I'm questioning brooks conversation with Eric

It just seems rather unlikely that Eric, who was willingly going to kill himself and potentially hundreds of his classmates minutes later would spare this one boy. Furthermore I don't think E&D were that close with Brooks, Sue doesn't even mention him other than him and Dylan being best friends as kids

He probably didn't kill Brooks because he was still getting prepared. If Brooks had approached him just a few minutes later the story would have likely been different imo.

Yeah but I don't think ever even haooened, I think Brooks made it up to seem more involved

His story has stayed consistent for years and there are people who encountered him not long after the shooting started that can probably confirm it. Him wanting to be more involved doesn't really make sense since he was already probably more involved anyway from the online threats Eric made against him and his family.

I agree. I think it happened. As much as he exaggerates this story has been the same since day 1 when he met the two teachers right after it happened.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who doesn't believe Brooks. His story has always struck me as odd.  He just walks out of the school And sees Eric..... Walks over....and when Eric says to "get out of here" he just walks off not questioning it?

Exactly! Brooks (and his whole family) seemed a bit shady to me. The fact that no one else in the smoker's pit saw this conversation happen is suspicious.
And anyway it's not like it's a hard story to make up, tell someone minutes later, and keep telling the same story for years afterwards.

It might not be a hard story to make up. But it is incredibly difficult to keep a lie like that going when you are under a lot of stress and being interviewed by law enforcement for probably long periods of time. And the story has by and large stayed consistent despite that and the years since. I don't see what Brooks stand to gain from making it up either.

You said it yourself: being interviewed. Attention, that's his gain.

Well he obviously saw Eric considering he brought up the bags he took out of his trunk. I mean he knew what Eric had on and him unloading.
The only thing that could either be a truth or a lie is the conversation. But for me, I feel that he isn't lying.

pisada wrote:

It might not be a hard story to make up. But it is incredibly difficult to keep a lie like that going when you are under a lot of stress and being interviewed by law enforcement for probably long periods of time. And the story has by and large stayed consistent despite that and the years since. I don't see what Brooks stand to gain from making it up either.

Brooks had a lot to gain from it, actually. Attention. And he got a lot and still gets a lot of attention for it. Of course everyone wanted to talk to him because he was supposedly the last person to talk to Eric before the massacre. Brooks got TV interviews, his parents got interviews. Brooks was apart of several Columbine related documentaries. And not to mention, the main reason I think he as well as Cleaning Columbine still carry on about Columbine all these years later, attention from the fans.

I mean why else would both of them go onto Reddit to do a 'Ask me anything' and post pictures of themselves all over social media? It's for the attention. And both of them have been in scandals with fangirls. A lot of people say they don't believe the Brooks scandal but I do. And I don't buy anything he ever has to say. Not one thing. He's a known liar and I believe the one and only reason he ever talked about Columbine publicly was for attention.

I am curious if there is an audio recording of Brooks' 911 call out there. If he left out the part of encountering Eric in the parking lot, it can be debated he lied.

My suspicion is that Brooks did speak to Eric in the parking lot, might have seen something, but would not be in any position to change anything lest he put himself in danger. I agree that his story is very simple and easy to maintain.

Are any of you suspicious that some of E&D friends knew significantly more than they let on? Or perhaps some knew just enough to skip school or leave at the right time? If so, who? And what? It's also possible friends were cleverly lied to in order to keep them away.

Many of the absences and cutting of classes by close friends seem convenient; especially considering NBK was apparently pushed back a day. The delay complicates matters if E&D specifically planned a date/time when they knew certain friends would be safe. I have a particularly hard time believing that E&D would have risked blowing up certain close friends like Robyn, Nate, Chris, Cory, Zach, etc.

(I apologize if this has been covered. I'm new to the forum.)

Can someone tell me who or what Cleaning Columbine is?

Justjenna wrote:

Can someone tell me who or what Cleaning Columbine is?

We don't say that name here...

The timeline seems off by alot. He was out smoking, saw Eric pull up and unload bags, Eric told him to leave, he did, minutes later he was within earshot to hear the first gunshots. The two bombs were planted at 10:59 and 11:00 am, meaning that they where there even before 11'o clock. The shooting started 20 minutes later, I find it hard to believe that he was still close enough to hear the shots if he indeed left right after speaking to Eric. The only explanation would be that they planted the bombs, then left, then came back again at 11:15, give or take.

Cleaning Columbine is some Youtube channel where they try to post higher-quality versions of various Columbine videos from over the years....could someone let me in on why we "don't say that name here"? What'd they do?

Yea, what's so wrong with cleaning columbine? He has some great points.

TheSpiral wrote:

The only explanation would be that they planted the bombs, then left, then came back again at 11:15, give or take.

This part has always puzzled me.  They had so little time after planting the bombs. Leaving the school and coming back is odd.  

I agree that Brooks' timeline is troublesome. It honestly makes me question whether or not he knew something was going to go down. He must have started his first cigarette around 10:55. -_-

From what I gather Cleaning Columbine steals stuff from this forum without permission and without telling his viewers where he got the information from. There may be other things but Ivan and Jenn do not want anything posted on him on this board. There is a message about it in one of the forum sections here

According to Dylan's "to do" list for the day of the massacre, they were going to walk into the Cafeteria at 11:09 AM and set the bombs. Then they were going to get in their cars and drive to Clement Park to "gear up".

What I think happened was, they decided to come early because planting the bombs at 11:09, driving to the park, gearing up and trying to get back by 11:15 would be cutting it close. As we now know, they actually planted the bombs at 10:59 and 11:00 AM. I think then they went to their cars, drove to the park, got ready and drove back. Eric pulled up right around 11:15.

It would make sense they wanted to go somewhere more secluded to gear up. They were not going to walk the bags into the Cafeteria with ammo belts on, knives on their belts and whatever else they were wearing and they weren't gonna stand in the school parking lot putting all that stuff on. They went to the park to do that. Then they drove back to Columbine.

According to Brooks he saw Eric drive up. If Brooks is telling the truth then he saw Eric the 2nd time he pulled into Columbine, not the first time. He talked to Brooks right around 11:15 and told him to get his ass outta there. Around 4 minutes later, they started shooting. If Brooks was taking his good ole time walking home and smoking a cigarette, he would have definitely heard gunshots. How far can you get in 4 minutes anyway? And that's saying he started walking at 11:15. He probably didn't actually start walking until 11:17 or so.

Jenn wrote:

According to Brooks he saw Eric drive up. If Brooks is telling the truth then he saw Eric the 2nd time he pulled into Columbine, not the first time. He talked to Brooks right around 11:15 and told him to get his ass outta there. Around 4 minutes later, they started shooting.

Do you think Brooks saw something? Eric was very heavily armed at 11:15.

runreilly wrote:

Jenn wrote:

According to Brooks he saw Eric drive up. If Brooks is telling the truth then he saw Eric the 2nd time he pulled into Columbine, not the first time. He talked to Brooks right around 11:15 and told him to get his ass outta there. Around 4 minutes later, they started shooting.

Do you think Brooks saw something?  Eric was very heavily armed at 11:15.

Well Brooks mentioned that Eric had his coat on and that it looked bulky and that he was lifting what appeared to be heavy bags out of his car. He also mentioned that Eric was not wearing his hat which he always wore. So I think he knew something was up. I don't know that he saw any guns or knives but he did see that things were somewhat amiss.

Why would he though spare his life? I know they had issues with each other, but were they friends at all and what about Dylan telling that guy "John" who he knew and saw under the desk in the library "to get out of here" I remember the quote from what people said about it, John: "Are you going to kill me"? Dylan: "No man, get out of here" go!!!!!

Do you all think maybe they had an epiphany, like you know "what the hell did we just do" or something like that?

It makes perfect sense for Eric to have let Brooks go.
You have to consider that at the point Brooks spoke to Eric they were still waiting for the bombs to go off. If Eric had shot Brooks right there people would've run in all sorts of directions including out of the cafeteria which would've made the bombs nearly pointless.

I have no doubt that Brooks had an interaction with Eric and that Eric told him to go home. Eric would not have wanted Brooks hanging around talking to him while he was trying to get his guns sorted etc.
Whether Eric told Brooks that he liked him now, well that's the only part of the story which could possibly be a lie.

I feel like Eric would have shot brooks on the spot.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] I disagree, if only because it would have messed up their plan. Eric was very methodical and had planned for a year. I doubt he wanted to let shooting Brooks Brown ruin his plot. Think about it, if he'd shot Brooks on sight, he may not have had time to plant his bombs before school security caught him. He may even have been taken alive.

brooks was just really lucky for being there.

Justjenna wrote:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] I disagree, if only because it would have messed up their plan. Eric was very methodical and had planned for a year. I doubt he wanted to let shooting Brooks Brown ruin his plot. Think about it, if he'd shot Brooks on sight, he may not have had time to plant his bombs before school security caught him. He may even have been taken alive.

For the timeline to make sense, the bombs were already dropped off in the Cafeteria by the time Eric saw Brooks. Of course I don't know 100% what happened, but I'm almost certain that Eric left his bomb at 10:59 and then Dylan left his bomb at 11:00. Then they got into their cars, drove across the street to the park to "gear up" and then they drove back to Columbine and as Eric pulled in at 11:15, Brooks was coming outside and saw him. According to Brooks, he talked to Eric briefly, Eric told him to leave and as he started walking down the street, he heard gunshots.

The timeline just doesn't add up if Brooks ran into Eric as he was walking in with the bomb. For that to have happened, Brooks would have had to see Eric before 10:59 AM. If he started walking home at 10:59, he would have been long gone 20 minutes later when the shooting started. And there were witnesses who said they saw Brooks walking down the street when the shooting started.

Personally, I think people get confused because 1. They are under the impression that the boys planted the bombs at 11:09 because that's what they wrote down and because, up until recently, everyone thought the boys were not caught on the security tape that cut off at 11:14. Up until [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] proved that the boys were caught on the tape at 10:59 and 11:00 we all thought the boys walked in AFTER 11:14 and that Brooks caught Eric as he was walking in with the bomb. Eric took the bomb in a lot earlier than we thought, 15 minutes earlier. 15 minutes is a lot of time. It just doesn't add up that Brooks saw him as he was taking the bomb in.

And the other reason I think people get confused is because Brooks says he saw Eric with a duffel bag. Well, they used more than the 2 bags they put the bombs in. They had bags with pipe bombs, Molotov's and ammo. That is most likely what Brooks saw Eric carrying. Not the bag with the bomb.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] that makes a lot of sense.

I'd like to get a look at Brooks' school schedule to see whether it made sense for him to be outside of class at that time, smoking.

Why do you think Eric didn't shoot Brooks?

Also, Eric was not wearing his duster when he planted the bombs. He was wearing the plaid shirt referenced in the goodbye tape and seen in the footage of him buying the propane tanks earlier that morning. Liz pointed out that "Brooks mentioned that Eric had his coat on and that it looked bulky." This most likely means that the bombs had been planted, E&D had already geared up in Clement Park, and the time was roughly 11:15.

Limpfisch's explanation makes sense. If he had shot Brooks in the parking lot it might have ruined the plan. Students in the commons might have run toward the windows (away from the propane bombs). Also, wasn't Neil Gardner in the parking lot eating lunch at the time? If so, it's possible Eric saw him that morning and didn't want to risk provoking a gunfight before the bombs went off.

runreilly wrote:

Limpfisch's explanation makes sense.  If he had shot Brooks in the parking lot it might have ruined the plan.  Students in the commons might have run toward the windows (away from the propane bombs).  Also, wasn't Neil Gardner in the parking lot eating lunch at the time?  If so, it's possible Eric saw him that morning and didn't want to risk provoking a gunfight before the bombs went off.

Neil was at the park eating. He had to race back to Columbine when he heard the call that someone was down in the parking lot.

Justjenna wrote:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] that makes a lot of sense.

I'd like to get a look at Brooks' school schedule to see whether it made sense for him to be outside of class at that time, smoking.

Why do you think Eric didn't shoot Brooks?

Because shooting Brooks would have ruined their plan. The plan was that they would not start shooting until the bombs went off and students starting running out of the school. He talked to Brooks somewhere between 11:15 - 11:18 AM. And I also think he didn't wanna shoot him. I know they had a feud in the past but the weeks before Columbine they were on better terms. They sat together in the senior class photo, Eric had gone out to lunch with Brooks. If it were the year before, then maybe he would have tried to shoot him but on that day, they were friends.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], something to help solidify this.....I think we should look at Brooks' class schedule. What time was he let out of his previous class to go on his smoke break?

Columbine_Video_Archives wrote:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], something to help solidify this.....I think we should look at Brooks' class schedule.  What time was he let out of his previous class to go on his smoke break?

I dont have a copy of his schedule. If it was released I am not aware of it nor have I seen it but I do know Brooks stated that it was routine for him to go and smoke during A lunch either outside the school or in the smoking pit.

Columbine_Video_Archives wrote:

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], something to help solidify this.....I think we should look at Brooks' class schedule.  What time was he let out of his previous class to go on his smoke break?

I've tried that. There is a roster for Philosophy class, but of course, it doesn't have the time on it.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

And then here is Eric's classes for the whole semester. Once again, no times on it. So Brooks' isn't gonna have the time on it either.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

And yea, that's another good point - Brooks says he saw Eric with a trench coat on. Well when Eric took the bomb in he didn't have a trench coat on, he had a flannel shirt on. And we know they wore the flannel because we saw Eric at the gas station with it on and we saw him in Columbine with it on. He didn't put the trench coat on until they went to the park to get ready.

The last piece to this puzzle is to find out what time that class ended.

Here's something from the 11k that [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] posted in another thread that lends credence to Brooks' statement that he spoke with Eric just prior to the shooting

001255: Stephanie stated that she was out at the "smoking pit" at 11:15-11:20 AM and that she had started to walk to the cafeteria when she heard an explosion, but didn't think anything of it because she thought it was a senior prank. Stephanie then stated that she saw Eric Harris at the top of the stairs talking to Brooks Brown. I asked Stephanie what Eric was wearing and she stated that he was in his black trench coat and black pants. [Then] Brooks went down the stairs and Eric pulled out a "BIG" gun and started shooting into the main hall doors. I asked Stephanie if she was sure that she had seen Brooks Brown and not someone else and she stated that she was sure. She was very scared and started running toward Clement Park, then once she got there she went home.

He got out of class at 11:10 (pg. 10661).

Broooks's story is credible because he accurately described Eric's bag. This detail was not available to the public for months so Brooks definitely saw Eric. He also tells the same story to everyone he meets that day, with small variations. See below.

After leaving class at 11:10, he either stood on the sidewalk (according to his book) or walked down to Pierce St and came back when he saw Eric pull in (which he says on 10670).

That places Eric's arrival at around 11:12-11:14. Their conversation was probably not more than a minute. Matthew Houk left the parking lot at 11:12 or 11:13 and saw Brooks walking south after he pulled out (6636).

Brooks says he was walking across the street from a block of housing construction when he heard the first shot. He must be referring to the homes on W Caley Place, which are listed as having been finished in 2000. This location is a 3 minute walk from where Eric was parked. So Brooks is placing the start of the shooting at the same time as the official timeline.

At this point he says he began to run until he reached a green generator. The only green generator is behind a house on the 6400 block of S Pierce Ct. This is a 2 minute walk past the housing construction site, but he says he was running.

Then he moves to the Dutch Creek Trail underpass, another 3 minutes, where he hears police cars moving overhead. Dispatch is 11:25, and Brooks probably hears the cars around 11:27 or 11:28, so he stayed in the overpass for a couple minutes.

At this point he runs west across a field to "the first house [he] saw," finds no answer, but then runs into Mrs. Taylor at a house on the 6500 block of S Teller Court. He describes it as the third house where he knocks on the door, but he would actually have had to pass 5 houses to get to Mrs. Taylor's. Mrs. Taylor says this happened at around 11:45, but it is probably closer to 11:40.

He calls his dad and then runs into two teachers, Rick Bath (6100) and Thomas Johnson (6688). He tells them the story about Eric and their account of his story is completely consistent with Brooks's later account to law enforcement and in his book. Eric, duffel bag, "I like you now," etc.

After other movements, he gets into a car with Ryan Shwayder (7129-7132), the next person Brooks saw, who told law enforcement he saw Brooks standing on Hoover Avenue east of the intersection between Hoover and Parkview (which is actually called Teller there but it quickly turns into Parkview). Along with Matthew Houk and Deanna Shaffer, Shwayder says they drove to a cul-de-sac that gave them a view of Clement Park, which could've been Weaver Pl, Walker Pl, or the ones off Polk. At 11:52 and 11:56 Brooks calls the police. He tells the police the same story he told Bath and Johnson, again divulging details that were not known to the public about Eric's bag and parking stop.

We cannot prove, "I like you now," but this looks to me looks like a great deal of corroboration of all the other elements of Brooks's story.

1998-1999 Daily Bell Schedule:

Regular Schedule

Period 1 7:30AM-8:20AM

Period 2 8:25AM-9:20AM

Period 3 9:25AM-10:15AM

Period 4 10:20AM-11:10AM

Period 5 11:15AM-11:45AM Lunch A, 11:50AM-12:40PM Class
 
Period 5 11:15AM-12:05PM Class, 12:10PM-12:40PM Lunch B  

Period 6 12:45PM-1:35PM

Period 7 1:40PM-2:30PM

Lunch A: Business, Foreign Language, Intervention Services, Language Arts, Social Studies, Technical Arts.

Lunch B: Art, Life Management, Math, Music, Physical Education, Science.

Eric/Dylan had Psychology together for Period 5 in the Spring 1999 semester therefore they were under Lunch A (Social Studies).

Their Lunch Break would be from 11:15AM-11:45AM & their Period 5 Class would be from 11:50AM-12:40PM.

Hope that helps clarify the times a little better.

Brooks Brown had Choir in Period 5 in the Spring 1999, thus he was under Lunch B (Music).

That means that Brooks would have had Class from 11:15AM-12:05PM & Lunch Break from 12:10PM-12:40PM.

So if Brooks did not skip his Choir Class, he would have been in the Choir Room on 4/20/99.

Pages 004886, 004896-004897, 005089 confirm Brooks Period 5 Choir Class.

I never knew he skipped the class before the massacre started. Am I understanding that right?

Columbine_Video_Archives wrote:

I never knew he skipped the class before the massacre started. Am I understanding that right?

yes he did. Other students mentioned he was not in class.

No, according to a sworn statement in the 11K Brooks attended all his classes.

Pg. 10670: 10:20 AM - 11:10 AM Attended Creative Writing Class

On pg. 2 of No Easy Answers he also states that he attended creative writing class.

lasttrain wrote:

No, according to a sworn statement in the 11K Brooks attended all his classes.

Pg. 10670: 10:20 AM - 11:10 AM Attended Creative Writing Class

On pg. 2 of No Easy Answers he also states that he attended creative writing class.

He went to creative writing but did not go to choir

lasttrain wrote:

No, according to a sworn statement in the 11K Brooks attended all his classes.

Pg. 10670: 10:20 AM - 11:10 AM Attended Creative Writing Class

On pg. 2 of No Easy Answers he also states that he attended creative writing class.

On page 3 of No Easy Answers he states that he went home after fourth period creative writing class and missed his last class.

We might never really know Brooks knew or saw something that he hasn't told, but his story definitely checks out.

I asked this earlier and I'm curious what you guys think:
Many of the 4/20 absences and cutting of classes by close friends seem convenient; especially considering NBK was apparently pushed back a day. The delay complicates matters if E&D specifically planned a date/time when they knew certain friends would be safe. I have a particularly hard time believing that E&D would have risked blowing up certain close friends like Robyn, Nate, Chris, Cory, Zach, etc.

Are any of you suspicious that some of E&D friends knew significantly more than they let on? Or perhaps some knew just enough to skip school or leave at the right time? If so, who? And what?