Clue

I would like to hear your opinion of the poster on which the words CHS and Clue were written in addition to a lit bomb in Eric's room that appeared on the goodbye portion of the basement tapes.

"The tape ends with a brief glimpse of a sign on the wall of Eric’s bedroom, someone’s arm partially blocking it from sight. It’s the letters CHS along with a drawing of a bomb with a lit fuse and, in bold black letters, the word “clue.” "

Eric was all about foreshadowing. He got a kick out of finding ways to tie things into NBK. I think this was just another way he thought was clever.

I think it was meant for the News Stations. As far as I know they were supposed to send the Basement Tapes to the news before the massacre. Bomb and CHS would be "hey we are blowing up Columbine"

However, for some reason after all that planning the boys did NOT send the tapes... so they're now somewhere and we may not/never see them

Was the Yearbook picture of Eric in the cafeteria "observing" activity in junior or senior yearbook?

If it was in the junior yearbook I bet he LOVED that. I've never gotten a clear idea of how much Eric and Dylan are in the senior yearbook.

Without any more information I think we can only have a wild guess.

Mine was they did it in case their bombs were even more powerful than they expected them to be and it blew them away in the explosion. When the drawing was discovered it'd point to those two doing it. I know they had the tapes and various other things that would lead everyone to knowing it was them - I guess the drawing would have let the person who discovered it know instantly it was them which would then lead on to people watching the tapes etc? If bodies were strewn everywhere from a bombing it might have taken a bit to rule out a Tim McVeigh type character and for them to look at two high school kids being the perpetrators? Ha, I dunno - I don't believe that myself really but it's the best I could come up with a few years ago when I was thinking about it!

Screamingophelia wrote:

Was the Yearbook picture of Eric in the cafeteria "observing" activity in junior or senior yearbook?

If it was in the junior yearbook I bet he LOVED that. I've never gotten a clear idea of how much Eric and Dylan are in the senior yearbook.

I think it was in his junior yearbook.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Was the Yearbook picture of Eric in the cafeteria "observing" activity in junior or senior yearbook?

If it was in the junior yearbook I bet he LOVED that. I've never gotten a clear idea of how much Eric and Dylan are in the senior yearbook.

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Thanks Shadowed and yes, that picture

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] that's a very interesting theory! Thanks for that

Can anyone else make out the writing on his backpack in the picture? One drawing looks like the NIN logo, but I can't tell with the others.

Rumor has it it's "NBK" but it's probably NIN.

He also supposedly made a few of his own shirts. He decorated his backpack with whiteout (I think), etc. Eric was a very crafty fellow.

They really did plan NBK like it was a movie. Right down to what they were wearing. I found it a bit darkly funny that in the Basement tapes and in the planners in between all the bomb stuff you'd get little notes and stuff from Dylan like "I have to get pants" "get punk gloves" "I got my pants!!"

Screamingophelia wrote:

Rumor has it it's "NBK" but it's probably NIN.

yeah its definitely the NIN logo. I have no clue what the others are.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Rumor has it it's "NBK" but it's probably NIN.

It's NIN, you can tell by the И.

Are there any photos of Dylan's backpack floating around? I know I'm off topic now but that just had me wondering...

It's crazy how "normal" Eric looked when he dressed "normal". Quite a big difference between the picture of him sitting there, to how he looked in the hitman for hire video. He even looks kind of "jockish" wearing a Nike hat and flannel.

slippy123 wrote:

It's crazy how "normal" Eric looked when he dressed "normal". Quite a big difference between the picture of him sitting there, to how he looked in the hitman for hire video. He even looks kind of "jockish" wearing a Nike hat and flannel.

Eric used to wear "normal" clothes often actually, though he always tucked shirts into his pants, it was 90's trend. Both Eric and Dylan were 90's mainstream, regardless of their individuality.

I also thought it was weird seeing him wear a Nike hat. I agree that even though they may have been considered (or considered themselves) somewhat alternative, besides the dusters they did dress pretty normal.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Eric was all about foreshadowing. He got a kick out of finding ways to tie things into NBK. I think this was just another way he thought was clever.

I Think this pretty much sums it up. I Believe that Eric was very concerned about what would be left behind and I'd bet he thought having a drawing of a lit bomb and CHS"would be pretty "creepy foreshadowing" but in the end, I think it just showed his youthful ignorance. He wanted to be remembered as a genius and deceiver. I'm also a believer that the majority of his "journal" was meant for the press/audience. While a few of his entries were likely truthful (his final entry comes to mind) I think Eric was the 1999 equivalent of an "edgy teen". He wanted people to think he was this dark and brooding character, When really he was just a guy who was given a hard time in high school.

Eric was even wearing a Broncos sweatshirt in Rampart Range. Correct me if I'm wrong because you know how you get SO much info at once when it comes to Columbine but Dylan wore his trenchcoat a lot more than Eric did.

Without the trench Dylan dressed like your standard alternative guy.

Eric got a huge kick out of KMFDM coming out with their Adios album on 4/20 as well. They wanted to be remembered as more than what they were. Dylan talked about being self aware and knowing more than most, calling people Zombies, then Eric shortly after started speaking similarly. They truly wanted it to be like a movie.

Screamingophelia wrote:

They really did plan NBK like it was a movie. Right down to what they were wearing. I found it a bit darkly funny that in the Basement tapes and in the planners in between all the bomb stuff you'd get little notes and stuff from Dylan like "I have to get pants" "get punk gloves" "I got my pants!!"

I agree, Dylan's little notations always seemed so childlike and innocent. I always found the "get punk gloves" funny for some reason. Not just any gloves but specifically "punk" gloves. Like you couldn't just cut the fingers off normal gloves.

slippy123 wrote:

He even looks kind of "jockish" wearing a Nike hat and flannel.

Since making that statement have you been visited by Eric's pissed off, indignant ghost?

No, no they had to VERY specific gloves LOL. I'm pretty sure he just took Eric's left glove and I think Eric wore the right glove. They both mentioned getting laid too, I THINK Dylan wrote "get some" I also thought it was kind of bittersweet that Dylan wrote down "bday shit" his dad and Erics birthdays were both in April, so reminding himself to get gifts.

SG Eric DID say he wanted to haunt people so slippy just may have been visited.

I remember in Eric's 1998 or 1999 day planner he wrote "anniversary card" to remind himself to get one for his parents wedding anniversary. I don't know many high school kids who even remember their parents anniversary let alone get them a card.
That made me sad to see.

Say what you want about Eric, he loved his family. He would NOT forget Mother's Day that's for sure.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Say what you want about Eric, he loved his family. He would NOT forget Mother's Day that's for sure.

Agreed! Eric always had a Momma's Boy vibe to him for some reason. Not that there is anything wrong with that. My son is a total Mommy's Boy.

I get that vibe too. Then he tries to be all tough in his journal (or the tapes) something about "make me a sandwich" really edgy, never heard that before.

Whenever Eric did something wrong, his mom seemed to cry, there's a handful of stories and it seems to end with "Kathy wept"

Screamingophelia wrote:

I get that vibe too. Then he tries to be all tough in his journal (or the tapes) something about "make me a sandwich" really edgy, never heard that before.

Whenever Eric did something wrong, his mom seemed to cry, there's a handful of stories and it seems to end with "Kathy wept"

Eric seemed to have a VERY old fashioned/sexist view of women in general, but whether he really believed the things he said is anyone's guess. I think it may have just been another form of posturing, trying to be the ultimate male, etc.

BTW here is the entry I mentioned. It was April of '98.

Edit: I guess that means their anniversary is the 17th, which was the date of the 1999 senior prom. That explains why Wayne and Kathy were out to dinner the night Eric had Susan over when he failed to get a date to the dance.
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SG, I assumed that Eric was raised in a bit more of a conservative household too. Wayne being the main bread winner, they got married young (like my mom and dad did) and so Eric was used to the mother being more of the nurturing one who cooked and cleaned. He seemed to want to be this "alpha male" which would could have been a lot of posturing... there are women out there who like to cook and be more of caretakers but they also may want careers of their own. I LOVE cooking and I'd be happy to make things for someone I'm in a relationship with, but if you are an ass hole and expectant of it then no, make your own or starve.


Thanks Littlelo!

Why did he write down Kristi's history paper... maybe he had to remind her LOL. Or does it say Kristi's hot. His handwriting it much better than Dylans at the very least.

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I think you're right, it says history papers. I think I saw somewhere that he thanked her (or maybe another girl) for letting him copy their notes. Maybe he needed to get them back to her after borrowing them?

That makes sense!

Screamingophelia wrote:

SG, I assumed that Eric was raised in a bit more of a conservative household too. Wayne being the main bread winner, they got married young (like my mom and dad did) and so Eric was used to the mother being more of the nurturing one who cooked and cleaned. He seemed to want to be this "alpha male" which would could have been a lot of posturing... there are women out there who like to cook and be more of caretakers but they also may want careers of their own. I LOVE cooking and I'd be happy to make things for someone I'm in a relationship with, but if you are an ass hole and expectant of it then no, make your own or starve.

I agree with that! In my opinion, I think Eric wanted someone like his mother. SO he tried to be an Alpha like his dad.

I have no issues with cooking and cleaning either. But my husband knows better then to ever demand anything!   Although he likes to cook as well, and will often do it just to help out.  

He is secure in his manliness enough to run a vacuum, or dust in high places, top of bookshelves, etc. Because he is 6'3 compared to my 5'1. I have to drag out a step ladder to reach certain things, and I'm sure he doesn't want to rush my clumsy ass to the ER every time I attempt dusting!

He even said he felt more confident once he had his guns. He wanted to BE Reb, not skinny, goofy Eric. One could say that "toxic masculinity" affected Eric negatively too.

Every relationship I've been in was either give and take or I just did my own thing separately when it came to cooking/cleaning etc. I've always felt like it was shared responsibilities even though I had some family members who were very old fashioned in their gender roles.

Do you ever get crap from tall girls? I adore tall men, granted 5 feet 8 is tall to me but guys over 6 foot seem to adore petite women but my tall friends are always like 'stop taking our dates!!" I can't help it My last BF was 5'6"

Screamingophelia wrote:

Do you ever get crap from tall girls? I adore tall men, granted 5 feet 8 is tall to me but guys over 6 foot seem to adore petite women but my tall friends are always like 'stop taking our dates!!"  I can't help it My last BF was 5'6

When I was in school I did have other girls make the mistake of thinking that my size would make me easy to push around or bully. BUT I'm very tomboyish and grew up in the country with alot of older male cousins who taught me how to fight. After people realized that I didn't hesitate and would climb them like a ladder, I was mostly left alone.  I remember being called that crazy little Redneck chick more then once!

I have always dated guys who were taller, but at 5'1 every guy I knew was pretty much taller then me. Also I'm SO not petite body wise, only in height. I'm not skinny but not fat, if that makes any sense. My husband lists my ass as one of the top five reasons he married me. He just wont tell me how far up on that list it is though.    I would say I'm curvy and after two kids my curves got a little wider!

Maybe your friends are insecure because some men do tend to like women who are shorter/smaller. I think it ties into the whole big man must protect tiny female complex that a lot of men have.

My friend sells Luluroe and she posted "who ever said they want their butt to look bigger?" and I said ME!!! I have wide hips and broad shoulders and everything else is pretty svelte (ballet since I was 7...)

I've always been more attracted to the lean and tall dudes, not big muscles or anything. Like Nate Dykeman type and non emaciated Dylan... (I have reservations mentioning this as to not sound like a fangirl but it is what it is)

Eric was way too worried about being "manly" and butch. He would have found his place I'm sure.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] I find Eric attractive and I feel bad

For finding Eric attractive? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Eric was a little hottie (not in the Dave Cullen sense but he wasn't unattractive) but he didn't feel that way and there were people around him who didn't see that and he had the temper and attitude that was off putting. . I can empathize with that. When I was younger one of my friends mentioned when I got older I'd see how attractive Dylan was and I did, they both had really nice features, it doesn't mean you condone what they did. I'm pretty sure Ted Bundy and Richard Ramirez were married in prison. Eric and Dylan are probably the tamest in a way.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] I prefer goofy,shy Eric more than wannabe badass REB
Too bad he cared more about what ppl think of him than about himself

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

I get that vibe too. Then he tries to be all tough in his journal (or the tapes) something about "make me a sandwich" really edgy, never heard that before.

Whenever Eric did something wrong, his mom seemed to cry, there's a handful of stories and it seems to end with "Kathy wept"

Eric seemed to have a VERY old fashioned/sexist view of women in general, but whether he really believed the things he said is anyone's guess. I think it may have just been another form of posturing, trying to be the ultimate male, etc.

Objectifying others is in that narcissistic/sociopath spectrum that Eric had rapidly morphed into it seems his junior year or so.


Living in the Denver area, originally minutes from CHS, I've posted some local feedback that I've run across over the three years I've been here. People don't really talk about it much, but Columbine was either too long ago or like many of us they weren't living here in the late 90's.. others close to the situation want to put it behind them. Having said that just last month I came to realize that my only friend I knew from Denver prior to moving here has a nephew that was in the art room/class on 4/20.

In short, his take was influenced by his sister and his nephew's feedback and had Eric as the very troubled dangerous kid, Dylan as the goofy lost kid and a lot about the influence of the "Rocky class" and it's effect on the school's culture. To a lessor degree some statements on other parties that may have had insight that E & D were up to something, but nothing as strong as any others being associates to the massacre.

Nothing surprising, but interesting to hear the perspective of someone close to the situation. I'll add that he knows Rocky's father and didn't hold back.. this coming from a guy who is a business leader in Denver that I've known 20 years and never heard him speak that way about anyone or even close.

Thank you for that!

It's interesting to hear what people say now. I'm going to be visiting Denver for a job interview next month and I want to visit the memorial and didn't know quite what to expect, I wanted to pay my respects.

Rebbie556 wrote:

I would like to hear your opinion of the poster on which the words CHS and Clue were written in addition to a lit bomb in Eric's room that appeared on the goodbye portion of the basement tapes.  

"The tape ends with a brief glimpse of a sign on the wall of Eric’s bedroom, someone’s arm partially blocking it from sight. It’s the letters CHS along with a drawing of a bomb with a lit fuse and, in bold black letters, the word “clue.” "

There are many hidden layers of the Columbine story that will forever elude us.

It's very frustrating. When a person researches Columbine they always hit a brick wall. It's like buying one of those 1000 piece jigsaw puzzles, opening the box, and there's only 300 pieces. It's enough to have a general idea of what what the picture is but the whole picture can never come into full view.

IMO it probably does mean something but thanks to a lot of evidence being withheld, we can never know.

I wish ALL the evidence and case files could surface someday. While I don't believe in the conspiracy nonsense, there's a reason they wont allow the full story to come out.