Eric emotional abuse ?

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Mon Dec 25, 2017 1:49 am

If I may, I'd like to debate [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] in a respectful manner.

Now I'm not an expert on the massacre and never claimed to be, so some of these questions (specifically # 10 and # 16) are going to go unanswered. I suggest that you ask someone who knows more than me on this subject about the unanswered questions.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 1. Why did more than one hundred eye-witnesses and earwitnesses to the attacks believe that multiple perpetrators were involved? Why did more than forty of these witnesses identify other suspects by name?

2. Why did numerous witnesses report hearing fully automatic fire?

3. Why did at least 35 witnesses hear shooting and explosions in the school after the gunmen had purportedly "committed suicide"?

17. Why didn't the Final Report of the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office make no mention of the brief exit of a gunman on the eastern side of the building, as seen by many witnesses?

18. Why did police warn students of a gunman positioned on the roof if it was simply a "repairman"? Why did witnesses see two men on the roof and why did the students see him aiming what looked like a rifle? Why has Chris Clarke told three completely different stories about where he was when the shooting started and two about what he was at Columbine High to do that day? Why did he fail to recognize his own service van when he was rescued by Denver Police Officer Wayne DePew, who reportedly commandeered it - the keys were conveniently left in the ignition - and used it to rescue Clarke? Why did no other officers see this rescue, including the ones Officer DePew claims to have been with? Is it simply coincidence that Officer DePew's son attended Columbine High, witnessed disturbing, mysterious activities in the school, and was died in a strange 'accident' in New Mexico in 2013?

Here we have all the questions about eyewitness reports differing from the official story. So let me explain something to you about eyewitness testimony: it is notoriously unreliable, to the point where some states have considered ruling it inadmissible as evidence in court. In my Forensics class we got to know about a case where a woman was raped and later on was unable to accurately identify her rapist, resulting in an innocent man getting convicted for the crime (he was later exonerated via DNA evidence). This is not a unique story by any means. What the eyewitnesses saw and heard that day, and even what they remember, is likely very blurred.

I'd also like to take a look at this claim right here:

42099_4EVA wrote:: Is it simply coincidence that Officer DePew's son attended Columbine High, witnessed disturbing, mysterious activities in the school, and was died in a strange 'accident' in New Mexico in 2013?

Yes, it is. Because I have no idea where you're going with this claim. Are you trying to insinuate that Mr. Depew's son was killed to silence him? In that case why wait until 2013? Why not just do it right away? Why risk a potential leak for 14 years?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 4. Why was the gun Klebold supposedly used to kill himself found in his right hand, even though the wound was in the left temple and he was left-handed? Why was the shotgun Harris supposedly used to kill himself seen under his leg in photographs?

They moved the bodies to search for bombs. Couldn't tell you why Klebold held the gun in his right hand, but under your theory he did indeed shoot himself, right?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 6. Why did police concentrate on "setting up a perimeter" around the school when dispatch was hearing the sounds of gunshots in the school? Why did police take such a long time to enter the school, and why after entry did they wait three hours to enter the library where the shooters had last been seen? Were they really, as Sheriff John Stone indicated, "outgunned" by two teenagers who could not aim? Why were other emergency personnel told that they would be shot if they tried to enter? Why was a police sniper with a clear shot on Klebold given an order not to fire?

They set up a perimeter because at the time the Columbine massacre happened, there was little precedent for a shooting spree like this. The situation was incredibly chaotic and the police did not know how many gunmen there were, so they elected to wait for a SWAT team. The police sniper was likely ordered not to fire on Klebold because, as I said earlier, the police did not understand the situation at all.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 7. Why did teacher Dave Sanders, who students were able to keep alive for three hours, die within twenty minutes of being taken into police custody? Why did they take so long to locate him when students were urgently telling them his location? Why was his shirt taken off?

He was bleeding quite heavily for the three hours he was in the student's care. They took a long time locating him because they weren't trying to locate him; the SWAT team was going classroom to classroom sweeping the entire school slowly.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 9. If Harris and Klebold knew they were almost certainly going to be killed, why did both make plans for after the massacre? Why did Harris continue to do schoolwork and keep his grades up until the date of the attack? Why was Klebold telling others how excited he was to attend college in Arizona? Why did Klebold say on tape at prom night: * "Dad, we're going to laugh about this in 20 years"? Why did Harris make plans with old friends in New York for that summer, and tell at least one online friend about these plans? Why did Harris ask a teacher for help with an English essay days before the massacre? Why did he put his schedule in to work for the week *after the massacre?

To put on a façade. They wanted no-one to be suspicious of their true motives.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 11. How were Harris and Klebold able to secretly transfer 99 explosive devices - by some accounts more than 120 - into the school? How were able to position them inside several vehicles - not their own - near the school? Who owned these cars and when and how were they cleared of involvement?

Most of those explosives were crickets, pipe bombs, or Molotov cocktails, and those were not transferred secretly - Harris and Klebold openly carried them during the massacre. The propane bombs were carried in because the cameras for the cafeteria had to have their VCR tape (or whatever it was) changed out. Harris and Klebold managed to carry them in without much trouble because almost no-one, especially back before 9/11, noticed a few bags lying around. They were more focused on eating lunch and talking with friends. As for the claim about the cars, I'm gonna need a source on that.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 12. Why is it considered fact that Harris and Klebold placed the 'diversionary' bombs that exploded at South Wadsworth when there isn't any evidence at all that they did? No physical evidence linking them to this blast has been produced, nor have any witnesses placed them at the scene. One witness reportedly saw David Caravan, a member of the Trench Coat Mafia, fleeing the blast site with a smile on his face. An unidentified "transient" was discovered hiding in a nearby storm drain. Others spoke of a mysterious "survey crew" that "moved the backpacks" and may have placed them themselves.

I've already gone over the whole issue with eyewitness testimony being unreliable. I believe the reason it is considered a fact that Harris and Klebold planted the diversionary bombs is because they explicitly said they planted them.

While we're on this topic, why would the FBI or whomever plant the diversionary bombs there if they didn't go off? What wouldb e the point to planting two bombs that turned out to be duds? You claim that an eyewitness saw David Caravan at the scene - does David have an alibi?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 13. Why did authorities claim that the two shotguns recovered did not have serial numbers when in fact they did? Why did they make no attempt to find out who sold the Hi-Point 9mm rifle and the pump-action shotgun used in the attack?

The serial numbers debacle might just be simple incompetence. After all, why else would they claim "the shotguns have no serial numbers" only to allow themselves to be contradicted at a later date? The reason the rifle and shotgun were not traced back to anyone is because thanks to a quirk in Colorado law at the time, the transaction between not just Robin and the dealer, but also her giving the guns to Harris and Klebold, was perfectly legal. There was no need to trace the origin of the gun (I presume).

42099_4EVA wrote:: 14. Are persistent rumours that the school administration was warned based in truth? Why was Principal Frank DeAngelis running up and down the interior cafeteria stairs almost immediately before the shooting started?

IIRC he was heading to a meeting with a fellow teacher. If he was indeed warned why did he later go out to see what the situation was and get shot at for it?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 15. Was there indeed a 'fire drill' scheduled for later in the day, as one science teacher told his class? Were bomb threats called into the school that morning, as two sources claimed - one of whom told the news that morning and later died in a highly suspicious plane collision? Why did one special ed student make comments about "bombs in the trash can" the day before?

Why would there be bomb threats called in to the school if the conspiracy was engineered specifically to get Harris and Klebold to go in and kill people? Why would a special ed student talk about bombs in trash cans (even though none of Harris and Klebold's bombs were concealed by trash cans)? In fact, why would a special ed student know anything pertaining to the conspiracy? Isn't that the last person you'd trust with knowledge of such an event?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 19. Is it simply coincidence that "crisis training drills" were held at Columbine High in the weeks before the attack? What was the nature of this training and who scheduled it?

I'm not sure what you're really talking about here. Who said there were crisis drills at the school in the weeks leading up to the attack? Why would the government make the school conduct these alleged drills anyway?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 20. Why were at least one police officer and one sheriff's deputy already at the school when the shooting started? Was the maintenance man in Clement Park, Dick Clark, correct when he claimed that he observed "an undercover cop" in the park before the shooting?

The police officer was the school resource officer, whose job is to be assigned to the school. Lot's of schools have such an officer. The deputy was writing someone a ticket IIRC. Later on you go on to talk about the government getting involved in the case, so tell me, were the police in on it before, during, or after the massacre? And on the maintenance man, he could have simply misspoke.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 21. Why is it frequently claimed that there were no security cameras in the library or administration areas when many witnesses saw such cameras? Why does local media refuse to release their on-scene video footage from the first half-hour of the attack?

Who has claimed there were no cameras in the library? And I'm gonna need a source on the claim that the media is withholding footage.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 22. Where is the evidence taken from the computers of members of the Trench Coat Mafia? Where are the scores of missing interviews with students, including many of those in the science hall where some saw a gunman who appeared to be *"in his thirties"? Why are thousands of pages of investigatory material - including hundreds of reports and tips from witnesses unconnected with Columbine - still sealed?

23. Why has the school district's own report on the massacre, which included the extensive disciplinary records of the members of the Trench Coat Mafia, remained sealed to this day?

So are you insinuating that the government enlisted the help of the Trench Coat Mafia in the conspiracy? Why would they do that? As for why some reports and tips were sealed, what would be the point of releasing them? Harris and Klebold did it, so releasing a bunch of documents were people are putting in reports of other people committing the shooting serves no purpose.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 5. Why did investigators ignore so many compelling leads that suggested a wider conspiracy?

24. Why was no attempt made to interview Eric Harris' psychologist, who prescribed him Luvox? Why was no attempt made to analyze "white pills" discovered in Klebold's room? Is it a coincidence that Sgt. Randy West was the man who instructed officers to follow neither lead, and is it also a coincidence that "Sgt. West" does this in many other instances throughout the files?

25. Why did investigators show absolutely no interest in the fact that many planned attacks on schools were surfacing in the Denver area and around the country during this same time period? Why were so many of these plans made in advance of the attacks?

28. Why was the U.S. Attorney's Office consulted on "prosecutive decisions" with regard to the massacre - a local crime?

29. Why did personnel from the LAPD and the L.A. Sheriff's Office travel to the scene afterward? What was the subject of a ten-minute call between the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office and the NYPD on the day of the massacre?

30. Why did two high-ranking military officers - a colonel and a general - appear on scene in camouflage uniforms? Why was the memorial service - held at a public park - ringed with military trucks? Who authorized a group of military jets to do a flyover and why?

I need citations on these before I can comment.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 26. Why did the FBI and the ATF immediately become involved? Why were all but one of the "investigatory" teams headed or co-headed by an FBI agent, with the exception headed by a "former" FBI agent who was now with the Colorado Bureau of Investigation (CBI)? Was the crime scene "federalized" soon after the initiation of the attacks, under powers granted by the Anti-Terrorism Act signed by President Bill Clinton in the wake of the Oklahoma City Bombing and precisely three years before on April 20, 1996?

Didn't Jeffco ask for help from the FBI and ATF?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 27. Why was top FBI psychologist Dwayne Fuselier, whose sons attended Columbine High and involved with the Trench Coat Mafia, selected to head the investigation? Even though his sons produced a video for video class in 1997 with members of the Trench Coat Mafia, including suspect Brooks Brown, featuring four trench-coated gunmen shooting through the halls of the school before blowing it up? Why didn't he recuse himself from the investigation and why did his superiors openly refuse to remove him? Is it simply coincidence that Fuselier was a key 'negotiator' at both the Waco and Montana Freemen sieges, both of which involved acts of severe brutality by federal law enforcement?

Need a source for the underlined statement. As for the rest of the claim, I presume the reason they appointed Mr. Fuselier to head the investigation due to both his credentials working in the FBI and his knowledge of the area. As for his involvement with Waco =, didn't Mr. Fuselier advise the FBI against storming the building?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 31. Why did the Federal Emergency Management Agency hold a four-day "disaster training course" eighteen months before the massacre and "designed specially to adress the needs of Jefferson County," for future sheriff John Stone and other county officials?

>eighteen moths before the massacre
I'm really not sure why a time lapse of a year and a half matters here. You do now that disaster traing is pretty common across every first-world nation, right?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 32. Is it coincidence that the episode of The Promised Land on CBS scheduled for that week featured a kid firing a gun in front of a Denver high school? Is it coincidence that the episode of Buffy the Vampire Slayer on WB for that week featured a plan by a student gunman to kill everyone at his school? Is it a coincidence that MTV scheduled a program called Warning Signs, produced by the Justice Department, which was about violence and its effect on young people, to air two days after the massacre? Is it a coincidence that the History Channel had scheduled a program called Slaughter at Schools for May 10?

33. When ABC's 20/20 did a show about the disturbing "death education" programs in the early nineties, was it simply a coincidence that they featured Columbine High School

So why would the conspiracy purposely foreshadow the events that would take place at the school? This is something that I'm having the hardest time grasping - just why would a massive conspiracy of this scale purposefully leave hints that they're going to do something huge? So yeah, I'm going with "it's just a coincidence" for these, if for no other reason than the idea that a vast conspiracy with a great deal of clout behind it leaving any kind of hint that a major shitstorm was about to go down - and even reveal where they were going to do it - is mind bogglingly stupid.

And that episode of Buffy featured a lunch lady trying to poison the whole school, not a kid with a gun. It's revealed that the kid just wants to commit suicide later on.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 8. Why did two teens who, contrary to public belief, were not bullied, had many friends, and were not psychopathic destroy their own lives and those of at least twelve other students and one teacher only six weeks before graduation?

Why indeed.

_________________
"My guns are the only things that haven't stabbed me in the back."
-Kip Kinkel

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Mon Dec 25, 2017 2:35 am

QuestionMark wrote:

If I may, I'd like to debate [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] in a respectful manner.

Now I'm not an expert on the massacre and never claimed to be, so some of these questions (specifically # 10 and # 16) are going to go unanswered. I suggest that you ask someone who knows more than me on this subject about the unanswered questions.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 1. Why did more than one hundred eye-witnesses and earwitnesses to the attacks believe that multiple perpetrators were involved? Why did more than forty of these witnesses identify other suspects by name?

2. Why did numerous witnesses report hearing fully automatic fire?

3. Why did at least 35 witnesses hear shooting and explosions in the school after the gunmen had purportedly "committed suicide"?

17. Why didn't the Final Report of the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office make no mention of the brief exit of a gunman on the eastern side of the building, as seen by many witnesses?

18. Why did police warn students of a gunman positioned on the roof if it was simply a "repairman"? Why did witnesses see two men on the roof and why did the students see him aiming what looked like a rifle? Why has Chris Clarke told three completely different stories about where he was when the shooting started and two about what he was at Columbine High to do that day? Why did he fail to recognize his own service van when he was rescued by Denver Police Officer Wayne DePew, who reportedly commandeered it - the keys were conveniently left in the ignition - and used it to rescue Clarke? Why did no other officers see this rescue, including the ones Officer DePew claims to have been with? Is it simply coincidence that Officer DePew's son attended Columbine High, witnessed disturbing, mysterious activities in the school, and was died in a strange 'accident' in New Mexico in 2013?

Here we have all the questions about eyewitness reports differing from the official story. So let me explain something to you about eyewitness testimony: it is notoriously unreliable, to the point where some states have considered ruling it inadmissible as evidence in court. In my Forensics class we got to know about a case where a woman was raped and later on was unable to accurately identify her rapist, resulting in an innocent man getting convicted for the crime (he was later exonerated via DNA evidence). This is not a unique story by any means. What the eyewitnesses saw and heard that day, and even what they remember, is likely very blurred.

I'd also like to take a look at this claim right here:

42099_4EVA wrote:: Is it simply coincidence that Officer DePew's son attended Columbine High, witnessed disturbing, mysterious activities in the school, and was died in a strange 'accident' in New Mexico in 2013?

Yes, it is. Because I have no idea where you're going with this claim. Are you trying to insinuate that Mr. Depew's son was killed to silence him? In that case why wait until 2013? Why not just do it right away? Why risk a potential leak for 14 years?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 4. Why was the gun Klebold supposedly used to kill himself found in his right hand, even though the wound was in the left temple and he was left-handed? Why was the shotgun Harris supposedly used to kill himself seen under his leg in photographs?

They moved the bodies to search for bombs. Couldn't tell you why Klebold held the gun in his right hand, but under your theory he did indeed shoot himself, right?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 6. Why did police concentrate on "setting up a perimeter" around the school when dispatch was hearing the sounds of gunshots in the school? Why did police take such a long time to enter the school, and why after entry did they wait three hours to enter the library where the shooters had last been seen? Were they really, as Sheriff John Stone indicated, "outgunned" by two teenagers who could not aim? Why were other emergency personnel told that they would be shot if they tried to enter? Why was a police sniper with a clear shot on Klebold given an order not to fire?

They set up a perimeter because at the time the Columbine massacre happened, there was little precedent for a shooting spree like this. The situation was incredibly chaotic and the police did not know how many gunmen there were, so they elected to wait for a SWAT team. The police sniper was likely ordered not to fire on Klebold because, as I said earlier, the police did not understand the situation at all.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 7. Why did teacher Dave Sanders, who students were able to keep alive for three hours, die within twenty minutes of being taken into police custody? Why did they take so long to locate him when students were urgently telling them his location? Why was his shirt taken off?

He was bleeding quite heavily for the three hours he was in the student's care. They took a long time locating him because they weren't trying to locate him; the SWAT team was going classroom to classroom sweeping the entire school slowly.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 9. If Harris and Klebold knew they were almost certainly going to be killed, why did both make plans for after the massacre? Why did Harris continue to do schoolwork and keep his grades up until the date of the attack? Why was Klebold telling others how excited he was to attend college in Arizona? Why did Klebold say on tape at prom night: * "Dad, we're going to laugh about this in 20 years"? Why did Harris make plans with old friends in New York for that summer, and tell at least one online friend about these plans? Why did Harris ask a teacher for help with an English essay days before the massacre? Why did he put his schedule in to work for the week *after the massacre?

To put on a façade. They wanted no-one to be suspicious of their true motives.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 11. How were Harris and Klebold able to secretly transfer 99 explosive devices - by some accounts more than 120 - into the school? How were able to position them inside several vehicles - not their own - near the school? Who owned these cars and when and how were they cleared of involvement?

Most of those explosives were crickets, pipe bombs, or Molotov cocktails, and those were not transferred secretly - Harris and Klebold openly carried them during the massacre. The propane bombs were carried in because the cameras for the cafeteria had to have their VCR tape (or whatever it was) changed out. Harris and Klebold managed to carry them in without much trouble because almost no-one, especially back before 9/11, noticed a few bags lying around. They were more focused on eating lunch and talking with friends. As for the claim about the cars, I'm gonna need a source on that.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 12. Why is it considered fact that Harris and Klebold placed the 'diversionary' bombs that exploded at South Wadsworth when there isn't any evidence at all that they did? No physical evidence linking them to this blast has been produced, nor have any witnesses placed them at the scene. One witness reportedly saw David Caravan, a member of the Trench Coat Mafia, fleeing the blast site with a smile on his face. An unidentified "transient" was discovered hiding in a nearby storm drain. Others spoke of a mysterious "survey crew" that "moved the backpacks" and may have placed them themselves.

I've already gone over the whole issue with eyewitness testimony being unreliable. I believe the reason it is considered a fact that Harris and Klebold planted the diversionary bombs is because they explicitly said they planted them.

While we're on this topic, why would the FBI or whomever plant the diversionary bombs there if they didn't go off? What wouldb e the point to planting two bombs that turned out to be duds? You claim that an eyewitness saw David Caravan at the scene - does David have an alibi?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 13. Why did authorities claim that the two shotguns recovered did not have serial numbers when in fact they did? Why did they make no attempt to find out who sold the Hi-Point 9mm rifle and the pump-action shotgun used in the attack?

The serial numbers debacle might just be simple incompetence. After all, why else would they claim "the shotguns have no serial numbers" only to allow themselves to be contradicted at a later date? The reason the rifle and shotgun were not traced back to anyone is because thanks to a quirk in Colorado law at the time, the transaction between not just Robin and the dealer, but also her giving the guns to Harris and Klebold, was perfectly legal. There was no need to trace the origin of the gun (I presume).

42099_4EVA wrote:: 14. Are persistent rumours that the school administration was warned based in truth? Why was Principal Frank DeAngelis running up and down the interior cafeteria stairs almost immediately before the shooting started?

IIRC he was heading to a meeting with a fellow teacher. If he was indeed warned why did he later go out to see what the situation was and get shot at for it?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 15. Was there indeed a 'fire drill' scheduled for later in the day, as one science teacher told his class? Were bomb threats called into the school that morning, as two sources claimed - one of whom told the news that morning and later died in a highly suspicious plane collision? Why did one special ed student make comments about "bombs in the trash can" the day before?

Why would there be bomb threats called in to the school if the conspiracy was engineered specifically to get Harris and Klebold to go in and kill people? Why would a special ed student talk about bombs in trash cans (even though none of Harris and Klebold's bombs were concealed by trash cans)? In fact, why would a special ed student know anything pertaining to the conspiracy? Isn't that the last person you'd trust with knowledge of such an event?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 19. Is it simply coincidence that "crisis training drills" were held at Columbine High in the weeks before the attack? What was the nature of this training and who scheduled it?

I'm not sure what you're really talking about here. Who said there were crisis drills at the school in the weeks leading up to the attack? Why would the government make the school conduct these alleged drills anyway?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 20. Why were at least one police officer and one sheriff's deputy already at the school when the shooting started? Was the maintenance man in Clement Park, Dick Clark, correct when he claimed that he observed "an undercover cop" in the park before the shooting?

The police officer was the school resource officer, whose job is to be assigned to the school. Lot's of schools have such an officer. The deputy was writing someone a ticket IIRC. Later on you go on to talk about the government getting involved in the case, so tell me, were the police in on it before, during, or after the massacre? And on the maintenance man, he could have simply misspoke.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 21. Why is it frequently claimed that there were no security cameras in the library or administration areas when many witnesses saw such cameras? Why does local media refuse to release their on-scene video footage from the first half-hour of the attack?

Who has claimed there were no cameras in the library? And I'm gonna need a source on the claim that the media is withholding footage.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 22. Where is the evidence taken from the computers of members of the Trench Coat Mafia? Where are the scores of missing interviews with students, including many of those in the science hall where some saw a gunman who appeared to be *"in his thirties"? Why are thousands of pages of investigatory material - including hundreds of reports and tips from witnesses unconnected with Columbine - still sealed?

23. Why has the school district's own report on the massacre, which included the extensive disciplinary records of the members of the Trench Coat Mafia, remained sealed to this day?

So are you insinuating that the government enlisted the help of the Trench Coat Mafia in the conspiracy? Why would they do that? As for why some reports and tips were sealed, what would be the point of releasing them? Harris and Klebold did it, so releasing a bunch of documents were people are putting in reports of other people committing the shooting serves no purpose.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 5. Why did investigators ignore so many compelling leads that suggested a wider conspiracy?

24. Why was no attempt made to interview Eric Harris' psychologist, who prescribed him Luvox? Why was no attempt made to analyze "white pills" discovered in Klebold's room? Is it a coincidence that Sgt. Randy West was the man who instructed officers to follow neither lead, and is it also a coincidence that "Sgt. West" does this in many other instances throughout the files?

25. Why did investigators show absolutely no interest in the fact that many planned attacks on schools were surfacing in the Denver area and around the country during this same time period? Why were so many of these plans made in advance of the attacks?

28. Why was the U.S. Attorney's Office consulted on "prosecutive decisions" with regard to the massacre - a local crime?

29. Why did personnel from the LAPD and the L.A. Sheriff's Office travel to the scene afterward? What was the subject of a ten-minute call between the Jefferson County Sheriff's Office and the NYPD on the day of the massacre?

30. Why did two high-ranking military officers - a colonel and a general - appear on scene in camouflage uniforms? Why was the memorial service - held at a public park - ringed with military trucks? Who authorized a group of military jets to do a flyover and why?

I need citations on these before I can comment.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 26. Why did the FBI and the ATF immediately become involved? Why were all but one of the "investigatory" teams headed or co-headed by an FBI agent, with the exception headed by a "former" FBI agent who was now with the Colorado Bureau of Investigation (CBI)? Was the crime scene "federalized" soon after the initiation of the attacks, under powers granted by the Anti-Terrorism Act signed by President Bill Clinton in the wake of the Oklahoma City Bombing and precisely three years before on April 20, 1996?

Didn't Jeffco ask for help from the FBI and ATF?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 27. Why was top FBI psychologist Dwayne Fuselier, whose sons attended Columbine High and involved with the Trench Coat Mafia, selected to head the investigation? Even though his sons produced a video for video class in 1997 with members of the Trench Coat Mafia, including suspect Brooks Brown, featuring four trench-coated gunmen shooting through the halls of the school before blowing it up? Why didn't he recuse himself from the investigation and why did his superiors openly refuse to remove him? Is it simply coincidence that Fuselier was a key 'negotiator' at both the Waco and Montana Freemen sieges, both of which involved acts of severe brutality by federal law enforcement?

Need a source for the underlined statement. As for the rest of the claim, I presume the reason they appointed Mr. Fuselier to head the investigation due to both his credentials working in the FBI and his knowledge of the area. As for his involvement with Waco =, didn't Mr. Fuselier advise the FBI against storming the building?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 31. Why did the Federal Emergency Management Agency hold a four-day "disaster training course" eighteen months before the massacre and "designed specially to adress the needs of Jefferson County," for future sheriff John Stone and other county officials?

>eighteen moths before the massacre
I'm really not sure why a time lapse of a year and a half matters here. You do now that disaster traing is pretty common across every first-world nation, right?

42099_4EVA wrote:: 32. Is it coincidence that the episode of The Promised Land on CBS scheduled for that week featured a kid firing a gun in front of a Denver high school? Is it coincidence that the episode of Buffy the Vampire Slayer on WB for that week featured a plan by a student gunman to kill everyone at his school? Is it a coincidence that MTV scheduled a program called Warning Signs, produced by the Justice Department, which was about violence and its effect on young people, to air two days after the massacre? Is it a coincidence that the History Channel had scheduled a program called Slaughter at Schools for May 10?

33. When ABC's 20/20 did a show about the disturbing "death education" programs in the early nineties, was it simply a coincidence that they featured Columbine High School

So why would the conspiracy purposely foreshadow the events that would take place at the school? This is something that I'm having the hardest time grasping - just why would a massive conspiracy of this scale purposefully leave hints that they're going to do something huge? So yeah, I'm going with "it's just a coincidence" for these, if for no other reason than the idea that a vast conspiracy with a great deal of clout behind it leaving any kind of hint that a major shitstorm was about to go down - and even reveal where they were going to do it - is mind bogglingly stupid.

And that episode of Buffy featured a lunch lady trying to poison the whole school, not a kid with a gun. It's revealed that the kid just wants to commit suicide later on.

42099_4EVA wrote:: 8. Why did two teens who, contrary to public belief, were not bullied, had many friends, and were not psychopathic destroy their own lives and those of at least twelve other students and one teacher only six weeks before graduation?

Why indeed.

Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

They were bullied though, despite what Cullen days. Having friends and being bullied are not mutually exclusive. There was an issue with that at Columbine according to MANY.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Mon Dec 25, 2017 2:56 am

Screamingophelia wrote:: Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

Your welcome. Generally I like to have a dialogue with people rather than have them shut down, deplatformed, and ridiculed. I think the latter is ineffective and childish really.

_________________
"My guns are the only things that haven't stabbed me in the back."
-Kip Kinkel

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Mon Dec 25, 2017 6:42 am

QuestionMark wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:: Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

Your welcome. Generally I like to have a dialogue with people rather than have them shut down, deplatformed, and ridiculed. I think the latter is ineffective and childish really.

I agree. I like having polite discourse

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Mon Dec 25, 2017 1:31 pm

Screamingophelia wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:: Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

Your welcome. Generally I like to have a dialogue with people rather than have them shut down, deplatformed, and ridiculed. I think the latter is ineffective and childish really.

I agree. I like having polite discourse

The thing about most of the questions presented in that list, is that they are just that: questions. I'm not sure what the answers or lack of answers to many of them have to do with anything or how they point to a larger conspiracy.

It would be helpful to know why these questions are important in the first place. It would also be helpful to see sources before speculating on claims that aren't backed up with evidence.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 1:53 am

Littlelo wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:: Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

Your welcome. Generally I like to have a dialogue with people rather than have them shut down, deplatformed, and ridiculed. I think the latter is ineffective and childish really.

I agree. I like having polite discourse

The thing about most of the questions presented in that list, is that they are just that: questions. I'm not sure what the answers or lack of answers to many of them have to do with anything or how they point to a larger conspiracy.

It would be helpful to know why these questions are important in the first place. It would also be helpful to see sources before speculating on claims that aren't backed up with evidence.

Like any kind of source material that we can draw from.

Like the whole Brenda thing was just a random person lying in a yahooo group yet still people believe it.

I still am also interested in why Sue mentioned in her book that Eric had a book at this house about mind control. I always assumed since it was in an early chapter that she was saying she thought Dylan was duped or tricked so maybe Eric had something to do with it.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 12:22 pm

Screamingophelia wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:: Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

Your welcome. Generally I like to have a dialogue with people rather than have them shut down, deplatformed, and ridiculed. I think the latter is ineffective and childish really.

I agree. I like having polite discourse

The thing about most of the questions presented in that list, is that they are just that: questions. I'm not sure what the answers or lack of answers to many of them have to do with anything or how they point to a larger conspiracy.

It would be helpful to know why these questions are important in the first place. It would also be helpful to see sources before speculating on claims that aren't backed up with evidence.

Like any kind of source material that we can draw from.

Like the whole Brenda thing was just a random person lying in a yahooo group yet still people believe it.

I still am also interested in why Sue mentioned in her book that Eric had a book at this house about mind control. I always assumed since it was in an early chapter that she was saying she thought Dylan was duped or tricked so maybe Eric had something to do with it.

i dont believe that mindcontrol crap but wtf....
did u read the book?& where´s mentioned that?
i dont think the book would be released if there was anything about that...

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 12:52 pm

Rebbie556 wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:: Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

Your welcome. Generally I like to have a dialogue with people rather than have them shut down, deplatformed, and ridiculed. I think the latter is ineffective and childish really.

I agree. I like having polite discourse

The thing about most of the questions presented in that list, is that they are just that: questions. I'm not sure what the answers or lack of answers to many of them have to do with anything or how they point to a larger conspiracy.

It would be helpful to know why these questions are important in the first place. It would also be helpful to see sources before speculating on claims that aren't backed up with evidence.

Like any kind of source material that we can draw from.

Like the whole Brenda thing was just a random person lying in a yahooo group yet still people believe it.

I still am also interested in why Sue mentioned in her book that Eric had a book at this house about mind control. I always assumed since it was in an early chapter that she was saying she thought Dylan was duped or tricked so maybe Eric had something to do with it.

i dont believe that mindcontrol crap but wtf....
did u read the book?& where´s mentioned that?
i dont think the book would be released if there was anything about that...

I read the book and listened to the audiobook. There's one line about it. I'll find the page. I don't believe it either(the mind control) I was saying it was a really random line that was in there.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:41 pm

It's on one of the first pages of chapter 10 "The End of Denial" about the Basement Tapes.

_________________
"And you know, you know, you know, this can be beautiful, you say you're numb inside, but I can't agree. So the world's unfair, keep it locked out there. In here it's beautiful."

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 4:02 pm

I think Sue's TED talk was uploaded by two different channels on YouTube. One has the comments disabled, but the other one doesn't.

I swear it used to have nothing but supportive and understanding comments on it, but when I looked the other day it is filled with hate towards her for believing that Dylan was not an evil monster (to her).

Sue's thoughts on Dylan's involvement and mental state are such polarizing topics.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 4:45 pm

Littlelo wrote:: I think Sue's TED talk was uploaded by two different channels on YouTube. One has the comments disabled, but the other one doesn't.

I swear it used to have nothing but supportive and understanding comments on it, but when I looked the other day it is filled with hate towards her for believing that Dylan was not an evil monster (to her).

Sue's thoughts on Dylan's involvement and mental state are such polarizing topics.

It really is. She's going to still have a memory of the kind and loving Dylan. Even his friends like Nate and Devon still remember him in some positive ways.

I still contend to this day, and I didn't know the boys, that their actions were evil. They were not.

When I mentioned to a friend, who is a mom, that I was going to see Sue speak. She was even like "she raised a killer, what does she have to say?"

She got death threats before the symposium and people walked out before she began speaking.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 4:48 pm

Screamingophelia wrote:

Littlelo wrote:: I think Sue's TED talk was uploaded by two different channels on YouTube. One has the comments disabled, but the other one doesn't.

I swear it used to have nothing but supportive and understanding comments on it, but when I looked the other day it is filled with hate towards her for believing that Dylan was not an evil monster (to her).

Sue's thoughts on Dylan's involvement and mental state are such polarizing topics.

It really is. She's going to still have a memory of the kind and loving Dylan. Even his friends like Nate and Devon still remember him in some positive ways.

I still contend to this day, and I didn't know the boys, that their actions were evil. They were not.

When I mentioned to a friend, who is a mom, that I was going to see Sue speak. She was even like "she raised a killer, what does she have to say?"

She got death threats before the symposium and people walked out before she began speaking.

Wow, that's crazy. I'm sure Kathy has received similar threats and she doesn't even speak publicly. Both of them have been accused up and down of failing to properly raise their kids. To tie into the topic of the thread, I really don't think Eric was emotionally abused.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 5:00 pm

Screamingophelia wrote:

Rebbie556 wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:: Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

Your welcome. Generally I like to have a dialogue with people rather than have them shut down, deplatformed, and ridiculed. I think the latter is ineffective and childish really.

I agree. I like having polite discourse

The thing about most of the questions presented in that list, is that they are just that: questions. I'm not sure what the answers or lack of answers to many of them have to do with anything or how they point to a larger conspiracy.

It would be helpful to know why these questions are important in the first place. It would also be helpful to see sources before speculating on claims that aren't backed up with evidence.

Like any kind of source material that we can draw from.

Like the whole Brenda thing was just a random person lying in a yahooo group yet still people believe it.

I still am also interested in why Sue mentioned in her book that Eric had a book at this house about mind control. I always assumed since it was in an early chapter that she was saying she thought Dylan was duped or tricked so maybe Eric had something to do with it.

i dont believe that mindcontrol crap but wtf....
did u read the book?& where´s mentioned that?
i dont think the book would be released if there was anything about that...

I read the book and listened to the audiobook. There's one line about it. I'll find the page. I don't believe it either(the mind control) I was saying it was a really random line that was in there.

i got the page: "The night before the meeting, Tom and I compiled a list of questions. We were still
convinced that Dylan had either been a reluctant participant or accidentally become
entangled in something bigger than he understood at the time. We’d heard a rumor that
military training materials on brainwashing techniques had been found in the Harris home,
which had refueled our belief that Dylan had been another victim of the tragedy. It was
plausible; Mr. Harris did have a military background. I entertained fantasies that we’d be able
to hold a public memorial service."

-excerpt from a mothers reckoning p.96. chapter 10 The End of Denial

thats crazy though.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 5:05 pm

Littlelo wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Littlelo wrote:: I think Sue's TED talk was uploaded by two different channels on YouTube. One has the comments disabled, but the other one doesn't.

I swear it used to have nothing but supportive and understanding comments on it, but when I looked the other day it is filled with hate towards her for believing that Dylan was not an evil monster (to her).

Sue's thoughts on Dylan's involvement and mental state are such polarizing topics.

It really is. She's going to still have a memory of the kind and loving Dylan. Even his friends like Nate and Devon still remember him in some positive ways.

I still contend to this day, and I didn't know the boys, that their actions were evil. They were not.

When I mentioned to a friend, who is a mom, that I was going to see Sue speak. She was even like "she raised a killer, what does she have to say?"

She got death threats before the symposium and people walked out before she began speaking.

Wow, that's crazy. I'm sure Kathy has received similar threats and she doesn't even speak publicly. Both of them have been accused up and down of failing to properly raise their kids. To tie into the topic of the thread, I really don't think Eric was emotionally abused.

I don't think he was either but I do contend that Eric growing up with Wayne and
Kevin being the stronger more "alpha" men may have made Eric feel inferior. As someone who grew up with a lot of health issues, having surgeries it takes a toll on your psyche. Eric loved and looked up to Kevin but he couldn't be "like" him.

Putting it into 2017 terms, it could have been toxic masculinity and it may not have been anything the family was aware of.

ETA- I am glad you found the excerpt Rebbie. It seemed like an odd thing to put in. Though I kind of get why.. she was thinking of anything that could explain how her son could do this

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 5:11 pm

i can definitely see how his size and medical condition combined with having a dad with a military background and an older brother who was likely praised by his parents could have contributed to an inferiority complex in Eric.

Guest

Screamingophelia wrote:: I don't think he was either but I do contend that Eric growing up with Wayne and
Kevin being the stronger more "alpha" men may have made Eric feel inferior. As someone who grew up with a lot of health issues, having surgeries it takes a toll on your psyche. Eric loved and looked up to Kevin but he couldn't be "like" him.

Putting it into 2017 terms, it could have been toxic masculinity and it may not have been anything the family was aware of.

Completely agree with this. I think Eric thought he had to try to be the Alpha male type, because that's what he considered his dad to be. His brother as well. While he was probably a little jealous of Kevin, he also admired him.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 8:46 pm

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:: I don't think he was either but I do contend that Eric growing up with Wayne and
Kevin being the stronger more "alpha" men may have made Eric feel inferior. As someone who grew up with a lot of health issues, having surgeries it takes a toll on your psyche. Eric loved and looked up to Kevin but he couldn't be "like" him.

Putting it into 2017 terms, it could have been toxic masculinity and it may not have been anything the family was aware of.

Completely agree with this. I think Eric thought he had to try to be the Alpha male type, because that's what he considered his dad to be. His brother as well. While he was probably a little jealous of Kevin, he also admired him.

Exactly.

Eric also surrounded himself and tried to emulate taller and more "edgy and cool" guys I mean.. Chris and Dylan not the coolest of course but they were into the counter culture, Chris had a girlfriend, they were bigger, Dylan cultivated a "stay away from me" vibe with his sunglasses and long hair. Eric was skinny and preppy but didn't fit in with the preps so screw it you know? That's just my opinion.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 9:29 pm

“military training materials on brainwashing techniques had been found in the Harris home”
Could someone please post the list from the searching of Harris home?

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Dec 26, 2017 11:09 pm

Rebbie556 wrote:: “military training materials on brainwashing techniques had been found in the Harris home”
Could someone please post the list from the searching of Harris home?

I don't have time to look through again at the moment but here's a link to start...

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:31 am

Screamingophelia wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:: Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

Your welcome. Generally I like to have a dialogue with people rather than have them shut down, deplatformed, and ridiculed. I think the latter is ineffective and childish really.

I agree. I like having polite discourse

The thing about most of the questions presented in that list, is that they are just that: questions. I'm not sure what the answers or lack of answers to many of them have to do with anything or how they point to a larger conspiracy.

It would be helpful to know why these questions are important in the first place. It would also be helpful to see sources before speculating on claims that aren't backed up with evidence.

Like any kind of source material that we can draw from.

Like the whole Brenda thing was just a random person lying in a yahooo group yet still people believe it.

I still am also interested in why Sue mentioned in her book that Eric had a book at this house about mind control. I always assumed since it was in an early chapter that she was saying she thought Dylan was duped or tricked so maybe Eric had something to do with it.

Rebbie556 wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:: Questionmark

Awesome discussion:) thank you for this

Your welcome. Generally I like to have a dialogue with people rather than have them shut down, deplatformed, and ridiculed. I think the latter is ineffective and childish really.

I agree. I like having polite discourse

The thing about most of the questions presented in that list, is that they are just that: questions. I'm not sure what the answers or lack of answers to many of them have to do with anything or how they point to a larger conspiracy.

It would be helpful to know why these questions are important in the first place. It would also be helpful to see sources before speculating on claims that aren't backed up with evidence.

Like any kind of source material that we can draw from.

Like the whole Brenda thing was just a random person lying in a yahooo group yet still people believe it.

I still am also interested in why Sue mentioned in her book that Eric had a book at this house about mind control. I always assumed since it was in an early chapter that she was saying she thought Dylan was duped or tricked so maybe Eric had something to do with it.

i dont believe that mindcontrol crap but wtf....
did u read the book?& where´s mentioned that?
i dont think the book would be released if there was anything about that...

Littlelo wrote:: I think Sue's TED talk was uploaded by two different channels on YouTube. One has the comments disabled, but the other one doesn't.

I swear it used to have nothing but supportive and understanding comments on it, but when I looked the other day it is filled with hate towards her for believing that Dylan was not an evil monster (to her).

Sue's thoughts on Dylan's involvement and mental state are such polarizing topics.

Well, I'll respond to QuestionMark and Screamingophelia's posts about my questions regarding Columbine. In my opinion, Eric was under MK Ultra and Eric and Dylan both were TI's (targeted individuals) and so I thought I'd respectfully explain why:

Upon relocating to Littleton, Harris received psychiatric treatment for obsessive compulsive disorder (OCO) and depression, and was allegedly prescribed Luvox. This should have been a mind-control red flag to Littleton law enforcement and the district attorney, but was apparently ignored. OCO is a commonly-observed trait among mind-controlled victims, resulting from prolonged trauma-based programming. It sometimes manifests in the need to undergo rigorous physical exercise.

Moreover, although Luvox is an inefficient anti-depressant. It is a very effective synergist to facilitate subliminal thoughts implanted via directed-energy devices. John Quinn on the Newshawk Inc. Website. Quinn claims to have received information from a scientist who was allegedly involved in mind-control activities at Plattsburg Air Force Base, in upstate New York state, where Eric Harris's father - a career Air Force officer, was stationed. This facility, officially closed In 1994, still emits electromagnetic signals from a subterranean source (it purportedly has an eighteen level underground complex).

Now, Plattsburgh AFB has a VAST, 18-level subterranean facility. Plattsburgh AFB closed in 1994, was supposedly completely inoperative and the property due to be "recycled" for various other uses by September 1995. However covert, secret activities still took place at the base after 1995. The peculiarities regarding the text of documents from Eric Harris’s website and the likelihood that father Wayne Harris was connected to not only the documents themselves but ALSO to the activities described therein can not be forgotten.

Local residents and other eyewitnesses report that the base, though somewhat deserted, was still in some level of operation in 1997 even on the "surface," AND that top-secret operations were definitely going on in the documented 18-level underground complex beneath the base. This was verified by EM/RF signal detection equipment. Aside from mind control related operations, the base at Plattsburgh has currently been verified as a site of particle accelerator/beam research and experimentation.

There are indications that in the 1960s Plattsburgh AFB was linked to the horrendous Ewen Cameron, president of the American Psychiatric Association, The Canadian Psychiatric Association AND the World Psychiatric Association, and his massive abuses in the MKULTRA (drug and neuroelectrically-based mind control) Project just over the border in Montreal. Reports indicate that this legacy continued at Plattsburgh through the 70s and beyond with electromagnetic/radio-frequency MK activities tied to some of the experimentation at Montauk.

Mentioned also in "Phoenix Undead" (which was an article by writer, John Quinn) another location for covert operations linked to Montauk’s mind control experimentation, is a base named Stewart Air Force Base in New York, in between Plattsburgh and Montauk. Military facilities at Malta, N.Y. are also strongly tied to MK operations at both Montauk and Plattsburgh.

Now, to Eric Harris and how he's connected to this (MK Ultra and Plattsburgh AFB) - Columbine perpetrator Eric Harris was born in Plattsburgh and spent his whole life there until his family moved to Littleton in 1996. Eric Harris's father was an Air Force pilot stationed at Plattsburgh AFB. Now, it was noted that a girl at Columbine High School said gunman Eric Harris's "eyes were dead." Also Eric Harris was being treated by a psychiatrist and was on Luvox, one of a class of drugs similar to Prozac, which like Prozac has been proven a potentially deadly combination when taken my mentally or emotionally unstable people, at least in certain instances.

What's also interesting is that Eric's psychiatrist was supposedly not only unaware of Eric's violent and blatantly antisocial tendencies but also of the many reports and studies showing the potential for disaster with Luvox and similar drugs when administered to younger people in general. Ewen Cameron, with his inexhaustible supply of connections to the CIA, NSA and other ultra-malevolent intelligence agencies and their equally malevolent agendas, was in fact the president of all the world's major psychiatric associations.

Cameron's successor, the current president of the American Psychiatric Association, felt called upon to issue a public statement on April 30 about the fact that Eric Harris was not only being treated by a psychiatrist who was incomprehensibly ignorant of his propensity for violence but that Eric's psychiatrist had also prescribed the mind-altering drug Luvox for Eric.

The official statement said that there is "little" valid evidence (notice it did NOT say "no" valid evidence) which proves Luvox can precipitate seriously violent outbursts. Regardless of such "official" blather, a plethora of tests and real world experiences have
proven that these drugs, selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors, can be deadly when administered to unstable personalities- especially young people.

It is with certainty that administration of this drug (and very likely others) was one of many programming techniques used to turn Eric Harris into a sociopathic, conscience-less, vicious killer. Additionally the administration of Luvox may very well have been implemented to serve as a "cover" in a way: that is, a convenient explanation for what most human beings would consider inconceivably brutal and inexplicable behavior.

Also, a representative at a website called, Newshawk INC. stated that they located one of Eric's Plattsburgh friends, who allegedly claimed that Eric had complained to him that he had been repeatedly drugged during mind-control activities at Plattsburgh, Air Force base. Also, one researcher/scientist at Plattsburgh Air Force base told an alternative news organization that he was one of the many "guinea pigs" of an MKULTRA-type project being run at the base.

When the Harrises moved to Littleton after Wayne Harris retired from the military, the horror wasn't over. Littleton is close to Denver International Airport (Which Eric even mentions in his Journal), which is rumored to serve as a cover for an underground government complex. While the rumors of an underground complex remain officially unconfirmed (Though a massive amount of evidence shows that they are true), what is a fact is that the airport is shaped like a Swastika, and that inside are bizarre paintings of death, destruction, and despair, as well as cryptic words on the ground and Masonic capstones, as well as a keypad that has no apparent purpose.

Now also here's some comparisons with Eric Harris and MK Ultra:

Eric named one of his pipe bombs DELTA and that's interesting because DELTA is a name for a certain level of MK Ultra mind programming. MK Ultra DELTA Mind programming is known as “killer” programming and was originally developed for training special agents or elite soldiers (i.e. Delta Force, First Earth Battalion, Mossad, etc.) in covert operations. Optimal adrenal output and controlled aggression are evident.

Subjects are devoid of fear and very systematic in carrying out their assignment. Self-destruct or suicide instructions are layered in at this level. “Delta” programming exists to remove fear and ensure that orders are followed until the very last breath. Now the traits/signs of those who are under MK Ultra Delta mind programming are:

* loss of inhibition and fear (Eric didn't have a fear of dying)

* loyalty to “handlers” (which is why it's believed from the transcripts of the basements, that Eric said he had "the greatest fucking parents" because Wayne specifically - but Kathy as well were his handlers, and that's whom he showed loyalty too)

* invoking megalomania “super being” (Eric thought he was "God-like")

Eric specifically (but Dylan as well) talked about how their world had become like a dream, where they couldn’t tell the difference between the dream world and the waking world, and that is a trait of MK Ultra mind control and regular mind control disassociation. Also Eric and Dylan talking about how their world had become like a dream - those are now virtually the same words as Jared Loughner who, in his various ramblings, talked about “sleepwalking” during the day and “conscience dreaming” at other times.

Eric carved into his gun the name "Arlene", many believe it's because that's a name associated with the game "Doom". However, yes it is but more so, the name "Arlene" is associated with MK Ultra mind programming. You see, "Arlene" is the name of an MK Ultra mind controlled personality that can be created within a person. In fact, there was a model named Candy Jones - she was an MK Ultra mind controlled victim and the MK Ultra mind controlled personality of "Arlene" was created within her and that personality turned her into a merciless, psychopathic-like killer (sound familiar to someone involved in Columbine?)

Now, even though Doom is an awesome game, it has been reported that video games like Doom (another one is Polybius) are MK Ultra mind controlled brainwashing games that assist in MK Ultra mind controlled experiments. Now how do they assist? Well because most MK Ultra mind controlled victims who are trained to be killers, often see life as a violent video game, where they must kill their enemies, who they deem evil. In fact, when these MK Ultra mind controlled killers carry out their mission, they do so while thinking that at that point, they're in a violent video game (MK Ultra mind controlled killer James Holmes stated this too, that he felt he was in a violent video game during the shooting).

Now with MK Ultra mind programming, the victim doesn't often know that an alternate, killer personality has been created within them - unless they're told. I believe when Eric and his family came to Colorado and he suspected that he wasn't no longer just being used as a guinea pig for MK Ultra but that now he was being used as an MK Ultra hired assassin, he gean to research MK Ultra (which is why the book on mind control was found in his room). He was trying to discover if he really was an MK Ultra mind controlled - soon to be killer victim, however, Eric had yet to definitely find proof that he was an MK Ultra mind controlled victim (because this was in 98/99 - so before the technology we have today to truly find out things like we can today). Also it was hard for Eric to find definite proof when - through his handler, Wayne, he was bent sent in and out of his MK Ultra mind controlled alternate personality, which was "REB".

Now by Dylan wasn't a victim of MK Ultra but was more so a victim of government gang stalking. One trait/symptom of gang-stalking is depression and suicidal feelings (which is what Dylan felt and talked about in his journal). Being a targeted individual (gang stalking) also can cause mind control.

Through being a TI (targeted individual), the government can:

* Control thoughts and thought patterns; feelings and their expression; behavior control.

* Through being a TI (targeted individual), the government can create hypnotic ”trigger words” that results in specific sensations, feelings or behaviors.

* Induce dreams or manipulation of dreams (sound familiar to someone regarding Columbine?)

Targeted Individuals also become victims of social crimes BY the government such as:

* Fabrication of false evidence that justifies ”Crime prevention” (fabrication of evidence of crime and rumor spreading);

In almost every case, Targeted Individuals are accused of a crime with no chance to defend oneself. This was the case when Eric and Dylan were accused of doing drugs and were pulled out of class and had their persons and their lockers searched (only for school staff and police staff to find no drugs at all). However this was done because Eric and Dylan were targeted individuals by the government.

Targeted individuals are also often accused of being crazy or having a mental illness and are put on mental illness drugs (which is
what happened to both Eric and Dylan, despite neither having any sort of mental illness). Another sign of being a targeted individual
is being BULLIED by your fellow school peers, co-workers and/or others in general. This leads to the targeted individual to feel and be
isolated (such as the case with Eric and Dylan).

Another trait of being a targeted individual is specifically called Gang stalking, which is having rude people in crowds appear and insult the individual(s), using both verbal and non-verbal, physical and non-physical communication). Another trait is having 20 people, or more, strategically placed to - for example - look with a hateful look at the targeted Individual(s).

They appear every time the targeted individual(s) is (or are) outside, and it can take many different expressions. Sometimes it looks like they have some kind of scheme and the harassment follows a pattern, and when it achieves a certain stage, they reset themselves and it starts all over again.

Also targeted individuals are also subjected to increase sexual urges. These urges are increased by the government through gang stalking mind control and this was done specifically in Eric, which is why he had such an increased sexual urge a majority of the time.

So I added some additional links that informs what MK Ultra Mind control is, what being a targeted individual is and so those are my beliefs to what happened with Columbine and Eric and Dylan. Eric was under MK Ultra mind control and both Eric and Dylan were targeted individuals who were subjected to mind control (and also other mental and emotional tortures) because of it and that's why - I believe, the Columbine massacre happened.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Mon Jan 29, 2018 6:19 pm

42099_4EVA wrote:: Rachel Scott's father...Rachel Scott, the same Rachel Scott, who's brother claimed that Rachel had a conversation with Eric and Dylan on 4/20 that went like this:

"What would Jesus do?” says Klebold.

“Do you still believe in God?” asks Harris.

“You know I do,” Rachel answers.

“Then go be with him,” Harris says before firing the fatal shot.

Despite the fact that there was no evidence that such a conversation like that took place, but this conversation was made to make it look like E&D only killed her because she was a christian. Yeah, lol so it's highly unlikely that I'd believe Rachel Scott's dad.

Also, it's not just the basement tapes, there were other pieces of evidence that belonged to Eric and Dylan, such as Eric's microcassette tape labeled "Nixon". Were the victims families' able to view that as well? How about the green steno book found in a desk drawer at Eric's home? The book that belonged to Wayne? He used it to write down various matters concerning his son’s supposed mental health, errant behavior and interactions with neighbors and authorities. Were the families allowed to view that as well?

I doubt it. Like I said, and I'll end it like this. Yes, my opinions are my opinions. It's also the opinions of a lot of people who have thoroughly investigated into the Columbine case. There's a big secret regarding what really happened to Eric and Dylan and regarding the real reason why they committed NBK but as I stated, it's a secret that the public aren't supposed to know about. Only Sue and Tom and Kathy and Wayne can, and of course the victims' families - whom are only allowed to present forth the truth that the government wants people to believe regarding Eric and Dylan.

However it is what it is. People believe what they choose for their minds to believe.

idk what they tried to reach with the movie, Im not ashamed ,but some informations are incorrect that dylan,eric&rachel were in same class is just horsebull.they didnt know her,neither said a word to her . smh... and i was not surprised that the trailer of the movie was down on Youtube.

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:28 pm

42099_4EVA wrote:: Now by Dylan wasn't a victim of MK Ultra but was more so a victim of government gang stalking. One trait/symptom of gang-stalking is depression and suicidal feelings (which is what Dylan felt and talked about in his journal). Being a targeted individual (gang stalking) also can cause mind control.

Through being a TI (targeted individual), the government can:

* Control thoughts and thought patterns; feelings and their expression; behavior control.

* Through being a TI (targeted individual), the government can create hypnotic ”trigger words” that results in specific sensations, feelings or behaviors.

* Induce dreams or manipulation of dreams (sound familiar to someone regarding Columbine?)

Targeted Individuals also become victims of social crimes BY the government such as:

* Fabrication of false evidence that justifies ”Crime prevention” (fabrication of evidence of crime and rumor spreading);

In almost every case, Targeted Individuals are accused of a crime with no chance to defend oneself. This was the case when Eric and Dylan were accused of doing drugs and were pulled out of class and had their persons and their lockers searched (only for school staff and police staff to find no drugs at all). However this was done because Eric and Dylan were targeted individuals by the government.

Targeted individuals are also often accused of being crazy or having a mental illness and are put on mental illness drugs (which is
what happened to both Eric and Dylan, despite neither having any sort of mental illness). Another sign of being a targeted individual
is being BULLIED by your fellow school peers, co-workers and/or others in general. This leads to the targeted individual to feel and be
isolated (such as the case with Eric and Dylan).

Another trait of being a targeted individual is specifically called Gang stalking, which is having rude people in crowds appear and insult the individual(s), using both verbal and non-verbal, physical and non-physical communication). Another trait is having 20 people, or more, strategically placed to - for example - look with a hateful look at the targeted Individual(s).

They appear every time the targeted individual(s) is (or are) outside, and it can take many different expressions. Sometimes it looks like they have some kind of scheme and the harassment follows a pattern, and when it achieves a certain stage, they reset themselves and it starts all over again.

Also targeted individuals are also subjected to increase sexual urges. These urges are increased by the government through gang stalking mind control and this was done specifically in Eric, which is why he had such an increased sexual urge a majority of the time.

I'd recommend watching this video on gang stalking and the kinds of people who believe in it.

_________________
"My guns are the only things that haven't stabbed me in the back."
-Kip Kinkel

Subject: Re: Eric emotional abuse ? Tue Feb 06, 2018 5:58 pm

Basically children fully or partially reflecting the attitude of their parents towards them. Habits, figure of speech, tone of voice is representing family atmosphere. If parent yelling on child there is a huge possibility that child will be do the same, especially in the age of puberty, when it's not so easy to control your emotions. So I do think that Eric had an emotional abuse. But to be honest alot of kids more or less had it in their life.

_________________
"I'm having an old friend for dinner."
(с)The Silence of the Lambs, 1991

Guest

Jea wrote:: Basically children fully or partially reflecting the attitude of their parents towards them. Habits, figure of speech, tone of voice is representing family atmosphere. If parent yelling on child there is a huge possibility that child will be do the same, especially in the age of puberty, when it's not so easy to control your emotions. So I do think that Eric had an emotional abuse. But to be honest alot of kids more or less had it in their life.

I agree with you. But I really don't consider normal yelling as abuse. It really all depends on the type of yelling and the things being yelled.

My family is a very loud mouthed bunch. We argue and yell. BUT I can honestly say that I had a great childhood. I never felt like I was being abused when I was yelled at by my parents. Yet again this would all depend on what was being said.

If Eric's father was yelling at him in a way that hurt his feelings and made him feel ashamed of himself, or if he was just completely verbally destroyed with this yelling then YES I would say that would be emotional abuse.

Although we only have Eric saying that his parents were the greatest and that he loved them. You would think that if he was being screamed at all the time that he would have mentioned it somewhere. The only time it was really talked about was on that paperwork.

» Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold and animal abuse.
» Did they abuse animals?
» E n D's animal abuse
» Dispelling the Animal Abuse Myths
» EDIT: Does Eric get a bad rap? (Was: I have a pro-Eric bias)