Was Eric an incel?

In his journal he says

"Women, you will always be under men. It’s been seen throughout nature, males are almost always doing the dangerous shit while the stay back. It’s your animal instincts, deal with it or commit suicide, just do it quick. That’s all for now. 5/20/98"

a few pages on he says

"The fact that I have practically no self-esteem, especially concerning girls and looks and such."

then he talks about his aggressive fantasies with the girls from his gym class.

These three traits all match up with being an incel; misogynistic, no self-esteem or confidence with females or looks and extreme fantasies about females. (he talked about throwing them in a room and fuckin like an animal and stuff)

would he be an involuntary celibate then damn

In this sense, both him and Dylan were.

Not like the term was used back then and certainly they didn't yet identify as such.

eyutytuheu wrote:

In his journal he says

"Women, you will always be under men. It’s been seen throughout nature, males are almost always doing the dangerous shit while the stay back. It’s your animal instincts, deal with it or commit suicide, just do it quick. That’s all for now. 5/20/98"

a few pages on he says

"The fact that I have practically no self-esteem, especially concerning girls and looks and such."

then he talks about his aggressive fantasies with the girls from his gym class.

These three traits all match up with being an incel; misogynistic, no self-esteem or confidence with females or looks and extreme fantasies about females. (he talked about throwing them in a room and fuckin like an animal and stuff)

would he be an involuntary celibate then damn

Technically yes but I have no doubt in my mind that if Eric ever heard of what an incel is he'd claim he was nothing like one of them.

No, I think he was pretty normal in that aspect.

Most teenagers at boys and girls are in voluntarily celibate at that age. They all want to get laid, Hormones are out of control. Females can also want to get laid and can be involuntarily celibate too. Guys act like they would sleep with any girl but that’s not true.

This thread seems awfully familiar

Jollyhelpful wrote:

This thread seems awfully familiar

I knew it was familiar to another topic when i first saw it.

I think Dylan counts more of an incel then Eric.

Tommy QTR wrote:

I think Dylan counts more of an incel then Eric.

Dylan? No way. He felt guilty about masturbating he didn’t care about getting laid per his writings. Not saying he didn’t want sex though but it didn’t seem like top of mind like Eric
Thank

Screamingophelia wrote:

Tommy QTR wrote:

I think Dylan counts more of an incel then Eric.

Dylan? No way. He felt guilty about masturbating he didn’t care about getting laid per his writings. Not saying he didn’t want sex though but it didn’t seem like top of mind like Eric
Thank

He said multiple times in journal that he wanted love and was envious of Jocks who had girlfriends.

I think it is hard to call anyone under 20 an incel.

Tommy QTR wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Tommy QTR wrote:

I think Dylan counts more of an incel then Eric.

Dylan? No way. He felt guilty about masturbating he didn’t care about getting laid per his writings. Not saying he didn’t want sex though but it didn’t seem like top of mind like Eric
Thank

He said multiple times in journal that he wanted love and was envious of Jocks who had girlfriends.

True. How does that make him in an “incel”

He was a 16 year old boy who wanted a girlfriend...

That’s normal.

I was an incel too up until my early 20’s

Ziamber II wrote:

I think it is hard to call anyone under 20 an incel.

This!!!!!

Screamingophelia wrote:

Tommy QTR wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Tommy QTR wrote:

I think Dylan counts more of an incel then Eric.

Dylan? No way. He felt guilty about masturbating he didn’t care about getting laid per his writings. Not saying he didn’t want sex though but it didn’t seem like top of mind like Eric
Thank

He said multiple times in journal that he wanted love and was envious of Jocks who had girlfriends.

True. How does that make him in an “incel”

He was a 16 year old boy who wanted a girlfriend...

That’s normal.

I was an incel too up until my early 20’s

Most 16 year old boys have had relationships when they're 16, some even have girlfriends at a younger age.

Ziamber II wrote:

I think it is hard to call anyone under 20 an incel.

I think 18 should be the cut off line, most men at least have one relationship by then.

Tommy QTR wrote:

Ziamber II wrote:

I think it is hard to call anyone under 20 an incel.

I think 18 should be the cut off line, most men at least have one relationship by then.

And if not by 22, it's a reason to go on a shooting/stabbing/vehicle ramming spree.

Jollyhelpful wrote:

This thread seems awfully familiar

I came in wondering what happened to my post.

Tommy QTR wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Tommy QTR wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Tommy QTR wrote:

I think Dylan counts more of an incel then Eric.

Dylan? No way. He felt guilty about masturbating he didn’t care about getting laid per his writings. Not saying he didn’t want sex though but it didn’t seem like top of mind like Eric
Thank

He said multiple times in journal that he wanted love and was envious of Jocks who had girlfriends.

True. How does that make him in an “incel”

He was a 16 year old boy who wanted a girlfriend...

That’s normal.

I was an incel too up until my early 20’s

Most 16 year old boys have had relationships when they're 16, some even have girlfriends at a younger age.

Eric had a girlfriend.... Sasha

Everyone is different

eyutytuheu wrote:

In his journal he says

"Women, you will always be under men. It’s been seen throughout nature, males are almost always doing the dangerous shit while the stay back. It’s your animal instincts, deal with it or commit suicide, just do it quick. That’s all for now. 5/20/98"

a few pages on he says

"The fact that I have practically no self-esteem, especially concerning girls and looks and such."

then he talks about his aggressive fantasies with the girls from his gym class.

These three traits all match up with being an incel; misogynistic, no self-esteem or confidence with females or looks and extreme fantasies about females. (he talked about throwing them in a room and fuckin like an animal and stuff)

would he be an involuntary celibate then damn

I think he died a virgin.
If he would've had sexual intercourse, he never would've picked up a gun.
He would've had something good in his life.

Eric was too stubborn, low self-esteem, and nervous to get a meaningful girlfriend, and, compounding matters, he was considered weird by most people in his school.
That likely made things even more challenging. No one wants to be heavily associated with the guy that talks about edgy shit like "Natural Selection"

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

I have watched that vid many, many times and I have to agree with you. Eric was just an awkward kid. In my opinion Mike was 100 times more confident in that footage and it clearly showed.

Absolutely. How many times does he nervously look at his watch, pick at his hands, or touch his face. And when he's spinning the paper ball and it goes in front of Brandi, instead of reaching out and getting it he puts his head down on his hands. After Mike gets it, Eric grabs it back and then when it starts to go in her direction again he tries to bat it back, fumbles it and then nervously checks his watch. Yeah, he was a smooth operator, alright.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

I have watched that vid many, many times and I have to agree with you. Eric was just an awkward kid. In my opinion Mike was 100 times more confident in that footage and it clearly showed.

I Agree with you, Mike's very entertaining and i would've loved to have hung out with him.

I can heavily relate to how Eric interacted with others because it's decently similar to how i interacted with others as a teen (except with less dialogue). I am getting better at being more open and embracing myself.

thelmar wrote:

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

I have watched that vid many, many times and I have to agree with you. Eric was just an awkward kid. In my opinion Mike was 100 times more confident in that footage and it clearly showed.

Absolutely. How many times does he nervously look at his watch, pick at his hands, or touch his face. And when he's spinning the paper ball and it goes in front of Brandi, instead of reaching out and getting it he puts his head down on his hands. After Mike gets it, Eric grabs it back and then when it starts to go in her direction again he tries to bat it back, fumbles it and then nervously checks his watch. Yeah, he was a smooth operator, alright.

I'm a bit wary of using as 25 minute video to determine someone's personality and mannerisms. 

Not saying Eric wasn't awkward or had poor confidence by any means, he himself admitted as much, all I'm saying is don't look into little things like that video too deeply or you'll go nuts from seeing all kinds of different things.

Like others have already mentioned, eighteen-year olds are too young to be considered incels. Furthermore, incels tend to have very poor social skills. Even though Eric exhibited awkward behavior at times, he wasn’t socially incompetent. This might sound cliché, but when I think of an incel, I visualize an overweight male in his early or late thirties who lives in his mother’s basement.

Glamazon wrote:

Like others have already mentioned, eighteen-year olds are too young to be considered incels. Furthermore, incels tend to have very poor social skills. Even though Eric exhibited awkward behavior at times, he wasn’t socially incompetent. This might sound cliché, but when I think of an incel, I visualize an overweight male in his early or late thirties who lives in his mother’s basement.

18 is not too young as most 18 year olds have been in at least 1 relationship by that age, and your visualisation of Incels is completely wrong as the majority of Incels are in their early to mid twenties.

QuestionMark wrote:

thelmar wrote:

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

I have watched that vid many, many times and I have to agree with you. Eric was just an awkward kid. In my opinion Mike was 100 times more confident in that footage and it clearly showed.

Absolutely. How many times does he nervously look at his watch, pick at his hands, or touch his face. And when he's spinning the paper ball and it goes in front of Brandi, instead of reaching out and getting it he puts his head down on his hands. After Mike gets it, Eric grabs it back and then when it starts to go in her direction again he tries to bat it back, fumbles it and then nervously checks his watch. Yeah, he was a smooth operator, alright.

I'm a bit wary of using as 25 minute video to determine someone's personality and mannerisms. 

Not saying Eric wasn't awkward or had poor confidence by any means, he himself admitted as much, all I'm saying is don't look into little things like that video too deeply or you'll go nuts from seeing all kinds of different things.

Agree.  I was mainly comparing Eric to Mike. Mike was always talking, laughing, etc. while Eric was mostly silent. Mike was loud spoken, Eric not so much, etc.

But you are right, it would be hard to take the small amount of footage we have on Eric and 100% say he was this or that. Just my opinion he seemed very awkward when compared to Mike. At least in that video anyway.

Tommy QTR wrote:

Glamazon wrote:

Like others have already mentioned, eighteen-year olds are too young to be considered incels. Furthermore, incels tend to have very poor social skills. Even though Eric exhibited awkward behavior at times, he wasn’t socially incompetent. This might sound cliché, but when I think of an incel, I visualize an overweight male in his early or late thirties who lives in his mother’s basement.

18 is not too young as most 18 year olds have been in at least 1 relationship by that age, and your visualisation of Incels is completely wrong as the majority of Incels are in their early to mid twenties.

A relationship doesn’t automatically equate to sex at that age. Some people are not ready. A lot of high school people I went to school with called a one or two weeks of dating a serious relationship

Screamingophelia wrote:

A lot of high school people I went to school with called a one or two weeks of dating a serious relationship

TRUE! Try months and then years kiddos. THAT is a relationship.

ShadowedGoddess wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

A lot of high school people I went to school with called a one or two weeks of dating a serious relationship

TRUE! Try months and then years kiddos. THAT is a relationship.

Damn straight friend!!

My first relationship lasted seven years. It was probably five years too long... but still.

I worry if people keep putting 17 and 18-year-olds in this box of being an incel because they haven’t dated we are really demonizing kids and setting them up to feel bad. And they have enough to worry about going into their 20s and stuff. They shouldn’t feel bad about those things. Or be pegged as incels

Also you really can’t use a term from today to talk about someone that hasn’t been alive in 20 years. We live in a different time.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Tommy QTR wrote:

Glamazon wrote:

Like others have already mentioned, eighteen-year olds are too young to be considered incels. Furthermore, incels tend to have very poor social skills. Even though Eric exhibited awkward behavior at times, he wasn’t socially incompetent. This might sound cliché, but when I think of an incel, I visualize an overweight male in his early or late thirties who lives in his mother’s basement.

18 is not too young as most 18 year olds have been in at least 1 relationship by that age, and your visualisation of Incels is completely wrong as the majority of Incels are in their early to mid twenties.

A relationship doesn’t automatically equate to sex at that age. Some people are not ready. A lot of high school people I went to school with  called a one or two weeks of dating a serious relationship

We're not talking about sex though, it's a common misconception that's the only thing Incels want. Not being in a relationship by 18 is not considered normal by today's standards, hell boys who haven't had a girlfriend by 16 are called freaks by the people around them.

Did Elliot Rodger invent the term incel?

Ziamber II wrote:

Did Elliot Rodger invent the term incel?

It was created in 1993 by a Canadian woman

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Tommy QTR wrote:

We're not talking about sex though, it's a common misconception that's the only thing Incels want. Not being in a relationship by 18 is not considered normal by today's standards, hell boys who haven't had a girlfriend by 16 are called freaks by the people around them.

What are you basing this on? It's been a decade since I was in high school, but I have to doubt things have changed that much. When I was 16, most of the guys had never had girlfriends. When I was 18, most of the guys had never had girlfriends. No one ever got made fun of for never having a girlfriend. I grew up in suburbia where the focus was on going to college, so that might color my experience. We envied the people fucking in the parking lot during lunch, but we also had stuff to study for.

More generally: every guy in high school wants a girlfriend, has fantasies, and is jealous of other guys who have girlfriends. They're not "incels." It's normal.

curious2017 wrote:

Tommy QTR wrote:

We're not talking about sex though, it's a common misconception that's the only thing Incels want. Not being in a relationship by 18 is not considered normal by today's standards, hell boys who haven't had a girlfriend by 16 are called freaks by the people around them.

What are you basing this on? It's been a decade since I was in high school, but I have to doubt things have changed that much. When I was 16, most of the guys had never had girlfriends. When I was 18, most of the guys had never had girlfriends. No one ever got made fun of for never having a girlfriend. I grew up in suburbia where the focus was on going to college, so that might color my experience. We envied the people fucking in the parking lot during lunch, but we also had stuff to study for.

More generally: every guy in high school wants a girlfriend, has fantasies, and is jealous of other guys who have girlfriends. They're not "incels." It's normal.

If you ask the majority of 18 year olds if they've been in a relationship, they're going to say yes. Just because you never experienced doesn't mean it never happened, I was constantly mocked and teased in School for not having a girlfriend, not only by the boys but girls as well. People who are outside the social norm are going to be bullied and ostracised by their peers.