Why did Eric and Dylan commit suicide in the library?

They could of committed suicide anywhere, why do you think they returned too the library and killed themselves there?

I think they went to library once again to fight with cops and then they just wanted to finish it off.

I think that because the bombing failed they wanted to die amongst their victims to kind of feel closer to what they actually accomplished. Also I think they realized the horror of it would make the suicide easier.

munchkinphone wrote:

I think that because the bombing failed they wanted to die amongst their victims to kind of feel closer to what they actually accomplished. Also I think they realized the horror of it would make the suicide easier.

very good points, agreed.

munchkinphone wrote:

I think that because the bombing failed they wanted to die amongst their victims to kind of feel closer to what they actually accomplished. Also I think they realized the horror of it would make the suicide easier.

I never thought of that. That makes a lot of sense.

ust started to read 11k. Most interesting part of massacre to me is the time between they left the library and back there later to commit suicide. I guess in some way they waited that SWAT team gonna rush the building and probably they gonna to die in shooting. I think after library killing spree they was already bored of killing, and the last part of their plan was to kill themselves, but until you push the trigger you still can change your mind, probably that why they went back and committed suicide near their victims, once again to see the results of their Judgment day and confirm that there is no way back, and for sure they do realized that first place where police gonna shows up - library. But they didn't knew that real cops very far away from movie cops.

My only thought was that they knew the cops were coming and that the end was near. The library looks over the parking lot with a lot of windows. I think they went there to get a better vantage point to shoot at the cops.

Then when they realized that their shots were doing nothing, they committed suicide. Personally I don't believe it had anything to do with being near the victims

Lizpuff wrote:

My only thought was that they knew the cops were coming and that the end was near.  The library looks over the parking lot with a lot of windows.  I think they went there to get a better vantage point to shoot at the cops.

Then when they realized that their shots were doing nothing, they committed suicide.  Personally I don't believe it had anything to do with being near the victims

Seems most likely. They were expecting their bombs to work and for the cops to storm in and take them down in a blaze of glory. They never would’ve guessed it would’ve taken them over three hours to enter

It must have been somewhat nerve-wracking for them, to wonder where the SWAT/cops were and why they hadn;t entered yet. Wonder if some of the shots out of the library window were an attempt to draw them in for a (final) confrontation.

Also I figure that they might have chosen the library for their suicide because that's where the highest death toll was. Whether this was meant to remind them that they'd end up in prison if they didn't do it, or was meant to make them feel success at their biggest source of carnage, or (far less likely, but who knows?) meant to add on to their negative feelings/guilt in retrospect enough to push them over the edge...
Or maybe something had happened there that was never reported, and that's why it became a site of mass slaughter to begin with? :/

levityball wrote:

It must have been somewhat nerve-wracking for them, to wonder where the SWAT/cops were and why they hadn;t entered yet. Wonder if some of the shots out of the library window were an attempt to draw them in for a (final) confrontation.

Also I figure that they might have chosen the library for their suicide because that's where the highest death toll was. Whether this was meant to remind them that they'd end up in prison if they didn't do it, or was meant to make them feel success at their biggest source of carnage, or (far less likely, but who knows?) meant to add on to their negative feelings/guilt in retrospect enough to push them over the edge...
Or maybe something had happened there that was never reported, and that's why it became a site of mass slaughter to begin with?  :/

I think it was Nick B (Rachel's prom date) who said when they were underclassman Zach, Eric, Dylan and him used to hang out in the library a lot and just talk. It was back when they felt like they belonged I guess.

Screamingophelia wrote:

levityball wrote:

It must have been somewhat nerve-wracking for them, to wonder where the SWAT/cops were and why they hadn;t entered yet. Wonder if some of the shots out of the library window were an attempt to draw them in for a (final) confrontation.

Also I figure that they might have chosen the library for their suicide because that's where the highest death toll was. Whether this was meant to remind them that they'd end up in prison if they didn't do it, or was meant to make them feel success at their biggest source of carnage, or (far less likely, but who knows?) meant to add on to their negative feelings/guilt in retrospect enough to push them over the edge...
Or maybe something had happened there that was never reported, and that's why it became a site of mass slaughter to begin with?  :/

I think it was Nick B (Rachel's prom date) who said when they were underclassman Zach, Eric, Dylan and him used to hang out in the library a lot and just talk. It was back when they felt like they belonged I guess.

Huh, that'd make more sense. Thanks for the information, I hadn't heard/had forgotten about this. Wonder what they'd have done if the library had only had one or two people in it?

The library was a place they knew they were free to do what they wanted at the start of the shooting. They probably felt like they could go back and continue to wreak havoc if the cops hadn’t entered the school by then. They also knew they could shoot at the police from the windows from that vantage point.

I just wonder if they both came to that point or if one of them was ready and basically said “ok man, I’m done. Let’s call it a day”

Littlelo wrote:

The library was a place they knew they were free to do what they wanted at the start of the shooting. They probably felt like they could go back and continue to wreak havoc if the cops hadn’t entered the school by then. They also knew they could shoot at the police from the windows from that vantage point.

I just wonder if they both came to that point or if one of them was ready and basically said “ok man, I’m done. Let’s call it a day”

in some testimony was mentioned that someone said "I want to die", and it's was after library shooting, so I guess one of them, probably Dylan, said it's time...

Jea wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

The library was a place they knew they were free to do what they wanted at the start of the shooting. They probably felt like they could go back and continue to wreak havoc if the cops hadn’t entered the school by then. They also knew they could shoot at the police from the windows from that vantage point.

I just wonder if they both came to that point or if one of them was ready and basically said “ok man, I’m done. Let’s call it a day”

in some testimony was mentioned that someone said "I want to die", and it's was after library shooting, so I guess one of them, probably Dylan, said it's time...

More than likely, someone in the cafeteria heard someone yell "I want to kill myself" which I assume was Dylan too.

I thought it was "today is the day I am going to die!" then again my memory isn't so great. I do think Dylan wanted to die. I think Eric was a bit more resistant.

I think you’re right [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Lizpuff wrote:

I thought it was "today is the day I am going to die!"  then again my memory isn't so great.  I do think Dylan wanted to die.  I think Eric was a bit more resistant.  

That's what I always thought, then I read a few sites that said "I want to kill myself" but the Today is the day I am going to die is the one that's most recounted. It makes more sense too...

If he just wanted to kill himself, he could have made an impact by shooting himself in front of his classmates and not hurting anyone else. That would screw people up for a long time.

I remember posting something in another thread about three separate accounts of students hearing someone say “I want to die” and other slight variations. While I remember hearing that the comments were said in the commons, I think they may have also said similar things in the hallway. I’d have to go back and check.

Edit: here they are

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Okay, if it's was a Dylan's voice and he wanted to die so badly, but still shot himself seconds or minute after Eric. Why so? To be sure that Eric will keep his promise?

Jea wrote:

Okay, if it's was a Dylan's voice and he wanted to die so badly, but still shot himself seconds or minute after Eric. Why so? To be sure that Eric will keep his promise?

While that is a good theory, I honestly think Dylan was ready to die and didn’t need Eric to go first, it just happened that way.

Jea wrote:

Okay, if it's was a Dylan's voice and he wanted to die so badly, but still shot himself seconds or minute after Eric. Why so? To be sure that Eric will keep his promise?

This is just purely my opinion here no evidence to back it up but,
I have always thought Eric shooting himself when he did came as a "surprise" to Dylan. I think Dylan was near the tables lighting the cocktail turned around and saw Eric with a gun in his mouth. Then he finished lighting the cocktail knelt down and shot himself.

Could be that he wanted to be sure Eric would do it. We don't know if they ever talked about suicide outside of their plan of suicide by cop or suicide as a way out. So I don't know if Eric ever told Dylan he wanted to die. I do kinda get the feeling Eric did not want to go out the way he did. More that it was fear.

Lizpuff wrote:

Jea wrote:

Okay, if it's was a Dylan's voice and he wanted to die so badly, but still shot himself seconds or minute after Eric. Why so? To be sure that Eric will keep his promise?

This is just purely my opinion here no evidence to back it up but,
I have always thought Eric shooting himself when he did came as a "surprise" to Dylan.  I think Dylan was near the tables lighting the cocktail turned around and saw Eric with a gun in his mouth.  Then he finished lighting the cocktail knelt down and shot himself.  

Could be that he wanted to be sure Eric would do it.  We don't know if they ever talked about suicide outside of their plan of suicide by cop or suicide as a way out.  So I don't know if Eric ever told Dylan he wanted to die.  I do kinda get the feeling Eric did not want to go out the way he did.  More that it was fear.

I think Eric was probably very disappointed on how everything went down and just wanted to end it. I agree about the surprise to Dylan. It always surprised me that Eric went first.

Lizpuff wrote:

I do kinda get the feeling Eric did not want to go out the way he did.  More that it was fear.

Based on his writings and actions that day, I have the impression that Eric wanted to die in a shoot-out with the police.

Lizpuff wrote:

Jea wrote:

Okay, if it's was a Dylan's voice and he wanted to die so badly, but still shot himself seconds or minute after Eric. Why so? To be sure that Eric will keep his promise?

This is just purely my opinion here no evidence to back it up but,
I have always thought Eric shooting himself when he did came as a "surprise" to Dylan.  I think Dylan was near the tables lighting the cocktail turned around and saw Eric with a gun in his mouth.  Then he finished lighting the cocktail knelt down and shot himself.  

Could be that he wanted to be sure Eric would do it.  We don't know if they ever talked about suicide outside of their plan of suicide by cop or suicide as a way out.  So I don't know if Eric ever told Dylan he wanted to die.  I do kinda get the feeling Eric did not want to go out the way he did.  More that it was fear.

I read a lot about suicide, because we all have very strong protection in our conscious, and the instinct of self-preservation responsible for individual surviving. Suicide is separated for true and demonstrative forms. And both of this forms have a different messages but still have the same intention. If to analyze whole information we got, I don't see to much suicidal thoughts in Eric's mind, homicidal but not suicidal, in an opposite of Dylan who had suicide in first place, actually I have feeling that he waited NBK so bad just to kill himself at last. So in summary they influenced each other with quite opposite perspective.
It's just my opinion.

QuestionMark wrote:

Lizpuff wrote:

I do kinda get the feeling Eric did not want to go out the way he did.  More that it was fear.

Based on his writings and actions that day, I have the impression that Eric wanted to die in a shoot-out with the police.

Yea that was the plan. But I think of any way he could have died that day, shooting himself in the face was probably last

Lizpuff wrote:

Jea wrote:

Okay, if it's was a Dylan's voice and he wanted to die so badly, but still shot himself seconds or minute after Eric. Why so? To be sure that Eric will keep his promise?

 I do kinda get the feeling Eric did not want to go out the way he did.  More that it was fear.

Agree. After killing person who did it probably will be in shock and had lot of adrenaline, it's our brain reaction for stressful situation, that's why many of killers usually have zero emotion right after killing for some time. Remorse and understanding coming much later.

Pretty sure they went back to the library to have a shoot out like they had wanted to and the library was a good vantage point.

I'm guessing that with all the smoke etc they were finding it hard to see the cops and for the cops to see them. Deciding that it wasn't going to work and they could have been standing there for ages - possibly with their backs turned to an upcoming SWAT team - who might have captured them without killing them - killing yourself would have been a surer thing.

QuestionMark wrote:

Lizpuff wrote:

I do kinda get the feeling Eric did not want to go out the way he did.  More that it was fear.

Based on his writings and actions that day, I have the impression that Eric wanted to die in a shoot-out with the police.

I get the same impression from his writing, but he could have pursued that route if he really wanted to, right? I mean, he knew where the cops were. All he had to do was go towards them. Unless he was worried about getting caught.

I think at the end Eric was a dog stuck in a corner. He had nowhere else to turn and go. I think suicide by cop was also scary.

I have tried to put myself in that position a few times and terrify myself each time

Lizpuff wrote:

I think at the end Eric was a dog stuck in a corner.  He had nowhere else to turn and go.  I think suicide by cop was also scary.  

I have tried to put myself in that position a few times and terrify myself each time

I can agree with this. I think it’s hard for us to say either of them “chickened out” on anything that day since they both basically put their plan into action and went through with what they wanted to the best of their ability (minus the bombs in the commons), but we have a hard time saying Eric was scared of dying by police fire. I think it’s a completely plausible scenario.

Lizpuff wrote:

I think at the end Eric was a dog stuck in a corner.  He had nowhere else to turn and go.  I think suicide by cop was also scary.  

I have tried to put myself in that position a few times and terrify myself each time

it's because you try to see all situation from position of normal person who has a good instinct of self-preservation, but if to imagine that your emotional range is near the 0 at exact moment, and you don't have a fear, because usually sense of fear could be blocked with adrenaline, then suicide could not to scary at all.

I can't imagine being Dylan and turning around seeing someone I was very close to blow their head off, and maybe not even saying goodbye before doing it.

While Dylan was very fucked up that day and barely himself, i do think it really got to him seeing Eric dead by suicide.

The whole thing from start to finish was a tragedy and it's just one of those days you really understand how bad it was.

23september wrote:

I can't imagine being Dylan and turning around seeing someone I was very close to blow their head off, and maybe not even saying goodbye before doing it.

While Dylan was very fucked up that day and barely himself, i do think it really got to him seeing Eric dead by suicide.

The whole thing from start to finish was a tragedy and it's just one of those days you really understand how bad it was.

I agree.

That day they were Reb and VoDkA... and they forgot their humanity but Dylan was there somewhere and seeing his best/good friend since 7th/8th grade with his face blown off had to illicit some emotion. I'm not saying they had a dramatic goodbye or Dylan got weepy,heck no, but I'm sure they said something OR during their chill time at Clement park , maybe they said their goodbyes there?

and enjoyed their snickers last time or cigarette.

Screamingophelia wrote:

23september wrote:

I can't imagine being Dylan and turning around seeing someone I was very close to blow their head off, and maybe not even saying goodbye before doing it.

While Dylan was very fucked up that day and barely himself, i do think it really got to him seeing Eric dead by suicide.

The whole thing from start to finish was a tragedy and it's just one of those days you really understand how bad it was.

I agree.

That day they were Reb and VoDkA... and they forgot their humanity but Dylan was there somewhere and seeing his best/good friend since 7th/8th grade with his face blown off had to illicit some emotion. I'm not saying they had a dramatic goodbye or Dylan got weepy,heck no,  but I'm sure they said something OR during their chill time at Clement park , maybe they said their goodbyes there?

I don’t think Dylan could have in any way prepared himself for the sight of his best friend killing himself. I wonder what Eric would have done if Dylan had shot himself first, seeing that he did not die immediately and was essentially choking on his own blood.

Jea wrote:

and enjoyed their snickers last time or cigarette.

No snickers in their stomachs. Just pop and carbs.... LOL

Littlelo wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

23september wrote:

I can't imagine being Dylan and turning around seeing someone I was very close to blow their head off, and maybe not even saying goodbye before doing it.

While Dylan was very fucked up that day and barely himself, i do think it really got to him seeing Eric dead by suicide.

The whole thing from start to finish was a tragedy and it's just one of those days you really understand how bad it was.

I agree.

That day they were Reb and VoDkA... and they forgot their humanity but Dylan was there somewhere and seeing his best/good friend since 7th/8th grade with his face blown off had to illicit some emotion. I'm not saying they had a dramatic goodbye or Dylan got weepy,heck no,  but I'm sure they said something OR during their chill time at Clement park , maybe they said their goodbyes there?

I don’t think Dylan could have in any way prepared himself for the sight of his best friend killing himself. I wonder what Eric would have done if Dylan had shot himself first, seeing that he did not die immediately and was essentially choking on his own blood.  

That is something to think about. Eric seemed more "there" more than Dylan did. Dylan was putting on a show.

As much as Eric didn't care about watching others die, I venture it would have been hard for Eric to watch Dylan choke on his own blood. I imagine he would have went soon after if Dylan killed himself first.

Follow up....would Eric have shot Dylan to put him out of his misery, seeing that his initial attempt did not automatically kill himself?

Littlelo wrote:

Follow up....would Eric have shot Dylan to put him out of his misery, seeing that his initial attempt did not automatically kill himself?

I honestly think he would.

Also he would have liked the dramatic foreshadowing from Radioactive Clothing when they're in the basement and Eric goes "I found a victim" and he's barely hanging on and Dylan goes "put him out of his misery"

Screamingophelia wrote:

Littlelo wrote:

Follow up....would Eric have shot Dylan to put him out of his misery, seeing that his initial attempt did not automatically kill himself?

I honestly think he would.

Also he would have liked the dramatic foreshadowing from Radioactive Clothing when they're in the basement and Eric goes "I found a victim" and he's barely hanging on and Dylan goes "put him out of his misery"

Just IMAGINE all the conspiracy theories that would have come, had that actually happened

Screamingophelia wrote:

Jea wrote:

and enjoyed their snickers last time or cigarette.

No snickers in their stomachs. Just pop and carbs.... LOL

Do you know what Eric bought in store that day at 9AM?

Jea wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Jea wrote:

and enjoyed their snickers last time or cigarette.

No snickers in their stomachs. Just pop and carbs.... LOL

Do you know what Eric bought in store that day at 9AM?

I think it was earlier (7 am) and it was the propane tanks.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Jea wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Jea wrote:

and enjoyed their snickers last time or cigarette.

No snickers in their stomachs. Just pop and carbs.... LOL

Do you know what Eric bought in store that day at 9AM?

I think it was earlier (7 am) and it was the propane tanks.

there was information from store owner that time on cameras in store was wrong. but I still reading 11k and it's gonna take some time, there should be testimony from store owner too, I guess.
Tnx for information :

Jea wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Jea wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Jea wrote:

and enjoyed their snickers last time or cigarette.

No snickers in their stomachs. Just pop and carbs.... LOL

Do you know what Eric bought in store that day at 9AM?

I think it was earlier (7 am) and it was the propane tanks.

there was information from store owner that time on cameras in store was wrong. but I still reading 11k and it's gonna take some time, there should be testimony from store owner too, I guess.
Tnx for information :

You're welcome

The time being wrong is actually something I didn't catch so thank YOU!

Littlelo wrote:

Follow up....would Eric have shot Dylan to put him out of his misery, seeing that his initial attempt did not automatically kill himself?

I would hope so, but there's a good chance that he might freeze up and not know what to do.

I think they an hero'd in the library in an attempt to confuse investigators. They had molitovs and crickets found all around them, so I think they wanted to charr their corpses to muddy the waters of who was who for the cops once they inevitably entered.

fishbulb wrote:

I think they an hero'd in the library in an attempt to confuse investigators. They had molitovs and crickets found all around them, so I think they wanted to charr their corpses to muddy the waters of who was who for the cops once they inevitably entered.

See my thread[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]for several reasons to agree with that.

They use their last bombs on themselves. The final molotov was not a shooting timer or a ritual, but to light the fuses. Hence they were not "booby traps" for police as nothing was left to light them.

They were in the library saying it was going to explode. With both themselves and the victims, they (attempt to) use just bombs for suicide in the cafeteria, but use bombs and their guns in the library.

"It was not (just) a shooting; it was a failed bombing" applies to the murders and the suicides, and it explains why it had to be a suicide mission.

It also explains the 15 crosses, the almost immediate confusion of the perps for victims.  They confused "researchers" instead.

Several things I'm not sure another theory even tries to answer.

And about 90% of the objections are just people who have trouble separating what was envisioned from what happened. It's like that joke "But I did have breakfast this morning"  Stuff like "but we see their faces on the surveillance" - as if pretending everyone knew their faces [they didn't] doesn't contradict the whole "outcast" story, and as if the cameras were supposed to be intact instead of bombed twice over.