Evangelical Christian Reactions

So I've read a lot about the evangelical Christian response the the shooting and I've always found it pretty appalling. I wanted to get other peoples thoughts on the subject. While I feel horrible for all of the parents and couldn't imagine going through that I cant agree at with the Scott and bernall family actions (and those of the congregations) after the shooting. I have nothing against religion and am myself catholic, however I can stand it when people have to jam their beliefs down your throat, and this is even worse considering that they exploit a tragedy using false information to further their own agenda. Rachel Scott was NOT killed for her religious beliefs and cassie Bernall was NOT asked about her belief in God. I understand that information early on was sketchy at best so initial belief in the stories is understandable, however the books and movies came out well after the truth and come out. It's one thing to hold on to a lie to make yourself feel better, it's another to profit off of it. What's worse is the girl that did get questioned about got was attacked by many of these same people and called a liar. Can't have their perfect martyr if the person survives! Thoughts and opinions anyone?

They're loathsome scumbags, driven solely by dogma. Their opinions on anything deserve mockery and scorn.

The Scott family upsets me. I think they started out with good intentions (even if it was a lie) they were trying to get the word out to stop these kinds of things, but I Think it is blown up in their faces. They have taken a rumor and spread it as truth. They are making movies about it and expanding that lie to be even bigger. I do not like that they try to make it seem like Rachel was close to the boys or that she tried to save them when its all fake. They even ignore things that Rachel did that were "wrong".

It is annoying but so many people praise them over it I am sure they love all the attention

You could be right that they had started out with good intentions (in their own minds at the very least) but it does certainly seem like the attention has gotten to them. I suspect there was a ton of encouragement coming from their church as pastors LOVED to talk about this and both Rachel and Cassies stories did increase youth participation in these churches. I cant remember the term now but there is a term that evangelical churches like to use to justify the considerable amount of lying that they do to say that it's ok because it brings people to jesus. Besides this kinds of stuff they constantly lie with all the faith healing and the like

Interestingly enough the less crazy religions even started to criticize the evangelical churches about their treatment of Columbine. And as a catholic when the Catholics tell you something is fucked up you KNOW it's fucked up!

Yes, I mean which father of one of the victims claimed to be a "christian", but couldn't forgive Sue Klebold. I forgot his name, but I think I've seen his interviews. He's a real "jesus" follower.

bradt93 wrote:

Yes, I mean which father of one of the victims claimed to be a "christian", but couldn't forgive Sue Klebold. I forgot his name, but I think I've seen his interviews. He's a real "jesus" follower.

I think the parents of Kyle, Isaiah, and Danny are were the most vicious towards the klebolds. I’m still completely irritated that Rachel’s mom told Dylan’s mom pretty much that it was predestined that Dylan was going to kill her daughter. I’m also annoyed at the crush rumor that keeps going on. And how Rachel reached out to him as a friend, with no proof. Before that Dylan had friends a lot of people genuinely liked him. Maybe Rachel was one of them maybe she wasn’t...

I remember in an interview with Devon she said that it was hard to go to any church that summer if you were friends with Eric and Dylan because they were saying that Jesus forgives except for them, God would send them right to hell. And then all the hatred they wrote on their crosses.

Then on the other hand you have the friendship between Mr. Sanders daughter and Sue which is proof that forgiveness and healing is possible.

I've come to learn over the years that some of the most hateful people are ultra religious many of which are evangelicals and the worst of those tend to be fundys. If you dont agree with them then you get to go right to hell! They are extremely bigoted against the LGBT community to the point where the nazis would have been jealous. They would absolutely like to institute biblical law in a similar manner to Islamic law in many middle eastern countries. I know it shouldn't bother me this much but how can people preach forgiveness and tolerance yet in truth are some of the most hateful people on the planet.... arghhh!!!!!

Screamingophelia wrote:

bradt93 wrote:

Yes, I mean which father of one of the victims claimed to be a "christian", but couldn't forgive Sue Klebold. I forgot his name, but I think I've seen his interviews. He's a real "jesus" follower.

I think the parents of Kyle, Isaiah, and Danny are were the most vicious towards the klebolds. I’m still completely irritated that Rachel’s mom told Dylan’s mom pretty much that it was predestined that Dylan was going to kill her daughter. I’m also annoyed at the crush rumor that keeps going on. And how Rachel reached out to him as a friend, with no proof. Before that Dylan had friends a lot of people genuinely  liked him. Maybe Rachel was one of them maybe she wasn’t...

I remember in an interview with Devon she said that it was hard to go to any church that summer if you were friends with Eric and Dylan because they were saying that Jesus forgives except for them, God would send them right to hell. And then all the hatred they wrote on their crosses.

Then on the other hand you have the friendship between Mr. Sanders daughter and Sue which is proof that forgiveness and healing is possible.

I thought Tom Mauser forgave Sue, because her son killed his son Daniel.

I also watched that Sue is close Ann Marie HochHalter. I watched one of her speaking events on YT and she told the audience she and Ann were close or something to that effect.

I will never get involved with a girl who has a overly religious family. They tend to be a little looney.

bradt93 wrote:

I also watched that Sue is close Ann Marie HochHalter. I watched one of her speaking events on YT and she told the audience she and Ann were close or something to that effect.

I believe you are right. I was talking about Danny R.

I sometimes wonder if it’s easier for certain parents to forgive The family and the person who didn’t kill their child. So for Kyle’s parents Dylan is the one that killed him and only Dylan. But then you have someone like Lauren who were shot by both of them.

Sue is a strong person, I can't say the same for Erics parents. They are cowards.

bradt93 wrote:

Sue is a strong person, I can't say the same for Erics parents. They are cowards.

That's horrifically judgmental for you to say.

I find it quite sad that the Scott family and other evangelicals believe that Rachel wasn't depressed and feeling suicidal, despite there being evidence that she was. Instead, they continued to preach about her 'prophetic' element about and leading up to the shootings. However, at the same time, the prophetic element is what allowed them to cope with Rachel's death, so I guess although it was false they had some way to cope.

QuestionMark wrote:

bradt93 wrote:

Sue is a strong person, I can't say the same for Erics parents. They are cowards.

That's horrifically judgmental for you to say.

They have their own reasons for not speaking out.

Tom and Byron never did, Sue was kind of the speaker of the family so to speak.

Many survivors never spoke out either. I think Val did an interview almost 10 years ago, Lisa K never spoke out... they are not cowards.

Do I wanted to hear from the Harris's... do birds fly? Yes! However we don't know the thought process of why they decided not to.

Screamingophelia wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

bradt93 wrote:

Sue is a strong person, I can't say the same for Erics parents. They are cowards.

That's horrifically judgmental for you to say.

They have their own reasons for not speaking out.

Tom and Byron never did, Sue was kind of the speaker of the family so to speak.

Many survivors never spoke out either. I think Val did an interview almost 10 years ago, Lisa K never spoke out...  they are not cowards.

Do I wanted to hear from the Harris's...  do birds fly? Yes! However we don't know the thought process of why they decided not to.

Their reasons for not speaking out are valid. Their committed a horrific tragedy. Sue is very admirable for actually speaking out about the shootings, but she didn't have to. It is completely understandable for people to want to keep quite about the most horrific event in their life. They don't want to relive anything that happened that day, and that does not make them cowards.

That being said, hell yeah it'd be cool if we heard from the Harris family. But that is their decision to make.

bradt93 wrote:

Sue is a strong person, I can't say the same for Erics parents. They are cowards.

For someone who hates bullying you sure like to dish it out yourself. You have no idea why they haven't spoken out stop trying to pretend to know everything they feel and think. Everyone deals with grief differently.

I would be interested in seeing Disne Sawyer interview Kathy though. Because a lot of people commented that she was really kind of snarky to Sue. Her facial expressions were a little smug for lack of a better word, and it’s been a while since I watched it, but Sue really handled the questions gracefully. I loved was she answered I’d wear a trenchcoat I was an art student

Screamingophelia wrote:

I would be interested in seeing Disne Sawyer interview Kathy though. Because a lot of people commented that she was really kind of snarky to Sue. Her  facial expressions were a little smug for lack of a better word, and it’s been a while since I watched it, but Sue really handled the questions gracefully. I loved was she  answered I’d wear a trenchcoat I was an art student

Kathy might fall apart. She seems a bit mousey. I dislike most interviewers with things like this. They have something against the parent of the "wrongdoer" from the start. Sue didn't commit the massacre!

Lizpuff wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

I would be interested in seeing Disne Sawyer interview Kathy though. Because a lot of people commented that she was really kind of snarky to Sue. Her  facial expressions were a little smug for lack of a better word, and it’s been a while since I watched it, but Sue really handled the questions gracefully. I loved was she  answered I’d wear a trenchcoat I was an art student

Kathy might fall apart.  She seems a bit mousey.  I dislike most interviewers with things like this.  They have something against the parent of the "wrongdoer" from the start.  Sue didn't commit the massacre!

I agree, i’m pretty sure in Sue‘s book she mentions about three separate times where Kathy just started weeping.

If the interviewer was critical to Sue who had no idea, remember when she was driving home that day and she thought Dylan was hurt. And that’s the only thing she was thinking. Imagine how critical they would be of Kathy, because from what we understand they had an inkling it could be Eric.

Lizpuff wrote:

bradt93 wrote:

Sue is a strong person, I can't say the same for Erics parents. They are cowards.

For someone who hates bullying you sure like to dish it out yourself.  You have no idea why they haven't spoken out  stop trying to pretend to know everything they feel and think.  Everyone deals with grief differently.  

I don't mean too, I'm just saying why be nervous to speak out? It would give us more insight to Erics life.

bradt93 wrote:

Lizpuff wrote:

bradt93 wrote:

Sue is a strong person, I can't say the same for Erics parents. They are cowards.

For someone who hates bullying you sure like to dish it out yourself.  You have no idea why they haven't spoken out  stop trying to pretend to know everything they feel and think.  Everyone deals with grief differently.  

I don't mean too, I'm just saying why be nervous to speak out? It would give us more insight to Erics life.

Because they don't want to dredge up a set of very bad memories, because they don't want to open themselves up to further harassment from people who blame them for their son's actions, because they just want to move on with their lives and stop being associated with the mass murder of 13 people - what kind of ridiculous question is this? There's every reason not to speak out for them. They gain nothing.

I don't blame the Harris' for not wanting to talk. Eric has been portrayed of the mastermind of the whole thing no matter what they say they will be vilified. They are also accused of missing a lot of warning signs. I will admit there were more signs with Eric but hindsight is 20/20. I used to be a pretty accomplished shoplifter when I was a kid which would have been immediately pointed to as a warning sign had I done something fucked up... but I didn't. It's not difficult to keep your parents in the dark. And the more they know you're on to you the more careful you get.

QuestionMark wrote:

bradt93 wrote:

Sue is a strong person, I can't say the same for Erics parents. They are cowards.

That's horrifically judgmental for you to say.

“They're loathsome scumbags, driven solely by dogma. Their opinions on anything deserve mockery and scorn.”

Hello pot

Trent531 wrote:

QuestionMark wrote:

bradt93 wrote:

Sue is a strong person, I can't say the same for Erics parents. They are cowards.

That's horrifically judgmental for you to say.

“They're loathsome scumbags, driven solely by dogma. Their opinions on anything deserve mockery and scorn.”

Hello pot

Clearly these two statements are equivalent. Clearly judging a family for not speaking out about their son's murder-suicide is equivalent to me criticizing a group of hard headed religious zealots bent on giving free speech a curbstomp because it offends their delicate sensibilities or competes with their viewpoints, consider gay people, opposing religions, and atheists as devils in human clothing that will meet a horrible fate in the fiery pits of Hell, want to force their religion to be practiced in schools, and routinely lie or misrepresent the facts in order to push a narrative as far as they can.

Yeah, you know what, I AM going to judge a group of people who act like that. Sue me.