Why is bullying such a sore subject?

Throughout my research I find this is a HUGE point of contention regarding whether or not Eric and Dylan were bullied. Is it because of early reports that it was the main reason? It seems like there is a lot of "well, they didn't write about it, so it didn't happen" or "this person who didn't know them said they weren't, so they weren't"

There's bullying in general in HS and Columbine did have a problem with it, and maybe it was worse than other schools in the area, maybe there wasn't. I wasn't there.

Having friends doesn't automatically mean you cannot be bullied. Others being bullied or not having friends doesn't mean someone else wasn't bullied.

In their journals, which has a lot of posturing towards the end, doesn't mention it much... but to me that means nothing. What do people expect? Once they decided to do this horrible act do people expect they would sit there and cry over being bullied on the BT?

I think they were bullies too and became the biggest bullies on 4/20. A lot of times sadly when you need to exert power or feel like you are being harmed, you'll go after someone you perceive as weaker.

It's also a matter of perception, something that can roll of off someone's back can easily feel awful to someone else. Someone going through that with an already fractured mind can lead to disaster.

It also confuses me as to WHY people get so ticked off when it comes to this topic. You mention anything about bullying and some people lose their ever-loving minds.

Unfortunately, we've gotten to the point wrt crime discourse that any attempt to understand why x perpetrator felt the way they did is viewed as justification. Even worse when someone says something like 'I went through [whatever] and I never killed anyone'.

I've wondered this as well.. I wonder sometimes if it's a knee jerk reaction from someone that knows they've bullied people in the past that automatically want to reject that as a reason for a tragedy (like that horrible columbine podcast).

Bugg wrote:

I've wondered this as well.. I wonder sometimes if it's a knee jerk reaction from someone that knows they've bullied people in the past that automatically want to reject that as a reason for a tragedy (like that horrible columbine podcast).

What podcast?

Confronting Columbine, the host is Amy Over (Evans). She was in the cafeteria and on Eric's hit list.

There is clearly a misconception that plagues the general understanding of immorality in the world. People lack the insight required to realize that the emphasis placed on the catalysts for immoral deeds stems from a preventative philosophy rather than a corrupt one.

What is falsely perceived in the efforts to touch on, let alone elucidate, any form of injustice that Eric and Dylan faced is a desire to downplay the wickedness they displayed at the end of their lives. What the proponents of this viewpoint are opposed to, consciously or unconsciously, is the humanization of killers -- an opposition that is horrendously counterproductive.

On the other hand, there is undoubtedly the problem of attributing too much importance to the bullying or any other factor. After all, Eric and Dylan deserve most, or at least a considerable portion, of the blame.

There is just a striking incompetence with which people approach these crucial topics, which crystalizes in a severe lack of nuance dedicated to them.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Throughout my research I find this is a HUGE point of contention regarding whether or not Eric and Dylan were bullied. Is it because of early reports that it was the main reason? It seems like there is a lot of "well, they didn't write about it, so it didn't happen" or "this person who didn't know them said they weren't, so they weren't"

There's bullying in general in HS and Columbine did have a problem with it, and maybe it was worse than other schools in the area, maybe there wasn't. I wasn't there.

Having friends doesn't automatically mean you cannot be bullied. Others being bullied or not having friends doesn't mean someone else wasn't bullied.

Bullying in CHS was extraordinary. According to Brooks Brown, some people have changed schools and CHS was the worst they went too. Also joking about shooting up the school was common in Eric's and Dylan's social circles so it's not like they had unique sentiments about it.
The thing is that homicidal ideation when faced with chronic bullying is super common. It's just that all these "I'm an empath uwu" types are projecting their uncommon experience of not wanting to inflict pain back on their enemies on people in general. They think you need to be some kind of a special bad person to want to harm your enemies.

Also, one thing thre people don't get is that being outcasts refers to being "third class citizens" at school, not being completely alone. Their social circles were bullied too. Wasn't one of the girls slammed into a locker and called a lesbian for hanging out with Eric and Dylan?

Screamingophelia wrote:

In their journals, which has a lot of posturing towards the end, doesn't mention it much... but to me that means nothing. What do people expect? Once they decided to do this horrible act do people expect they would sit there and cry over being bullied on the BT?

And Dylan actually did mention bullying as his main motivation. I think they think that "Our wrath for January incident will be godlike" refers to being arrested for van break in. But it probably refers to being pelted with tampoons drenched with ketchup in cafeteria (wtf it's like something straight out of Carrie).

Screamingophelia wrote:

It's also a matter of perception, something that can roll of off someone's back can easily feel awful to someone else. Someone going through that with an already fractured mind can lead to disaster.

It's much worse. Some surveys about bullying use criteria like "someone was mean to me within last three weeks" to get statistics about how common it is. But when you look closer, chronic bullying near-universally leads to mental health problems. Only minority of students are targeted chronic bullying and often it's because of something like neurodivergence, skin colour, not fitting gender norms (up to stuff like not being a jock or a cheerleader), etc.

Screamingophelia wrote:

It also confuses me as to WHY people get so ticked off when it comes to this topic. You mention anything about bullying and some people lose their ever-loving minds.

"Oh, you're so misinformed. Haven't you heard? Dave Cullen has discovered THE TRUTH about Columbine. Eric was a psychopath and Dylan was a depressed follower."
It's all that grifter's fault.

it's more a question of justification.

Watcher wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Throughout my research I find this is a HUGE point of contention regarding whether or not Eric and Dylan were bullied. Is it because of early reports that it was the main reason? It seems like there is a lot of "well, they didn't write about it, so it didn't happen" or "this person who didn't know them said they weren't, so they weren't"

There's bullying in general in HS and Columbine did have a problem with it, and maybe it was worse than other schools in the area, maybe there wasn't. I wasn't there.

Having friends doesn't automatically mean you cannot be bullied. Others being bullied or not having friends doesn't mean someone else wasn't bullied.

Bullying in CHS was extraordinary. According to Brooks Brown, some people have changed schools and CHS was the worst they went too. Also joking about shooting up the school was common in Eric's and Dylan's social circles so it's not like they had unique sentiments about it.
The thing is that homicidal ideation when faced with chronic bullying is super common. It's just that all these "I'm an empath uwu" types are projecting their uncommon experience of not wanting to inflict pain back on their enemies on people in general. They think you need to be some kind of a special bad person to want to harm your enemies.

Also, one thing thre people don't get is that being outcasts refers to being "third class citizens" at school, not being completely alone. Their social circles were bullied too. Wasn't one of the girls slammed into a locker and called a lesbian for hanging out with Eric and Dylan?

Screamingophelia wrote:

In their journals, which has a lot of posturing towards the end, doesn't mention it much... but to me that means nothing. What do people expect? Once they decided to do this horrible act do people expect they would sit there and cry over being bullied on the BT?

And Dylan actually did mention bullying as his main motivation. I think they think that "Our wrath for January incident will be godlike" refers to being arrested for van break in. But it probably refers to being pelted with tampoons drenched with ketchup in cafeteria (wtf it's like something straight out of Carrie).

Screamingophelia wrote:

It's also a matter of perception, something that can roll of off someone's back can easily feel awful to someone else. Someone going through that with an already fractured mind can lead to disaster.

It's much worse. Some surveys about bullying use criteria like "someone was mean to me within last three weeks" to get statistics about how common it is. But when you look closer, chronic bullying near-universally leads to mental health problems. Only minority of students are targeted chronic bullying and often it's because of something like neurodivergence, skin colour, not fitting gender norms (up to stuff like not being a jock or a cheerleader), etc.

Screamingophelia wrote:

It also confuses me as to WHY people get so ticked off when it comes to this topic. You mention anything about bullying and some people lose their ever-loving minds.

"Oh, you're so misinformed. Haven't you heard? Dave Cullen has discovered THE TRUTH about Columbine. Eric was a psychopath and Dylan was a depressed follower."
It's all that grifter's fault.

You've hit the nail on the head, buddy.

Screamingophelia wrote:

Confronting Columbine, the host is Amy Over (Evans). She was in the cafeteria and on Eric's hit list.

Did she know the two boys at all and if she did, what was their problem with her?

Watcher wrote:

Screamingophelia wrote:

Throughout my research I find this is a HUGE point of contention regarding whether or not Eric and Dylan were bullied. Is it because of early reports that it was the main reason? It seems like there is a lot of "well, they didn't write about it, so it didn't happen" or "this person who didn't know them said they weren't, so they weren't"

There's bullying in general in HS and Columbine did have a problem with it, and maybe it was worse than other schools in the area, maybe there wasn't. I wasn't there.

Having friends doesn't automatically mean you cannot be bullied. Others being bullied or not having friends doesn't mean someone else wasn't bullied.

Bullying in CHS was extraordinary. According to Brooks Brown, some people have changed schools and CHS was the worst they went too. Also joking about shooting up the school was common in Eric's and Dylan's social circles so it's not like they had unique sentiments about it.
The thing is that homicidal ideation when faced with chronic bullying is super common. It's just that all these "I'm an empath uwu" types are projecting their uncommon experience of not wanting to inflict pain back on their enemies on people in general. They think you need to be some kind of a special bad person to want to harm your enemies.

Also, one thing thre people don't get is that being outcasts refers to being "third class citizens" at school, not being completely alone. Their social circles were bullied too. Wasn't one of the girls slammed into a locker and called a lesbian for hanging out with Eric and Dylan?

Screamingophelia wrote:

In their journals, which has a lot of posturing towards the end, doesn't mention it much... but to me that means nothing. What do people expect? Once they decided to do this horrible act do people expect they would sit there and cry over being bullied on the BT?

And Dylan actually did mention bullying as his main motivation. I think they think that "Our wrath for January incident will be godlike" refers to being arrested for van break in. But it probably refers to being pelted with tampoons drenched with ketchup in cafeteria (wtf it's like something straight out of Carrie).

Screamingophelia wrote:

It's also a matter of perception, something that can roll of off someone's back can easily feel awful to someone else. Someone going through that with an already fractured mind can lead to disaster.

It's much worse. Some surveys about bullying use criteria like "someone was mean to me within last three weeks" to get statistics about how common it is. But when you look closer, chronic bullying near-universally leads to mental health problems. Only minority of students are targeted chronic bullying and often it's because of something like neurodivergence, skin colour, not fitting gender norms (up to stuff like not being a jock or a cheerleader), etc.

Screamingophelia wrote:

It also confuses me as to WHY people get so ticked off when it comes to this topic. You mention anything about bullying and some people lose their ever-loving minds.

"Oh, you're so misinformed. Haven't you heard? Dave Cullen has discovered THE TRUTH about Columbine. Eric was a psychopath and Dylan was a depressed follower."
It's all that grifter's fault.

With all the social media now, so you think bullying has decreased, because in 1999; you didn't have all this social media for people to post the bullying they experience online.