to dig to drag up the same random facts about the people most affected by their actions. I've spent so much time 'getting to know' the psyches of the boys and it is a little painful to realise that I have not spent the same learning things about those people whose lives were cut short so abruptly because Eric and Dylan went off the deep end. One of the reasons why I'd love to see 13 Families is to step away from all roads leading to the boys for a minute and really refocus on the families left forever changed by their actions.
I'm the same, but I think it's natural, really. Poor victims were a random group of kids, who were unfortunate enough to be at that time and place. But basically up until the shooting they were pretty much normal students. Eric and Dylan, on the other hand, became 'abnormal' long before the massacre.

Personally, I hate to admit my interest in the shooting, period. I'm interested in crime in general (love documentaries about serial murderers etc). Not the gory details, but the psychology of criminals. If any of my friends or family found out how much time I've wasted (yes, wasted) on reading about CHS, they'd be surprised.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 9:48 am

I hate to admit that I like what Dylan wrote about love.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 10:05 am

I hate to admit that in them I see parts of myself that I like to pretend don't exist.

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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 10:18 am

areyoulistening wrote:
I hate to admit that in them I see parts of myself that I like to pretend don't exist.

I'll second that emotion.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 10:29 am

thedragonrampant wrote:
One of the reasons why I'd love to see 13 Families is to step away from all roads leading to the boys for a minute and really refocus on the families left forever changed by their actions.

I need to watch this but I'm leery of the emotional impact. The segments with victims' families in Game Over in Littleton were powerful, if not outright haunting. That said, the aftermath and all the so-called collateral damage are important elements of Columbine. Painful and overwhelming, but examining the fallout from NBK is perhaps the surest way to gain insight into the meaning of the attack.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 11:12 am

Thirding the "seeing parts of yourself in them that you like to pretend don't exist", although I have that far far more with Eric than I do Dylan. I've always been pretty accepting of the fact that my teenage self was very much like Dylan, but there's been a bit of a struggle upon finding the common ground with Eric. If anything, the boy 'helped' me deal with a part of myself that usually gets squashed down a lot -- although I like to think my coping methods are a lot better than his ever were.  Laughing It's not something I absolute hate to admit, though, because it explains a little bit about my own feelings related to the case that I find important to acknowledge and work with.

I do think that the emotional impact of the thing is something I'm partially avoidant of. I can go through heaps of evidence without blinking, but the 911-call still messes me up and seeing the families of the victims and hearing them speak of their loved ones is quite a confrontational thing as well. I think the aftermath matters so much because you see how the community works and how some of the things you see would extend to pre-massacre and help explain the circumstances that brought Columbine to become such a household name.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 11:25 am

thedragonrampant wrote:
I think the aftermath matters so much because you see how the community works and how some of the things you see would extend to pre-massacre and help explain the circumstances that brought Columbine to become such a household name.

Agree with this totally.

I also think in studying the aftermath and pain of it you begin to see what the boys really wanted to inflict on us. They were smart enough to know their attack would do most of its damage against those who went on living and they were absolutely right. Whether or not the pain of the aftermath is a mirror of the lifelong pain they endured as social outcasts, or whether they simply imagined it this way, the fact is the aftermath of pain and suffering is the statement they wanted to make.

It's like a quote from Sue Klebold I recently read where she realized that her status as an outcast after NBK was something Dylan had planned and wanted her to experience so she could feel what it was like for him to be hated and cast-out and powerless to do anything to change it.

Beyond the murdered and wounded are those who were traumatized. PTSD is a serious thing, no less painful and life-altering than a physical wound. The boys' truly did create something so horrific that coming to full grips with it is almost impossible. But exploring the tragedy I think and hope feeds empathy.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 4:27 pm

gustopoet wrote:
areyoulistening wrote:
I hate to admit that in them I see parts of myself that I like to pretend don't exist.

I'll second that emotion.
I'll...third that emotion?
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 4:56 pm

The people that understand Eric's and Dylan's feelings, that feel relate to one of them and their thoughts or feelings and that are really interested.not only on NBK but in them too, is because in some way this people (us) feel like them many times, because have the same thoughts or personality and this is an important thing to admit. Everyone here is like Eric and Dylan in some way, maybe some are like them completely and this is something that occur with the fangirls too. This eventually can be the reason of why this forum exist and why so many people is so interested in Eric and Dylan and the massacre, ignoring other times the victims because of the victims we don't know many things and they were different

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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 5:00 pm

Lananas wrote:
gustopoet wrote:
areyoulistening wrote:
I hate to admit that in them I see parts of myself that I like to pretend don't exist.

I'll second that emotion.
I'll...third that emotion?

Motion.

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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 5:27 pm

I was making a pun like in the Motown song.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeWed Jan 29, 2014 6:20 pm

gustopoet wrote:
I was making a pun like in the Motown song.

He's just being a dick. (Thanks for thirding my statement ;))

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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeThu Jan 30, 2014 11:25 am

thedragonrampant wrote:
Thirding the "seeing parts of yourself in them that you like to pretend don't exist", although I have that far far more with Eric than I do Dylan. I've always been pretty accepting of the fact that my teenage self was very much like Dylan, but there's been a bit of a struggle upon finding the common ground with Eric. If anything, the boy 'helped' me deal with a part of myself that usually gets squashed down a lot -- although I like to think my coping methods are a lot better than his ever were.  Laughing It's not something I absolute hate to admit, though, because it explains a little bit about my own feelings related to the case that I find important to acknowledge and work with.

I hate to admit it, but I feel very similar to thedragonrampant in terms of Eric. I had little or no identification with him when I first started looking into Columbine, it was all Dylan, but now I've found quite a lot of "common ground" with Eric. It's just that the Eric side of my personality was more deeply buried, no doubt due to its overtly explosive potential.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeThu Jan 30, 2014 11:26 am

areyoulistening wrote:
gustopoet wrote:
I was making a pun like in the Motown song.

He's just being a dick. (Thanks for thirding my statement ;))

I think it was Jenn and she just didn't notice I was making a (bad) joke in my initial post.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeThu Jan 30, 2014 12:11 pm

gustopoet wrote:
thedragonrampant wrote:
Thirding the "seeing parts of yourself in them that you like to pretend don't exist", although I have that far far more with Eric than I do Dylan. I've always been pretty accepting of the fact that my teenage self was very much like Dylan, but there's been a bit of a struggle upon finding the common ground with Eric. If anything, the boy 'helped' me deal with a part of myself that usually gets squashed down a lot -- although I like to think my coping methods are a lot better than his ever were.  Laughing It's not something I absolute hate to admit, though, because it explains a little bit about my own feelings related to the case that I find important to acknowledge and work with.

I hate to admit it, but I feel very similar to thedragonrampant in terms of Eric. I had little or no identification with him when I first started looking into Columbine, it was all Dylan, but now I've found quite a lot of "common ground" with Eric. It's just that the Eric side of my personality was more deeply buried, no doubt due to its overtly explosive potential.

I'm the opposite, I have always seen the bad parts of myself in Eric. It's not until recently that I've re-identified with the deep self-loathing that Dylan claims in his journals. I've always pushed it away or pretended that it didn't exist but when I read some things that Dylan writes, I feel it all the way down to my toes. I'm still under the impression that Dylan was a lot angrier than is talked about and it's that hidden aggression that I identify with the most at this time in my life. Eric was out front with his, Dylan wasn't. Dylan kept his under wraps for years, and that in my opinion is somewhat more dangerous than just exploding, although both aren't great coping mechanisms obviously.

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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeThu Jan 30, 2014 12:18 pm

areyoulistening wrote:
Dylan kept his under wraps for years, and that in my opinion is somewhat more dangerous than just exploding


It's more dangerous (and seductive to some) because it appears less overtly threatening. The "soft" path to becoming a killer. Add to that Dylan's frequent longings for love and his poetic style and you have a true wolf in sheep's clothing.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeFri Feb 07, 2014 7:17 am

I hate to admit it, but I have this forum in mobile format on my phone and check it for new posts on anything in the "Thoughts" section at least twice daily! There are certain members here that I often watch for posts from because of the tremendous insight and unique writing styles they exhibit.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeSat Sep 13, 2014 10:28 pm

I hate to admit it, but I spend way to much time searching for answerers in tragedies.

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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeFri Sep 19, 2014 3:40 pm

I hate to admit it, but the reason I got into Columbine research was because I find Dylan Klebold extremely physically attractive and wanted to know more about him as a person.
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PostSubject: Re: I hate to admit it, but...   I hate to admit it, but... Icon_minitimeFri Sep 19, 2014 10:55 pm

I hate to admit it, but when my stress gets too much I want to escape into 1999 Columbine world. I have no idea why.
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